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How are XC coping not doing ticket checks?

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Confused147

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Yesterday (Sat 23rd) I travelled return between Birmingham New Street and York with XC and not one ticket check was done on train either way. Makes me feel like I could've saved the £63 by just jumping the train, nor was any ticket checks were done either end, New St or York. This is sad for an operator if they consider fare dodging a concern or is this just something to do with the strike action??
 
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OverSpeed

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I am sure that yesterday and today as well, senior conductors and train managers are on strike. (On cross country services)

This could be the reason why your ticket, and anyone else's were also not checked.
 

Confused147

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I forgot to mention the trains were double units which only a conductor works the rear unit so I thought that was maybe why.
 

yorkie

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Yesterday (Sat 23rd) I travelled return between Birmingham New Street and York with XC and not one ticket check was done on train either way.
Probably due to the strike.
Makes me feel like I could've saved the £63 by just jumping the train
It would be £134.20 for a through Anytime fare on the train, not £63.

If you are interested in saving money, you can get valid tickets for less than £49 using an accredited ticket splitting website. The reason for this is because XC charge a premium for longer distance passengers making journeys such as Birmimgham to York.

This is sad for an operator if they consider fare dodging a concern
You mean if they don't consider it a concern?

XC do consider it a concern, to such an extent that they will prosecute some valid ticket holders because the Guard who inspected the tickets thinks the tickets shouldn't be valid. There's a case like that going through the courts right now, and another case XC lost a while back (but the victims do not wish to discuss it yet, sadly) that I am aware of.

Even if there wasn't a strike, you have to consider the possibility that staff may be occupied with other matters or their ticket machine may be inoperable for whatever reason. You will make some journeys without a ticket check, it's just unavoidable and it isn't a big deal.
 

dk1

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Revenue protection is way down the list during industrial action. Just getting the service running as on GA has been a problematic & very expensive exercise. There is no time to train PUGs to do anything other than safety critical duties. There has been some extra RPIs selling tickets at major stations but the rest is a free for all. Remember XC do not even run a single station so they are always reliant on other TOCs.
 

6Gman

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And barrier checks at New Street are ... erratic shall we say.
 

waynemorrell

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or their ticket machine may be inoperable for whatever reason. You will make some journeys without a ticket check, it's just unavoidable and it isn't a big deal.

I was surprised on ScotRail a few weeks back, I got challenged twice on two different trains, but the staff involved couldn’t sell tickets.

What surprised me was that they were doing the checks even though they had no means to sell any tickets.

In the end I bought my ticket at an intimidate station where I had a while to wait for the connecting service. I got challenged again on the final leg of the journey (this time VTEC) and of course had my ticket to show.

If I was only as going as far as my intermidate station, I could have, if I had been so inclined, got away Scot free (no pun intended). Which is why I don’t see the point in installing ticket barriers and leaving them open, at major stations too.

And while I’m at it, stations where barriers only cover certain platforms for instance ? Why ?
 
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Richard Hall

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Checked twice on XC on Friday between Reading and Durham with the team change over in Birmingham

Inspector taking her job very seriously when faced with six students travelling on four young person rail cards
 

yorkie

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And while I’m at it, stations where barriers only cover certain platforms for instance ? Why ?
Various potential reasons; if you have a particular location in mind, try a search as there may well already be a thread for it.
 

paddington

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Quite often on XC I "get away" with not having my ticket checked.

On all my train journeys, I usually stare outside the window (sometimes I'm trying to look for junctions/points/signals) and ignore what is happening inside the carriage.

On operators other than XC, the guard usually stops my by seat until I turn around and notice them. But on XC it seems like, more often than not, they just say "any new tickets" or whatever without paying attention to who got on at the last station. By the time I've realised the guard has come round, they have already walked past and I'm not going to call them back...
 

dk1

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This has got to be one of the funniest posts this year...
 

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cf111

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And while I’m at it, stations where barriers only cover certain platforms for instance ? Why ?
Sometimes it's not possible due to the geography for the station, for instance if they put barriers to platform 7 at Inverness they would block off the barbers' and the through route to the bus station via the car parks.
 

Shaw S Hunter

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Which is why I don’t see the point in installing ticket barriers and leaving them open, at major stations too.

As some here will I know I happen to think that ticket barriers are a good idea but only when properly staffed which should also be at all times trains are running. Anything else sends a very mixed message about which passengers the TOCs think should pay (ie commuters) and which can have a chance to ride for free. And properly staffed means by people who actually know something about ticketing as opposed to glorified door staff who get confused by any ticket that doesn't include that particular station's name on it. [/rant]
 

6Gman

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Sometimes it's not possible due to the geography for the station, for instance if they put barriers to platform 7 at Inverness they would block off the barbers' and the through route to the bus station via the car parks.

And sometimes the booking office is beyond where you would need to put the barriers e.g. Llandudno Junction.
 

6Gman

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As some here will I know I happen to think that ticket barriers are a good idea but only when properly staffed which should also be at all times trains are running. Anything else sends a very mixed message about which passengers the TOCs think should pay (ie commuters) and which can have a chance to ride for free. And properly staffed means by people who actually know something about ticketing as opposed to glorified door staff who get confused by any ticket that doesn't include that particular station's name on it. [/rant]

RANT ALERT:-

The worst things about automatic barriers is when the staff who are supposed to be supervising them, and assisting passengers (like myself) holding tickets which do not operate the barriers, are chatting to each other instead of concentrating on their work.

This has caused me to miss a train on one occasion (yes, Birmingham Snow Hill, I'm looking at you).

Almost as frustrating are the staff who position themselves on the other side of the gate from where they need to tap a card/ turn a key and therefore have to reach across each passenger in turn. (Though that may be a design fault in that there's no room for them to stand in such a position.)

:)
 

Shaw S Hunter

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Almost as frustrating are the staff who position themselves on the other side of the gate from where they need to tap a card/ turn a key and therefore have to reach across each passenger in turn. (Though that may be a design fault in that there's no room for them to stand in such a position.)

:)

Since gates are generally designed to work in either direction it's clearly a design fault in not providing a staff over-ride control on both sides.
 

6Gman

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Since gates are generally designed to work in either direction it's clearly a design fault in not providing a staff over-ride control on both sides.

I should have explained it more clearly - they're on the correct side of the gate (i.e. trainside or otherwise) but on the wrong side of the gate (i.e. they stand to the left when the control is on the right, or vice versa) so they have to lean across the gate and block the passenger's progress.
 

the sniper

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Almost as frustrating are the staff who position themselves on the other side of the gate from where they need to tap a card/ turn a key and therefore have to reach across each passenger in turn. (Though that may be a design fault in that there's no room for them to stand in such a position.)

:)

100% a design fault at New Street at least. They should have designed the barrier with a centre refuge for a member of staff to stand in, or more gates should have been provided, preferably spaced further apart. Presumably the people who designed it weren't familiar with barriers not accepting valid tickets... The kind of gap in understanding between theory and reality that we see play out on this forum every so often too. ;)

Though at New Street half the escalators still don't work. Sewage leaks into the station every so often. The huge fans installed at platform level randomly go at screaming full blast when the platforms are empty or full of EMUs, yet are often off when you can chew on the diesel fumes. And it was designed so that the station is essentially redivided into Midland and London North Western sides, reintroducing the division that the 1960s designers managed to eliminate from their design. So in the grand scheme of things the barriers aren't such a failure.

Oh well, only a few decades until they rebuild it again.
 

waynemorrell

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Various potential reasons; if you have a particular location in mind, try a search as there may well already be a thread for it.

Couldn’t find anything via search.

I was thinking about Glasgow Central (High Level) ISTR no barriers on platform 1&2, BCBW, it could be they were just open when I got there. It was very late. (The hour not the train ).
 

waynemorrell

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Sometimes it's not possible due to the geography for the station, for instance if they put barriers to platform 7 at Inverness they would block off the barbers' and the through route to the bus station via the car parks.

Yes good point, though you need to get through barriers at several stations to get to things like cafes ect. I remember an incident at Lewes many years ago “return to the station cafe please” someone said to the guy on the barrier. LOL.
 

waynemorrell

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And properly staffed means by people who actually know something about ticketing as opposed to glorified door staff who get confused by any ticket that doesn't include that particular station's name on it. [/rant]

Why does your post suddenly make me think of London Victoria, Gatwick Express and arguments at the ticket barrier?
 

Confused147

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Which is why I don’t see the point in installing ticket barriers and leaving them open, at major stations too.

?
There are barriers wide open during daytime at the entrance from the footbridge at Birmingham New Street onto Hill Street. Anyone without a ticket could easily enter or exit this way.
 

Starmill

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There are sometimes ticket checks. Frequently a journey goes with no check. Especially on very busy trains which many of theirs are, or journeys late at night.

This is no different from any other TOC!
 

Starmill

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Those platforms are almost exclusively used by long distance operators (with very few exceptions).
Exactly. The last two times I have used those platforms there has been a manual ticket check before boarding, something relatively commonplace for Virgin Trains.
 

mrcheek

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RANT ALERT:-

The worst things about automatic barriers is when the staff who are supposed to be supervising them, and assisting passengers (like myself) holding tickets which do not operate the barriers, are chatting to each other instead of concentrating on their work.

This has caused me to miss a train on one occasion (yes, Birmingham Snow Hill, I'm looking at you).

Almost as frustrating are the staff who position themselves on the other side of the gate from where they need to tap a card/ turn a key and therefore have to reach across each passenger in turn. (Though that may be a design fault in that there's no room for them to stand in such a position.)

:)

Nah, the worst thing is when people who have normal tickets which would operate the gate automatically, stand in the queue where there is a member of staff operating the gate. I have to use this queue since All LIne Rovers rarely open the gates. I shouldnt have to get stuck behind these idiots!!!!
 

U-Bahnfreund

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Very interesting thread. Presenting a different point of view: ticket barriers in the Netherlands are never staffed (at least I have never encountered any barrier staff), evem though passengers might hold tickets that don't the work barriere (e.g. DB paper tickets without a barcode). There is a help point at every gate though, where someone opens the gate if you ask them to (had such an incident at Sittard once).
 

QueensCurve

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100% a design fault at New Street at least. They should have designed the barrier with a centre refuge for a member of staff to stand in, or more gates should have been provided, preferably spaced further apart. Presumably the people who designed it weren't familiar with barriers not accepting valid tickets... The kind of gap in understanding between theory and reality that we see play out on this forum every so often too. ;)

Though at New Street half the escalators still don't work. Sewage leaks into the station every so often. The huge fans installed at platform level randomly go at screaming full blast when the platforms are empty or full of EMUs, yet are often off when you can chew on the diesel fumes. And it was designed so that the station is essentially redivided into Midland and London North Western sides, reintroducing the division that the 1960s designers managed to eliminate from their design. So in the grand scheme of things the barriers aren't such a failure.

Oh well, only a few decades until they rebuild it again.

The New street barriers are particularly annoying since they require you to exit and then re-enter when moving between platforms. They have designed what could have been a fine open station and then despoiled it.

Yes good point, though you need to get through barriers at several stations to get to things like cafes ect. I remember an incident at Lewes many years ago “return to the station cafe please” someone said to the guy on the barrier. LOL.

Thank you very much for that anecdote. I will use it myself when the circumstances arise.
 
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