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Leeds Lad 17 Sexually Assaulted by Train Guard
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Just a shame Northern don't install CCTV on their units. Would be very useful indeed.
37401
Established Member
ew
WillPS
Established Member
On what evidence was this guilty verdict given?
I've been on the first Nottingham - Sheffield departure in the morning by myself a couple of times, other than CCTV, what other possible evidence could back me up? I guess the mobile phone thing, but still...
I've been on the first Nottingham - Sheffield departure in the morning by myself a couple of times, other than CCTV, what other possible evidence could back me up? I guess the mobile phone thing, but still...
Without access to the evidence, I'm going to guess that a combination of:
testimony of the station staff who would have seen the state the lad was in (emotionally)
medical evidence- specially trained doctors will, I guess, have examined the victim. Sexual assault will have left a lot of evidence- from bruising, tearing etc to DNA evidence.
CCTV if present?
The mobile thing would be supporting evidence.
testimony of the station staff who would have seen the state the lad was in (emotionally)
medical evidence- specially trained doctors will, I guess, have examined the victim. Sexual assault will have left a lot of evidence- from bruising, tearing etc to DNA evidence.
CCTV if present?
The mobile thing would be supporting evidence.
Same way freaks who rape grown women think they can get away with it.
I don't agree with it, but you can understand that more - an anonymous man, or commonly someone known to the victim, who knows the victim will keep quiet.
But to let them know where you work (and therefore in this case, what service they were working) is just pure stupidity on the guards part.
merlodlliw
Established Member
1.The guard is suspended on full pay I should imagine
2.He can not work lates or early shifts.
3.I imagine he will be sacked, unable to work contracted hours.
4.One wonders if this was the first time? terrable state of affairs, also the
sentence is suspended, however the MAN may also have an history,who knows.
2.He can not work lates or early shifts.
3.I imagine he will be sacked, unable to work contracted hours.
4.One wonders if this was the first time? terrable state of affairs, also the
sentence is suspended, however the MAN may also have an history,who knows.
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anthony263
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Dont all staff working ass conductors etc have to have a background check?
I know bus drivers, social workers & teachers etc have to so i cant see any reason why railway staff dont.
I know bus drivers, social workers & teachers etc have to so i cant see any reason why railway staff dont.
But a background check would only say that he hasn't done it (or been caught) in the past, it doesn't say anything about what he might do, which is the risk everyone takes with everyone they hire.
anthony263
Established Member
Yes that could be true.
merlodlliw
Established Member
The check is usually the young people and vunerable persons Police check
which is to change its name.
However if for example on his/her first day at work the check is clean,he/she
could commit a sin on day two until caught, a few know how to bypass the
check using a false name,NI,DOB etc, it also depends on what level of check
is being paid for. So in reality the check is only at that moment, not after.
One also has to ask why is the guard on on a suspended. Also I am sure some railway staff do have a Police check.
theblackwatch
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Depending on the nature of the assualt, there may not have been the evidence you suggest. However, there must have been some form of evidence presented for jury to reach the verdict they did. Newspapers very rarely publish the full facts on cases.
I'm amazed that someone guilty of sexual assault actually comes off the Sex Offenders Register after 10 years - surely they should be on it for life?
Well as you stated yourself, it would depend on the nature of the assault. For all we know it could of been clothed groping and nothing more (I'm not saying it is acceptable if it was).
Which guy and to ask what?
There is a reason why they aren't used by the police and courts, despite what Jeremy Kyle might like to tell people, they are wildly inaccurate.
CallySleeperKid
Member
Shocking. I use the Northern service from Langley Mill to Sheffield and it just makes you think if that guard ever checked my tickets. I cant believe this kind of thing could happen, but then again, look at the state this country is in, nothing surprises me, no matter how bad it is!
There's none.
It is quite possible that, when confronted, the perp actually admitted what he had done. This might explain the suspended sentence
Again, this depends on the case. But, as it is part of a sentence, it can be considered as "served" after a time, like a prison sentence, and the man is rehabiliated.
As one who lives in Ilkley (on this line) and the father of a 17-year old daughter, this is shocking and scaring. What will I do? Nothing. This does not mean that trains are any more unsafe than anywhere else. The man could have been a greengrocer, policeman, vicar or bookseller. The fact is that this sort of thing has always happened (though it is more widely reported these days). The best defence is to show our children how to deal with it effectively, not to place further restrictions on them.
CallySleeperKid
Member
Well said.
Paedophilia has always been an issue - it's nothing new.
IMO we need to stop punishing them with prison and other nonsense like that, but work out exactly what the issues are behind it - it seems very different from other forms of crime.
IMO we need to stop punishing them with prison and other nonsense like that, but work out exactly what the issues are behind it - it seems very different from other forms of crime.
asylumxl
Established Member
The guy came from a night out. Was alcohol involved?
Why did he give him his mobile number? Doesn't add up to me.
I don't trust these kind of cases. There's a lot of vindictive lying people in the world, and it's very hard to decide who to trust.
Why did he give him his mobile number? Doesn't add up to me.
I don't trust these kind of cases. There's a lot of vindictive lying people in the world, and it's very hard to decide who to trust.
A 17 year old man is hardly a child below the age of consent who has not yet started puberty. I agree with the rest of your post about finding underlying causes, but it doesn't apply to this case.
Guard sees attractive (in his eyes) young man. Guard goes beyond the acceptable boundaries, and THAT is what he got punished for, not for being a paedophile.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Alcohol (or even drugs) could have been involved. It is possible the young man was under the influence and therefore the guard tried his luck - we just don't know.
To be honest if I was in his situation I suspect that I would give him my mobile number if I felt he wouldn't release the doors until I did. It is easy to change your number afterwards, it is not so easy to remove mental scars. Seems a perfectly reasonable thing to do.
I agree about not knowing who to trust and that there are vindictive people about. From the little we have been told, and from the small sentence given, my gut feeling is that the guard touched or groped the young man inappropriately and nothing more.
Thanks ukrob, I was about to say pretty much the same thing. While it sounds like what the guard did was inappropriate and he deserves to be punished appropriately, it doesn't sound like there was ever an allegation of rape, and it says the guard asked if the passenger 'liked it' - sounds like groping to me.
We are talking about a 17 year old, so he was probably still learning how to handle alcohol, and discovering his sexuality, be he straight, gay or whatever. But definitely over the age of consent. We don't know how the passenger behaved - did he encourage the guard or not? Why did he give the guard his real phone number, and why did the guard think something might come from ringing it?
The quote from the judge mentions the position of authority of the guard - would there have been any complaint if the same actions were performed by someone the passenger had left a gay club with?
I'm not trying to defend the guard, nor call the passenger gay. I simply don't know from a short article. I trust the judge gave a fair sentance and hope that both parties are able to lead normal, happy lives.
We are talking about a 17 year old, so he was probably still learning how to handle alcohol, and discovering his sexuality, be he straight, gay or whatever. But definitely over the age of consent. We don't know how the passenger behaved - did he encourage the guard or not? Why did he give the guard his real phone number, and why did the guard think something might come from ringing it?
The quote from the judge mentions the position of authority of the guard - would there have been any complaint if the same actions were performed by someone the passenger had left a gay club with?
I'm not trying to defend the guard, nor call the passenger gay. I simply don't know from a short article. I trust the judge gave a fair sentance and hope that both parties are able to lead normal, happy lives.
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