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Inter City 225 -v- Pendolino: your views as a passenger?

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Harlesden

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Never having experienced a journey on a Pendolino, I'd be interested to know how experienced travellers rate it in comparison to the Inter City 225.
General ambience, leg room, proportion of airline seats to table seats, catering.
The Pendolino is an Italian train although the ones in use in the UK are supposedly custom designed. Does this relate only to the reduced width?
 
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GrimsbyPacer

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Intercity 225 are the best design in everyway way.
The only problem is that the 225's 140mph top speed and tilting abillity aren't used, and the doors aren't automatic.
Pendolinoes have less space and smaller windows.
 

cjmillsnun

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There is no contest.

I'd be on a 225 in preference to a Pendo.

General ambience, the Mk4 has bigger windows, giving a better view outside with more seats having a view.

Leg room I find the Pendo cramped and the Mk4 comfortable.

Proportion of each type of seat is similar IMO and the catering is similar.

Plus the fact that the Pendo can have an overpowering smell of sewage in the cabin, although the Mk4s have a nasty habit of spraying people on the platform when the CET tanks get full.
 

sprinterguy

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The only problem is that the 225's 140mph top speed and tilting abillity aren't used, and the doors aren't automatic.
The mark 4s don't have a tilting ability (the type had potential for tilt to be fitted as designed) and the doors are automatic.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
The Pendolino is an Italian train although the ones in use in the UK are supposedly custom designed. Does this relate only to the reduced width?
The interior design, in terms of seats, lights and panelling was also closely specified by Virgin to give a homogenous appearance across their Voyager and Pendolino trains.
 

cjmillsnun

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Intercity 225 are the best design in everyway way.
The only problem is that the 225's 140mph top speed and tilting abillity aren't used, and the doors aren't automatic.
Pendolinoes have less space and smaller windows.

To be fair, the Pendo's 140mph top speed isn't used, and the 225 cannot tilt without modification to the coaches (they have non tilt bogies)
 

backontrack

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I hate Pendolinos with a vengeance. Cramped, sockets at tables only, and hardly any windows. I seem to spend all the journeys I have on them with a view of plastic, and that's with reservations. Pendolinos are also noiser, and have less luggage storage.
 

yorkguy

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I hate Pendolinos with a vengeance. Cramped, sockets at tables only, and hardly any windows. I seem to spend all the journeys I have on them with a view of plastic, and that's with reservations. Pendolinos are also noiser, and have less luggage storage.

Agree totally. I hate the way the seats don't line up with the windows. I can also feel quite queasy if I'm looking down reading on the really curvy sections. I've seen some people be quite travel sick on them.
 

RichmondCommu

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Agree totally. I hate the way the seats don't line up with the windows. I can also feel quite queasy if I'm looking down reading on the really curvy sections. I've seen some people be quite travel sick on them.

Well either you've seen them throwing up or you haven't.

I don't have a problem with the Pendolino's and they are a huge improvement on what came before. I concur that power sockets are few and far between but a re-fit could easily solve that, just like it did with the 225's.

In terms of seating layout I'd rather have a seat than a view and like many people who travel by train I seldom look out the window.
 

backontrack

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Agree totally. I hate the way the seats don't line up with the windows. I can also feel quite queasy if I'm looking down reading on the really curvy sections. I've seen some people be quite travel sick on them.

Agreed. I have felt seasick on them occasionally, and my father gets very nauseous and headachy.
 

yorkie

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Well either you've seen them throwing up or you haven't.
Feeling sick, or in this case specifically travel sick, doesn't necessarily mean throwing up. I think you have misunderstood.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
There is no contest.

I'd be on a 225 in preference to a Pendo.....
I completely agree.

The lack of power sockets at Pendolinos (in Standard class, I believe they're only at tables) is most surprising for a modern train providing long distance 'InterCity' services in 2015.
 

RichmondCommu

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Feeling sick, or in this case specifically travel sick, doesn't necessarily mean throwing up. I think you have misunderstood.

In that case how could you tell if someone was suffering from travel sickness unless the evidence was there for all to see?
 
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ginge8991

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I was on a pendolino fairly recently and I was seated in a bay with two seats, on the inside, there was a plug socket with a laptop symbol sticker next to it, is this a fairly recent addition?
 

DarloRich

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Firstly, why not take a trip to Euston and have a run to MK and decide for yourself otherwise you are making judgement based on opinion. That said I will however happily give you mine which you are free to agree with or disagree with as you see fit:

They are crap.

The seats are awful: Thin, narrow and seemingly designed to cut of circulation. After about 90 minutes they are uncomfortable in my view. The leg room seems poor, certainly beneath one of the few tables. The window frame seems to intrude into your sitting space and be designed in such a way that you can’t, comfortably, rest your arm in the gap!

There is a dearth of plugs in standard class ( perhaps because there construction straddled the period between on train radio and mobile/tablet devices?) far too many of the seats offer you a view of white plastic land and the lighting is dingy, dark and cave like while the colours used inside do nothing to brighten things up. The amount of natural light allowed in through the vision slits is terrible and the whole carriage always seems dingy ( yet the ones in Europe aren’t!) There is no luggage room, the overhead rack is a joke & they also seem disproportionately noisy!

I am certain for the TOC a pendolino is a fantastic machine. Quick, speedy, reliable, cheaper to run, easier to maintain, easier to operate, easier to timetable etc etc. However in all of this wondrous progress the designers forgot one element: passenger comfort!

Now I am sure the moderistas, especially those with little experience of travelling on a real train or in standard class, will be along soon to mock the rest of us for our dinosaur like views and explain how fantastic a pendo really is.

Decide for yourself.
 

Bletchleyite

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I'm going to be different. Pendolino every time. The Mk4 seats hurt my back. Change the seats for something different such as the fGW HST ones and I will immediately change my mind.
 

najaB

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... the lighting is dingy, dark and cave like while the colours used inside do nothing to brighten things up....
It's interesting that another member was recently praising the Pendolino as having the perfect lighting levels. Just goes so show.
 

Bletchleyite

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FWIW some of us like the low light levels in the Pendolino - to me they at relaxing and classy. If you want more light you have a personal reading light you can use - no need for everyone to put up with the preference of those who would prefer dentists chair lighting.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
It's interesting that another member was recently praising the Pendolino as having the perfect lighting levels. Just goes so show.


That would be me - absolutely spot on. Subdued, background fluorescent light combined with classy warm white spots over the aisle and personal reading lights if you want more. And I really like the deep, rich colours of the interior.

But then that's how my house is as well, I can't stand magnolia (yet so many people seem to have it) and like subdued spot lighting a lot. Shows how not everyone agrees.
 

Saint66

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I really like both the Pendo, and the 225, to be honest.

I am much more regularly on a 225 than Pendo, and the 225 is probably more comfortable, and has a bit more leg room, however, for me, especially for runs up to New Street from Birmingham, personally, the Pendolino does do the job, and I have no problem with it.

Though, at the end of the day, they both do what I need, and I don't have any complaints.
 

DarloRich

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FWIW some of us like the low light levels in the Pendolino - to me they at relaxing and classy. If you want more light you have a personal reading light you can use - no need for everyone to put up with the preference of those who would prefer dentists chair lighting.

well you are wrong arent you ;) I find it very difficult to read, especially after dark, even with the much vaunted "personal reading light"

what is "dentists chair lighting" supposed to mean anyway? I want a decent qaulity of lighting not some antiseptic glare!
 

Ash Bridge

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I'm a bit embarrassed to say this, but the last (and only time) I've travelled on a 225 was back in 1990 from York to Edinburgh, and although I do remember being impressed at the time it wouldn't be fair for me to compare it to a 390 with which I have had much more recent experience of.

Putting passenger comfort aside though, one thing I would have thought that would be in the Pendolino's favour is crashworthiness?
 

Bletchleyite

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what is "dentists chair lighting" supposed to mean anyway? I want a decent qaulity of lighting not some antiseptic glare!


GWR HST Standard Class, or indeed anywhere else they specified "daylight white" which is an utterly horrible colour taken from the tones of a miserable cloudy day. It is suitable for low energy functional outdoor lighting. It has absolutely no role anywhere else.
 

87015

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They are crap.
Is the correct answer.

For what should have been a flagship fleet built from a blank piece of paper they are a complete letdown the moment you step inside and probably the worse comparable trainset in Europe.
 
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Bletchleyite

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I really don't agree. I would replace the seats and change the layout slightly to give better window alignment, putting luggage racks in the completely blank spaces. I really wouldn't change a lot else. They are a good solid workhorse.

I do wonder what seats FirstGroup were going to use. They could have made them very nice indeed.
 

43096

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IC225 wins it by a very long way.

Pendolinos are quite the most vile InterCity trains ever built. Badly specified, badly designed, and badly built they should be on a one-way trip to Booths. Among the issues with them:
- windows too small
- "window" seats with a large expanse of plastic alongside (anyone fancy testing "window seat" reservation in such seats with Trading Standards?)
- lighting too dim
- horrible beige plastic feel to them
- poor build quality with rattling panels
- seats that give me back and neck ache within about 20mins

They represent the headlong dash for dumbing down of the InterCity railway. In fact IC stock has been getting worse since the late 1980s: IC225 not quite as good as IC125, Pendolino massively worse than what went before, same with Voyager, and IEP will merely accelerate this process.
 

DarloRich

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GWR HST Standard Class, or indeed anywhere else they specified "daylight white" which is an utterly horrible colour taken from the tones of a miserable cloudy day. It is suitable for low energy functional outdoor lighting. It has absolutely no role anywhere else.

at least i can read my book or papers without having to strain ;) I prefer bright to dull, not like looking at the sun bright LOL
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Is the correct answer.

For what should have been a flagship fleet built from a blank piece of paper they are a complete letdown the moment you step inside and probably the worse comparable trainset in Europe.

I just wish Virgin/DFT/ whoever had taken some time to consider the internals after working so long on the fantastic mechanicals
 

Minilad

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225 all day long.
Although to be fair Pendolinos are just about my most disliked type of train so just about anything else would have won
 

cjmillsnun

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It's interesting that another member was recently praising the Pendolino as having the perfect lighting levels. Just goes so show.

The best lighting levels IMO are the EMT HST Mk3s. Although if they could replace the LEDs with warm white, they would be perfect.
 
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