IEP Annoucement

[Blindtraveler]

and if under floor diesols are chosen, I for one will be moaning as this is not popular anyway and as much of the off the wires running will be on more challenging sections of rout e.g up to Inverness then the noise level would be high. Come to that, they will need, under floor or not to make traction moters powerful enough to even get to inverness, something which seams to be causing a problem perhaps? Also did I miss read or did someone say TPE 180s wil be replaced on Scottish runs?

Yes. You can.
And someone else will be along soon to winge about the livery.
Somone else to dispute the classification number.
I'm waiting to have a gripe at the menus.
And there's always someone to moan about the upholstery, the Information displays and the PA system.
Oh, and there's been another complaint already . . . . Bob Crow has been annoyed that they'll only assemble some of them at Newton Aycliffe: "why can't they be built here?"

 

[swt_passenger]

The main point of electrifying to Newbury is to allow suburban services from Paddington to go over to EMU operation. I'm not sure you'd be able to electrify Reading to Basingstoke as third rail. Only extensions of existing systems are allowed and I'm not sure if Basingstoke to Reading could count as that.

The electrification RUS suggests that Basingstoke to Exeter could be done in third rail or OHLE depending on business case, so on the basis of distance alone there's nothing much to stop Rdg - Bas being an extension. Similarly with the missing bits of similar length elsewhere, such as on the North Downs route.

What does stop third rail is that they have it down in the list for OHLE as part of the XC network...

 

[WatcherZero]

Faster acceleration plus some modest line speed improvements is how they could be 20 minutes faster.

I dont think the current version Agility and Dft are working on is anything remotely like that first announced with specs in the public domain. Anyway last time I heard the details of the new Bi-mode discussed it was two unpowered driving cars with three powered coachs each using three underfloor diesel aux power units of approx 250-350hp.

 

[ainsworth74]

Also did I miss read or did someone say TPE 180s wil be replaced on Scottish runs?

I think ml's little tirade about 220s replacing 185s may have caused some confusion in this case. Voyagers will not be appearing on TPE any time soon (hopefully never). But the TPE 185s on Scottish runs may well be replaced at some point in the relatively near future (probably during the NW electrification) with a 350 type train.

 

[swt_passenger]

Am I the only one who seems to think that that Shadow Secretary sounds a bit clueless?

No you aren't - I think she's a one track record, and getting boring at that. All she ever seems to do is tell Hammond that he's delaying Labour's existing plans, and he seems to get the better of her in nearly every session, generally replying that their promises were totally unfunded. He was quick to reply that IEP was delayed because Adonis got cold feet and called for the Foster 'vfm' check at the last minute...

 

[WatcherZero]

Yeah but it was Tory pressure for it to be outright scrapped that got them to call the review. I thought she rambled but asked some knowledgable questions that Hammond didnt answer.

 

[The Planner]

It would need to be non-stop and have all the engineering allowance removed to get close to 22, so in reality you may get a blagged one headline service a day to do it which probably would never arrive on time.

 

[Zoe]

It would need to be non-stop and have all the engineering allowance removed to get close to 22, so in reality you may get a blagged one headline service a day to do it which probably would never arrive on time.

After the Reading remodelling, will there be 125 mph through lines? If so that would save some time. Currently you don't save that much by not stopping at Reading.

 

[swt_passenger]

Where's your source for this? Can't imagine they'd want to haul dead diesel engines around?

They will, because he was down to only two choices from late last year, either a mix of bimode and electric IEPs, or all electric IEPs and separate diesel locos to haul them off the wires.

And today he's confirmed the former option.

--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

After the Reading remodelling, will there be 125 mph through lines? If so that would save some time. Currently you don't save that mucb by not stopping at Reading.

100 mph - and that's subject to future signalling improvents.

 

[Waddon]

When it says electrify to Newbury, does that include the few extra miles to Bedwyn? Otherwise I guess this service may find itself reduced to a Newbury shuttle, rather than run a DMU all the way to London 99% under the wires...

And also on the subject of trains stopping at Reading, isn't there some archaic rule or regulation that says all passenger services have to stop there? Or is that no longer the case?

p.s. if they are thinking about the Severn Beach line for electrification, thats good, but I would assume they would also want to also wire back from St. Andrews Road to Bristol Parkway... which begs the question... how will they get past this...
http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&s...1.517439,-2.578408&spn=0.001793,0.004823&z=18

 

[WatcherZero]

Dont know their source but Reuters and Railway Gazette are reporting the contract as 500 carriages. The tender was for 500-2000 ranging from just GWML to ECML and more suburban stock. Perhaps indicates they placed the smallest order possible. Could also explain why its 500 jobs now rather than 2500 while the actual UK share of the work has gone up.

Their also reporting Whitehall sources as saying the Thameslink order will be announced in May with Bombardier having won.

 

[Zoe]

When it says electrify to Newbury, does that include the few extra miles to Bedwyn?

No, I expect the new EMU service from Paddington will be cut back to Newbury.

And also on the subject of trains stopping at Reading, isn't there some archaic rule or regulation that says all passenger services have to stop there? Or is that no longer the case?

There wasn't such a rule for Reading, until the 2004 - 2006 perdiod quite a few services didn't stop there. It was only from the new timetable for the Greater Western franchise in December 2006 that almost all trains have called at Reading.

 

[Ivo]

So which services previously didn't call there? Was it just a random selection, or set routes?

Would that not make Reading the busiest station to have a semi-regular non-stopping service running through it?

 

[Zoe]

So which services previously didn't call there? Was it just a random selection, or set routes?

It varied but at times the Cornish Riviera has been non-stop to Exeter (historically the first stop was Plymouth). The Up Golden Hind was non-stop Taunton to Paddington until December 2004 except for a short period around 2000 following Ladbroke Grove when a Reading call was added. The Red Dragon at one time I believe was non-stop from Bristol Parkway to Paddington, the Cathedrals Express has been first stop Oxford and I also believe there were a few peak services to Bristol or South Wales that were first stop Didcot or Swindon.

 

[swt_passenger]

When it says electrify to Newbury, does that include the few extra miles to Bedwyn? Otherwise I guess this service may find itself reduced to a Newbury shuttle, rather than run a DMU all the way to London 99% under the wires...

This is a repeat...

The GWML RUS explains that under the IEP and electrification plans minor stations beyond Newbury (including Bedwyn) will be served by a second hourly semifast IEP service to/from Taunton and Exeter.

Newbury will then become the limit of the suburban EMU services.

As I said a few weeks ago, you mustn't assume we are stuck with today's service patterns for ever...

 

[Blindtraveler]

I think ml's little tirade about 220s replacing 185s may have caused some confusion in this case. Voyagers will not be appearing on TPE any time soon (hopefully never). But the TPE 185s on Scottish runs may well be replaced at some point in the relatively near future (probably during the NW electrification) with a 350 type train.

ta. Hope the internal fitout of this is superior to the current 185, maybe even a buffet? off topic, but thing Man to scotland should be a vir4n/who ever gets west coast/XC service, TPE HAVE, FROM MY POINT OF VIEW NEVER GOT IT RITE!

 

[Zoe]

I like the way in their document, Agility Trains say the train can go anywhere on the UK rail network. I'd like to see them try and get it to Belfast.

 

[Aictos]

Good news then, with regards to the Thames Valley - The Government would be foolish not to electify Reading to Gatwick otherwise it's another diesel island and a mix fleet of DMUs and EMUs would be needed.

 

[Zoe]

The GWML RUS explains that under the IEP and electrification plans minor stations beyond Newbury (including Bedwyn) will be served by a second hourly semifast IEP service to/from Taunton and Exeter.

If it continues to Exeter then hopefully it will call at Tiverton and so the pointless Tiverton Parkway calls for the Plymouth and Penzance express services can be removed. Potentialy a service each day could be extended to Paington so the hourly express service to Plymouth could be maintained.

 

[Ivo]

I like the way in their document, Agility Trains say the train can go anywhere on the UK rail network. I'd like to see them try and get it to Belfast.

It's called "Building a submarine tunnel between Holyhead and Dublin and adding an extra rail to the Enterprise route to allow for multiple gauges". I'd quite like to see them finance that one!

 

[WatcherZero]

 

[Class 33]

Bristol Temple Meads to London to be increased to 4 tph.

Interesting. I'd like to see how they manage 4 trains per hour between Bristol Temple Meads and London Paddington. There's the Bristol-Bath bottleneck with the Cardiff-Portsmouth's and Bristol-Weymouth services. Then once past Wooton Bassett the half hourly services from South Wales, and then further on services from Cheltenham, Worcestor, etc.

Will be interesting to see how the 4 trains per hour timetable takes shape. Will all services go for the bog standard calling points. Or would some services(1 or 2 trains per hour) be proper limited stop/express services, i.e. calling at Reading and London Paddington only?

Bring on 2016(or whenever it will be) for these exciting changes. I do hope they have learned a thing from the Voyager fiasco, and go for some decent trains with DECENT comfortable seating! Also please no ultra bright office like carriage lighting!

In July 2009 with the original electrification announcement, it said work on the electrification would begin immediately. That of course didn't happen. So let's hope now it's not long before the actual physical evidence of work on the electrification going ahead.

 

[Zoe]

Interesting. I'd like to see how they manage 4 trains per hour between Bristol Temple Meads and London Paddington.
There's the Bristol-Bath bottleneck with the Cardiff-Portsmouth's and Bristol-Weymouth services.

The extra services will run via Badminton.

 

[tbtc]

Interesting. I'd like to see how they manage 4 trains per hour between Bristol Temple Meads and London Paddington. There's the Bristol-Bath bottleneck with the Cardiff-Portsmouth's and Bristol-Weymouth services. Then once past Wooton Bassett the half hourly services from South Wales, and then further on services from Cheltenham, Worcestor, etc

It may be that there are fewer services from the "branches" and more services on the "core"

 

[LE Greys]

It may be that there are fewer services from the "branches" and more services on the "core"

Natural result of electrification on any line, does anyone remember the Cleveland Executive?

 

[Zoe]

Video of debate now online at http://news.bbc.co.uk/democracylive/hi/house_of_commons/newsid_9410000/9410594.stm

 

[LE Greys]

When it says electrify to Newbury, does that include the few extra miles to Bedwyn? Otherwise I guess this service may find itself reduced to a Newbury shuttle, rather than run a DMU all the way to London 99% under the wires...

And also on the subject of trains stopping at Reading, isn't there some archaic rule or regulation that says all passenger services have to stop there? Or is that no longer the case?

p.s. if they are thinking about the Severn Beach line for electrification, thats good, but I would assume they would also want to also wire back from St. Andrews Road to Bristol Parkway... which begs the question... how will they get past this...
http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&s...1.517439,-2.578408&spn=0.001793,0.004823&z=18

The Bedwyn service seems a bit strange anyway, because it creates the Bedwyn-Pewsey lack of connection. I hope that this finally leads to a regular service between the two stations.

 

[Ivo]

The Bedwyn service seems a bit strange anyway, because it creates the Bedwyn-Pewsey lack of connection. I hope that this finally leads to a regular service between the two stations.

But how many people (besides The Walrus ) would actually appreciate such a service? :?

 

[Zoe]

The Bedwyn service seems a bit strange anyway, because it creates the Bedwyn-Pewsey lack of connection. I hope that this finally leads to a regular service between the two stations.

It's still possible that there won't be. Back in 2006 when they were going to extend the Bedwyn service to Westbury, after Newbury it was going to alternate between Newbury - Kintbury - Hungerford - Bedwyn - Westbury and Newbury - Hungerford - Pewsey - Westbury. In the end FGW decided to keep the terminus at Westbury and run two semi-fast High Speed Services to Taunton each day with one continuing to Exeter. It's possible a service pattern like this could be used so as to not slow down the semi-fast services to Taunton/Exeter that much.

 

[TheWalrus]

What would be the benefits of wiring Newbury-Bedwyn!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

But how many people (besides The Walrus ) would actually appreciate such a service? :?

Actually Im a Swindon customer Few would do Bedwyn-Pewsey, but a lot more would do say Newbury-Westbury, or Westbury-Exeter.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

The Bedwyn service seems a bit strange anyway, because it creates the Bedwyn-Pewsey lack of connection. I hope that this finally leads to a regular service between the two stations.

Never understood it myself! It seems they should naturally have services linking them!