• Our new ticketing site is now live! Using either this or the original site (both powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

Interrail - Staff denied access to platform, then tried to throw us off train!

yorkie

Forum Staff
Staff Member
Administrator
Joined
6 Jun 2005
Messages
78,552
Location
Yorkshire
at the age of 85 its unlikely, but one thing I have learned is that it’s best to be a bit forgiving unless you yoursellf are a paragon of virtue
Ex railway then, or failing that, certainly ex buses as your contempt for passengers was stated in another thread. No ordinary member if the public would support staff who behave in this way without indoctrination.

Yes, it is indeed best to be "forgiving", which staff in such roles would do well to bear in mind when considering how to treat passengers, especially to holders of high value passes, customers with reduced mobility, etc.

But even if the original poster had held an invalid off peak ticket, there is no excuse for being impolite. The behaviour by the staff member was unacceptable and only an indoctrinated individual would attempt to defend, condone or deflect from such behaviour.

As for your point of being forgiving towards staff who behave badly, I would be forgiving of staff who get things wrong if they were doing so without fundamentally being rude, obnoxious or obstructive towards passengers, or stating incorrect information as 'fact'.

People such as the staff member the original poster encountered have no place doing the job for which I quoted excepts from the job description above, and the fact that this behaviour is not uncommon demonstrates deep rooted cultural problems and a lack of proper training, background checks and safeguards in the rail industry.

While I understand you have worked in areas where such behaviour by employees may be considered acceptable, it absolutely is not acceptable anywhere else, and I would fully expect to be sacked if I had behaved in the manner described towards customers in any of the jobs I have done.
Assuming an origin of London Terminals, there are numerous time restrictions for off-peak journeys from Marylebone. The most common ones:
  • Stations to West Ruislip/Amersham (i.e. Zones 1-9): London area, so there are only punitive Anytime fares for these journeys to encourage customers to use Contactless or Oyster Pay As You Go.
  • Denham/Great Missenden - Aylesbury Vale Parkway inclusive: Oval area. Off-Peak from 0930, PM Peak between 1600 and 1900.
  • Haddenham & Thame Parkway - Oxford/Bicester North: Off-Peak from 0830.
  • Kings Sutton and beyond: No peak restrictions leaving London when using a ticket priced by Chiltern. Tickets priced by Avanti broadly follow Chiltern's Super Off-Peak restrictions and aren't valid leaving Marylebone before 0900 nor between 1600 and 1900.

If a Freedom Pass is involved, those aren't valid before 0900 on services via Amersham (except Disabled Persons Freedom Passes, which are valid all day) or before 0930 on services via High Wycombe.
I hope mystery shopping takes place to ensure staff are behaving appropriately. If I lived in London I would put it to the test myself, as I don't trust train companies to have sufficient checks and safeguards in place.
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

jumble

Established Member
Joined
1 Jul 2011
Messages
1,501
Want to get the forum experts' opinion on an issue I had yesterday, to see whether it's worth my while making a formal complaint to the TOC involved or Interrail, or whether it'll just end up causing me more grief:

After travelling around Europe with my wife on Interrail passes with no issues, we arrived back at a London Terminus on our 'inbound travel leg,' at the end of the evening peak. Won't name the exact location or TOC for now.
We thought we had just missed a train home so put the next one into the Rail Planner App and added it to our passes.

15 mins before the train was due, went to the barrier and asked to be let through (as in my experience, the gates don't accept the pass), but was refused as the train listed on the pass was not given a platform yet. "I can't let you through until this one goes".

Eventually after some persuasion, the gateline staff member grudgingly let us through so my wife (who is mobility impaired) could sit on the seats on the platform to wait, but not without some serious 'attitude' from the staff member.

Upon arriving at the platform, we realised that the train we thought we'd missed was delayed and was still sat in the platform. We got on, stowed our luggage, found a bit of standing space in the packed train and updated our passes with the alternate journey via Rail Planner.
No problem, so we thought, bit of good lock.

Instead, a different member of staff comes running up the platform to the door we boarded at, demanding that we get off the train because our tickets weren't valid. He'd obviously been sent by the grumpy gateline staff member who'd decided to keep an eye on us and had seen us board.
Despite showing him the updated journey on our passes, he still kept insisting that we get off. When we refused, he then insisted that Interrail passes weren't valid during the peak (complete rubbish!).
When we still refused to move, he first threatened us with BTP, then that the train wouldn't go anywhere until we got off, and finally that the guard would charge us full price tickets. (Actually, the train wasn't going anywhere because the train crew were delayed on an inbound working!).

Eventually, after the repeated threats and shouting, he finally gave up and the train finally left about 20mins late once the crew showed up.
The whole experience left us deeply upset and angry, we had tickets that were valid, we were packed onto a delayed, full & standing train, and just wanted to get home, while being subjected to looks from other passengers who thought we were fare evading or the cause of the delay!

During the trip, there was no sign of the guard and the barriers were open at our destination so no issues there (though in practice, the staff there tend to be much more friendly and accommodating anyway!).

My understanding here is that what we did was perfectly valid, and it was due to the staff member not fully understanding the rules around Interrail and deciding to make up the 'not valid in peak' restriction, that we had this issue.
However I can easily see someone who was less confident of how Interrail passes work being bullied to get off the train and made to wait for the later one, or even issued with an invalid MG11.

I therefore want to complain to the TOC about the behaviour of their staff and their lack of training, but I'm concerned that by positively identifying myself, this might actually lead to more serious repercussions as I'm aware there are a number of grey areas:
  • Was the staff member right to deny us access through the gateline (it's a shared gateline with access to all platforms, and the pass would be valid on any of the trains from that station)?
  • Were we technically in the wrong updating Rail Planner after boarding instead of before (not that the app actually shows the time that the journey list was updated anyway)? The passes were still correct well before departure.
  • Would we be, legally, required to get off the train as ordered by the obnoxious staff member even though we had tickets that were perfectly valid?
I also travel through the station semi-regularly, so don't want any hassle from the same staff in future.

Keen to hear the thoughts from experts here as to whether a complaint is worthwhile, and whether it would be best to send to the TOC or Interrail.

Of course, in an ideal world, the gateline staff member should have said "Actually, the previous train to your destination is still in the platform, update your passes and feel free to hop on", but that would expect a level of staff training that would only be provided in an actual 'customer-focused' railway.
I wouldnt bother frankly if my experiences are anything to go by
Chiltern cancelled some TOD tickets without telling me and I was unable to print them
Customer services claimed that Chiltern were unable to determine what happened and simply refunded
(Perhaps they thought I was so stupid that it would not occur to me that this not going to be true as per compliance requirements etc)
I sent an email to someone right at the top who I will not name which was confirmed as received throug an SAR but they did not have the manners to even reply
It is hard to come to any other conclusion except that Chiltern top management couldnt care less and I doubt they will care about your experience

(Ialso understand that there are some good people at Chiltern who care very much about their profession but not necessarly in a position to address such issues)
 
Last edited:

saismee

Established Member
Joined
20 Oct 2023
Messages
1,762
Location
UK
I hope mystery shopping takes place to ensure staff are behaving appropriately. If I lived in London I would put it to the test myself, as I don't trust train companies to have sufficient checks and safeguards in place.
Mystery shopping happens but definitely not frequently enough. In my experience, you can tell when you've been mystery shopped afterwards but not during, so it should be relatively accurate. For context, I have had only one in the nearly 1.5 years I have worked full-time. 100% of course :D
 

sammyg901

Member
Joined
24 Mar 2009
Messages
445
Assuming an origin of London Terminals, there are numerous time restrictions for off-peak journeys from Marylebone. The most common ones:
  • Stations to West Ruislip/Amersham (i.e. Zones 1-9): London area, so there are only punitive Anytime fares for these journeys to encourage customers to use Contactless or Oyster Pay As You Go.
  • Denham/Great Missenden - Aylesbury Vale Parkway inclusive: Oval area. Off-Peak from 0930, PM Peak between 1600 and 1900.
  • Haddenham & Thame Parkway - Oxford/Bicester North: Off-Peak from 0830.
  • Kings Sutton and beyond: No peak restrictions leaving London when using a ticket priced by Chiltern. Tickets priced by Avanti broadly follow Chiltern's Super Off-Peak restrictions and aren't valid leaving Marylebone before 0900 nor between 1600 and 1900.

If a Freedom Pass is involved, those aren't valid before 0900 on services via Amersham (except Disabled Persons Freedom Passes, which are valid all day) or before 0930 on services via High Wycombe.
She said it having glanced at the ticket in a manner that strongly suggested she hadn't given it any thought in a tone often encountered at other stations. I was surprised as you cover , many common destinations using a paper ticket at that time of day (Bicester etc) are OK from 0830
 
Last edited:

philthetube

Established Member
Joined
5 Jan 2016
Messages
4,199

Eventually after some persuasion, the gateline staff member grudgingly let us through so my wife (who is mobility impaired) could sit on the seats on the platform to wait

found a bit of standing space
As a member of staff the feeling that I had been played, regardless of the wrongs and rights of the situation would get my back up.
 

Starmill

Veteran Member
Joined
18 May 2012
Messages
27,357
Location
Bolton
As a member of staff the feeling that I had been played, regardless of the wrongs and rights of the situation would get my back up.
OK, reasonable, but nobody had been "played". The customer had the correct ticket for their journey and wasn't trying to board after the doors were closed. So...
 

Tetchytyke

Veteran Member
Joined
12 Sep 2013
Messages
17,654
Location
Isle of Man
Except they only changed it after they had boarded and stowed their bags, so technically boarded without a valid ticket.
There’s no way the staff member knew that. And, even if you wish to take such a ridiculous and reductionist view, “I got off, changed it, then got back on” covers all the bases. Unless the doors have closed and the train has started moving, who’s to say?

It very much reads to me like Little Miss Gateline Gob****e was just making her own rules up. Sadly not uncommon on the railway.

As a member of staff the feeling that I had been played, regardless of the wrongs and rights of the situation would get my back up.
The staff member was wrong in the first instance, and everything followed on from there.

Customer facing roles are challenging enough- I know, I’ve done a few in my time- without making life hard for yourself. She wasn’t played.

I note that the OP and their wife appear to be older people with mobility issues. I bet Little Miss Gateline Gob****e wouldn’t have done this to, say, a strapping six foot rugby player in his early 20s.

They’re not at Euston levels of obnoxiousness but I’ve had issues with the MYB gateline staff too.
 

AdamWW

Established Member
Joined
6 Nov 2012
Messages
6,031
Personally I'd chalk it up to experience and move on.

I use global interrail passes fairly regularly (always the paper version rather than electronic). In France I've been told it's not valid as I haven't had it stamped at the booking office prior to travel, in Belgium just this week I was told it I hadn't validated it when I had (it's a flexi pass and the date was written in as required), and on LNER on my return home journey I've been told it's not valid in my own country (even though it's a global pass and my return home journey).

I've always stood my ground as you did. It's an annoyance but you can't change the fact that some staff don't fully understand it.

I had a Danish (if I recall correctly) guard claim my paper pass was invalid as I hadn't filled in my address.
This was very clearly only there so that if you posted the pass off to them at the end as they asked you, it could be returned to you.
He said lots of passengers made the same mistake....perhaps he should have asked himself why.
Fortunately he was in a generous mood and let me off my severe infraction so long as I wrote it in on the spot.

I also had to educate someone on a UK barrier line who thought all Interrail passes were flexi-passes and wasn't happy that I hadn't filled in the day's date. Fortunately they were happy to believe me when I explained - perhaps the lack of anywhere to write a date helped.

i am not surprised the staff were cross, having talked their way onto the platform so they could rest they promptly boarded the very train their ticket was not valid for

The whole point of an interrail pass is the flexibility. They did absolutely nothing wrong by deciding to catch the previous train when they realised it was there.

And given that flexibility, I'm not sure what was gained by denying access through the gateline in the first place.
 

Adam Williams

Established Member
Joined
2 Jan 2018
Messages
3,626
Location
Warks
And given that flexibility, I'm not sure what was gained by denying access through the gateline in the first place.
I think some of them genuinely enjoy wasting passenger time and exercising their "authority". Certainly the impression I've got from some personal experiences, and experiences of Raileasy customers.

I had one attendant at Marylebone swap a gate from entry mode to exit mode whilst I was using it, just to prevent me going through the gate (I had previously had a run-in with him and complained about his poor understanding of ticketing, so I guess this was his way of getting "his own back") and force me to pick another one. Petty as f**k really, and it was incredibly obvious what he'd just done. Lots of them really need to grow up.

The problem is it's a low-paid job. If you pay peanuts, you get monkeys.
 

Swedenorer

Member
Joined
28 Sep 2025
Messages
342
Location
Hants
When Off Peak has more than one meaning as it seems to here - see Post #34 - then it is not only the staff training which is poor it's the fare system too.
 

AlterEgo

Verified Rep - Wingin' It! Paul Lucas
Joined
30 Dec 2008
Messages
29,683
Location
LBK
When Off Peak has more than one meaning as it seems to here - see Post #34 - then it is not only the staff training which is poor it's the fare system too.
Not at all. The system is better for having varying appropriate definitions of off peak. Consider how "not before 0930" affects longer journeys for example.
 

saismee

Established Member
Joined
20 Oct 2023
Messages
1,762
Location
UK
Cashiers learning a relatively small number of specific prices, almost certainly set in a policy making them easy to remember, are a different beast from a complex series of rules that require judgment to be applied correctly.
It's also going to be much easier to spot a poorly-trained cashier when the customers are being under/overcharged, compared to a passenger being delayed a bit and sending their complaint into the aether. Sacking a member of rail staff is also a very big pain even when it's clear that they need sacking, it seems.

I had one attendant at Marylebone swap a gate from entry mode to exit mode whilst I was using it, just to prevent me going through the gate (I had previously had a run-in with him and complained about his poor understanding of ticketing, so I guess this was his way of getting "his own back") and force me to pick another one. Petty as f**k really, and it was incredibly obvious what he'd just done. Lots of them really need to grow up.
I've switched gates on passengers by mistake many times, but it has always been a mistake which I have rectified as best as possible by dashing over and apologising and pointing it out. I had a colleague switch all the gates to the opposite direction to their friend to mess with them (there were no other passengers). People who do things like that don't tend to pass their probation period, as this colleague found out.

The problem is it's a low-paid job. If you pay peanuts, you get monkeys.
The salary for gateline staff at London terminals is much, much higher than other stations, and I wouldn't say I'm paid terribly at my regional station. It certainly could be higher, but it's more than a pound over national living wage now.

If you can get cashiers to do that, how hard could it actually be to train staff on the basics of rail ticketing (e.g. what's off peak depends on the ticket not the service, break of journey is allowed on flexible tickets and you can continue on a different day etc.....)?
Our SCU has a laminated piece of paper with restriction times for local stations, and I could list them off the top of my head now. The training I was given stressed that cross-London journeys have different off-peak restrictions. It isn't necessarily the training, but the willingness of the member of staff to retain the information they are given.
 

Top