King's Cross signalling question.

[102 fan]

I was watching a video on trains at King's Cross. I noticed the signal number boards had a YA code. What signalling centre is that?

Thanks.

 

[swt_passenger]

I was watching a video on trains at King's Cross. I noticed the signal number boards had a YA code. What signalling centre is that?

Thanks.

York ROC since the remodelling In Apr 2021

 

[102 fan]

York ROC since the remodelling.

I didn't know York ROC covered that distance! Just out of curiosity, I assume there was Signal Box or boxes covering King's Cross at one point?

 

[swt_passenger]

I didn't know York ROC covered that distance! Just out of curiosity, I assume there was Signal Box or boxes covering King's Cross at one point?

Coverage isn’t continuous, there are still other conventional signal centres in between, Peterborough and Doncaster at least?

I‘m not that familiar with the exact route signalling history, but the immediate Kings Cross area was previously operated from a 1970s “box” which is still standing beside the entrance to the newly reopened tunnel.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

York ROC will eventually control much of the ECML from King's Cross northwards.
The remodelling of King's Cross last year was the start of the transfer of control.
YA is the reference for the first panel in York ROC; we might expect YB, YC etc further north as the resignalling (in readiness for ETCS) progresses northwards.
The old King's Cross panel controls as far as Biggleswade, and I believe it still does so beyond the immediate King's Cross environs.
The transfer process is likely to take a decade to complete.

 

[Bertone]

The Kings Cross track layout was extensively remodelled in the 1970’s and a new Power Signal Box was opened in 1977.
This box controlled the main line to Sandy, the Cambridge branch to Royston and the Moorgate branch from Finsbury Park to Moorgate.
Interestingly, this 1970’s remodelling “closed” one of the three bores of Gas Works tunnel, which has now been reinstated in the most recent track and signalling arrangements.

 

[swt_passenger]

York ROC will eventually control much of the ECML from King's Cross northwards.
The remodelling of King's Cross last year was the start of the transfer of control.
YA is the reference for the first panel in York ROC; we might expect YB, YC etc further north as the resignalling (in readiness for ETCS) progresses northwards.
The old King's Cross panel controls as far as Biggleswade, and I believe it still does so beyond the immediate King's Cross environs.
The transfer process is likely to take a decade to complete.

The current sectional appendix however shows everything between Kings Cross and Biggleswade including Moorgate and the Hertford loop is already controlled by York ROC. Kings Cross PSB closed fully during last years remodelling.

 

[edwin_m]

The current sectional appendix however shows everything between Kings Cross and Biggleswade including Moorgate and the Hertford loop is already controlled by York ROC. Kings Cross PSB closed fully during last years remodelling.

Beyond the immediate Kings Cross area, has it just been re-controlled from York with no changes at the trackside? It would make sense to leave it alone until the ETCS scheme replaces it.

 

[swt_passenger]

Beyond the immediate Kings Cross area, has it just been re-controlled from York with no changes at the trackside? It would make sense to leave it alone until the ETCS scheme replaces it.

Yes that’s what I’ve just gleaned from a couple of earlier threads. It’s apparently only in the area of last years project where all the new signals are now plated YA.

 

[Gloster]

A quick check of recent copies of the Signalling Record Society’s Signalling Record says that most of the area (Kings Cross, Finsbury Park and Wood Green work stations) was taken over by York on 26 April 2021. Platforms 7 to 10 out to Belle Isle Junction on E & F lines followed on 7 June.

EDIT: I think this saw the closure of Kings Cross Panel.

 

[swt_passenger]

A quick check of recent copies of the Signalling Record Society’s Signalling Record says that most of the area (Kings Cross, Finsbury Park and Wood Green work stations) was taken over by York on 26 April 2021. Platforms 7 to 10 out to Belle Isle Junction on E & F lines followed on 7 June.

EDIT: I think this saw the closure of Kings Cross Panel.

It did, hence my first reply, which was based on the discussions we had in the remodelling thread at that time.

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

Not sure that ARS has been provided though given some of the poor regulating decisions that are made over Welywn viaduct section suggesting that the signallers from KX didn't want to relocate to York.

 

[Freightmaster]

Yes that’s what I’ve just gleaned from a couple of earlier threads. It’s apparently only in the area of last years project where all the new signals are now plated YA.

The Moorgate branch is being resignalled over the May Day weekend - the signals will all be renumbered
and replated 'YA' signals when it reopens next Tuesday!




MARK

 

[swt_passenger]

The Moorgate branch is being resignalled over the May Day weekend - the signals will all be renumbered
and replated 'YA' signals when it reopens next Tuesday!


MARK

That’s what you call an up to the minute update…

 

[Bald Rick]

Beyond the immediate Kings Cross area, has it just been re-controlled from York with no changes at the trackside? It would make sense to leave it alone until the ETCS scheme replaces it.

much of the old KX PSB area had already been relocked

 

[jon0844]

Not sure that ARS has been provided though given some of the poor regulating decisions that are made over Welywn viaduct section suggesting that the signallers from KX didn't want to relocate to York.

York signallers will be working out everything from King's Cross up to the viaduct and beyond, and decisions during disruption on what needs to go where, (not to/)stop orders etc, will be made by someone based at York who will liaise with the ROC at Three Bridges.

The next signalling move will be on the Peterborough line and ever closer to York, which I believe takes place before the switchover to ETCS on the mainline.

 

[Freightmaster]

The next signalling move will be on the Peterborough line and ever closer to York, which I believe takes place before the switchover to ETCS on the mainline.

Closure of Peterborough PSB is planned for next Summer.




MARK

 

[bramling]

York signallers will be working out everything from King's Cross up to the viaduct and beyond, and decisions during disruption on what needs to go where, (not to/)stop orders etc, will be made by someone based at York who will liaise with the ROC at Three Bridges.

The next signalling move will be on the Peterborough line and ever closer to York, which I believe takes place before the switchover to ETCS on the mainline.

There was definitely a noticeable change when control passed over. Didn’t take long to get back to normality as far as I could tell.

 

[jon0844]

There was definitely a noticeable change when control passed over. Didn’t take long to get back to normality as far as I could tell.

The timings on the current Saturday+ timetable doesn't allow for much disruption before everything falls apart, so I hope they can fix it all by mid-May. The new 9Yxx services stand to cause much fun and games!

 

[Mcq]

The Moorgate branch is being resignalled over the May Day weekend - the signals will all be renumbered
and replated 'YA' signals when it reopens next Tuesday!




MARK

Noticed Moorgate branch closed again this weekend - does this complete the conversion to ECTS to Finsbury Park as well?
If not does anyone know when that will happen?

 

[buz33]

The quote from Toufic Machnouk in this Network Rail press release suggests that ETCS will be happening at a later stage.

Northern City Line enters new phase as East Coast Digital Programme prepares to commission new equipment

Removal of 45 year old equipment and commissioning of new will take place over Bank Holiday weekend Changes to services between Finsbury Park and Moorgate Passengers urged to plan their journeys ahead of time

www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk

I notice that signal maps has been updated with YA signals on the Northern City line which would also suggest that colour light signals will still be around.

Signal Maps

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signalmaps.co.uk

 

[norbitonflyer]

The Kings Cross track layout was extensively remodelled in the 1970’s and a new Power Signal Box was opened in 1977.
This box controlled the main line to Sandy, the Cambridge branch to Royston and the Moorgate branch from Finsbury Park to Moorgate.
Interestingly, this 1970’s remodelling “closed” one of the three bores of Gas Works tunnel, which has now been reinstated in the most recent track and signalling arrangements.

The closure of the easternmost bore of Gasworks Tunnel was to make way for the dedicated high speed rail link to Maplin Airport. Neither the railway nor the airport were ever built.

 

[snowball]

The eastern bore of Copenhagen tunnel was closed at much the same time. Google satellite view appears to show a contractor's access road or haul road going through it. Was this for last year's works?

Google Maps

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[swt_passenger]

The eastern bore of Copenhagen tunnel was closed at much the same time. Google satellite view appears to show a contractor's access road or haul road going through it. Was this for last year's works?

Google Maps

Find local businesses, view maps and get driving directions in Google Maps.

www.google.co.uk

The access road was already there, NR previously used it for access it all the way down to Kings Cross.



== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 2 May 2022 ==

The closure of the easternmost bore of Gasworks Tunnel was to make way for the dedicated high speed rail link to Maplin Airport. Neither the railway nor the airport were ever built.

The proposed airport link didn’t use the eastern Gasworks tunnel bore, it would have been north of the canal on the goods yard site. There’s a short thread about it here, it includes part of a 1977 Modern Railways article:

Kings Cross to Maplin/Stansted 1970s airport link proposals

AlbertBeale said: What route was thought up for getting from KX out to Southend? There's no obvious connection I can think of, and surely they wouldn't have been thinking of tunnelling under half of London from the KX area back in those days?? Potentially getting very off topic for the current...

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