Great Western Livery

[Harbornite]

Nothing to stop a privately owned set returning into full-blown IC livery for charter purposes...

Indeed, they were my thoughts too and will most likely happen if a set gets preserved, which I expect. I just don't expect First to do it.

 

[59CosG95]

Indeed, they were my thoughts too and will most likely happen if a set gets preserved, which I expect. I just don't expect First to do it.

Yeah, First repainting a set into full-blown IC/blue-grey isn't gonna happen.

 

[Harbornite]

Yeah, First repainting a set into full-blown IC/blue-grey isn't gonna happen.

The rules are interesting because Chiltern were allowed to operate stock that didn't meet these particular regs for a good few years. I get that older stock has grandfather rights (hence why we have railtour stock in old liveries), but I do question why Chiltern got away with it and yet GWR could not.

 

[43096]

The rules are interesting because Chiltern were allowed to operate stock that didn't meet these particular regs for a good few years. I get that older stock has grandfather rights (hence why we have railtour stock in old liveries), but I do question why Chiltern got away with it and yet GWR could not.

It was very simple. Nothing to do with regs and everything to do with cost.

 

[Harbornite]

Fair enough.

 

[fgwrich]

Back to Great Western liveries:

166220 is due back from C6 at Wolverton this Saturday and the first of the 165s (165101) will take its place.

Talking of 165s, the accident damaged car of 165124 was supposed to move to Derby today, by road, for repair. Don't know if it's actually gone though!

I'm surprised it's going to Derby, I'd have thought sending the pair to Wolverton to undergo the Blue to Green conversion would have been the plan for it given how near to completion the 166s are.

Equally, I wonder what the plans are for the Blue Turbo's are now? Sticky back plastic into Green?

 

[JN114]

I'm surprised it's going to Derby, I'd have thought sending the pair to Wolverton to undergo the Blue to Green conversion would have been the plan for it given how near to completion the 166s are.

Equally, I wonder what the plans are for the Blue Turbo's are now? Sticky back plastic into Green?

If it goes to Wolverton it holds up the remainder of the refurb program that's taking place there while accident damage is repaired. I expect it will be repaired at Derby then dovetail nicely into the refurbishment program at Wolverton before returning into traffic with GW. The accident repair is being handled by the ROSCO, not GW and as such not aware of many details of what is taking place.

 

[FGW_DID]

Are the 165s getting air con fitted or is this later?

Apparently yes it is, although it's the type fitted to the Chiltern turbos, not the type fitted to the 166s (can't think why )

 

[jimm]

Are the 165s getting air con fitted or is this later?

They are not getting air conditioning.

This has been mentioned a few times previously in various threads.

What they will get is based - as FGW_DID says - on the equipment used in the Chiltern 165s, but that is officially described as air cooling (I think Angel Trains now calls it comfort cooling, or somethng like that), not air conditioning. It does not dehumidify the air, which air conditioning systems do.

i don't know what the timing is for this kit to be fitted.

GWR has never been very clear on anything much beyond saying that the 165s and 365s - this was before the decision not to take any 365s - would be getting what was called Saloon Air Cooling. This line appeared in Powerpoint presentations used last year.

 

[fgwrich]

If it goes to Wolverton it holds up the remainder of the refurb program that's taking place there while accident damage is repaired. I expect it will be repaired at Derby then dovetail nicely into the refurbishment program at Wolverton before returning into traffic with GW. The accident repair is being handled by the ROSCO, not GW and as such not aware of many details of what is taking place.

Fair enough, and thanks for the explanation.

They are not getting air conditioning.

This has been mentioned a few times previously in various threads.

What they will get is based - as FGW_DID says - on the equipment used in the Chiltern 165s, but that is officially described as air cooling (I think Angel Trains now calls it comfort cooling, or somethng like that), not air conditioning. It does not dehumidify the air, which air conditioning systems do.

i don't know what the timing is for this kit to be fitted.

GWR has never been very clear on anything much beyond saying that the 165s and 365s - this was before the decision not to take any 365s - would be getting what was called Saloon Air Cooling. This line appeared in Powerpoint presentations used last year.

And will be a fun job to whomever has the contract to install it, as found when the Chiltern 165s received it. One of the reasons for it's difficulty of installation was that, just as Bombardier still does, the Turbos where built and fitted out on Jigs before fitting each piece together. That's a fine and understable way of producing things, however it meant that everything in the Turbo's ceiling then became upside down when assembled as a complete bodyshell.

Either way, it cant come soon enough. Sadly, despite my liking and preference of the Dynamic Lines / Plain Blue scheme, the interior of the Turbos is starting to wear now and in need of some attention and maintenance.

 

[jimm]

And will be a fun job to whomever has the contract to install it, as found when the Chiltern 165s received it. One of the reasons for it's difficulty of installation was that, just as Bombardier still does, the Turbos where built and fitted out on Jigs before fitting each piece together. That's a fine and understable way of producing things, however it meant that everything in the Turbo's ceiling then became upside down when assembled as a complete bodyshell.

Well at least someone has done it before, so can explain how to go about the installation work.

Anything is better than trying to replicate the 166 air conditioning...

 

[co-tr-paul]

SLEP 10616 now back after repaint into green.

 

[Rhydgaled]

Well GWR said they didn't want to/ couldn't repaint a full HST set into BR livery because the livery doesn't have passenger doors in a contrasting colour...

Didn't want to sounds more like it, since I think Chiltern had some coaches painted in blue&grey (and it might not even have been considered a hertitage livery because they had Chiltern logos on them)

It was very simple. Nothing to do with regs and everything to do with cost.

Ok, so GWR could have painted a set in Blue&Grey if they wanted, but didn't want to go to the expense of a repaint?

 

[fgwrich]

What has to be remembered about the Chiltern Mk3s, before we run away with the ideal of it is that it wasn't actually Chiltern who repainted them in the first place. They were ex Cargo D - initially hired in as the stand in coaches for Wrexham and Shropshire while their own sets were refurbished. They ended up with Chiltern after Cargo D and W&S demises, with Chiltern taking on the Mk3 sets - they were too good to be released and Chiltern needed ways of increasing capacity, so DB purchased the majority of the Cargo D Mk3s. The Banbury set was initially made up of mixed Blue Grey & Virgin Mk3s, and yes Chiltern did have a few repainted to match the rest of the set but it wasn't Chiltern who'd settled on Blue/Grey on the first place.

GW could still do a set in Blue Grey, but I doubt it will happen for a while. I think, for now we'll just see more HST PCs reliveried.

 

[Harbornite]

What has to be remembered about the Chiltern Mk3s, before we run away with the ideal of it is that it wasn't actually Chiltern who repainted them in the first place. They were ex Cargo D - initially hired in as the stand in coaches for Wrexham and Shropshire while their own sets were refurbished. They ended up with Chiltern after Cargo D and W&S demises, with Chiltern taking on the Mk3 sets - they were too good to be released and Chiltern needed ways of increasing capacity, so DB purchased the majority of the Cargo D Mk3s. The Banbury set was initially made up of mixed Blue Grey & Virgin Mk3s, and yes Chiltern did have a few repainted to match the rest of the set but it wasn't Chiltern who'd settled on Blue/Grey on the first place.

GW could still do a set in Blue Grey, but I doubt it will happen for a while. I think, for now we'll just see more HST PCs reliveried.

Yes that's right, I know that but the point is Chiltern retained the blue and grey livery on those coaches until this year, and I wasn't aware of many complaints about the livery before then.

slightly off topic, but who snapped up the blue and grey Cargo D mark 2s?

 

[JN114]

Yes that's right, I know that but the point is Chiltern retained the blue and grey livery on those coaches until this year, and I wasn't aware of many complaints about the livery before then.

slightly off topic, but who snapped up the blue and grey Cargo D mark 2s?

Its entirely possible they stayed with Chiltern for so long as they didn't by then have enough Chiltern-spec Mk3 coaches to replace them with. Image consistency, especially when it comes to running mixed-livery rakes of coaches, is very important to some operators.

Don't mistake a lack of repaint with a lack of desire to repaint.

Another reason to consider with GW not repainting a full rake of trailers into a "heritage" livery, is availability to release yet another trailer set for repaint. With the existing commitments to repaint sets (ROSCO obligation, be it blue or green) seeing full sets away at Kilmarnock for weeks at a time, and decreasing reliability thanks to age, can GW afford to release another set of trailer cars, which for the brand reasons above will also have to be kept together or run short, on top of the 2 green sets that already can't mix with the rest of the fleet.

I'm not privy to the decision making process, but knowing a number of people who would have been involved I'd be surprised if willingness was a factor!

 

[Harbornite]

Its entirely possible they stayed with Chiltern for so long as they didn't by then have enough Chiltern-spec Mk3 coaches to replace them with. Image consistency, especially when it comes to running mixed-livery rakes of coaches, is very important to some operators.

Don't mistake a lack of repaint with a lack of desire to repaint.

Another reason to consider with GW not repainting a full rake of trailers into a "heritage" livery, is availability to release yet another trailer set for repaint. With the existing commitments to repaint sets (ROSCO obligation, be it blue or green) seeing full sets away at Kilmarnock for weeks at a time, and decreasing reliability thanks to age, can GW afford to release another set of trailer cars, which for the brand reasons above will also have to be kept together or run short, on top of the 2 green sets that already can't mix with the rest of the fleet.

I'm not privy to the decision making process, but knowing a number of people who would have been involved I'd be surprised if willingness was a factor!

They are good points, it would be complex and more suited to preservation (it's probably why Virgin xc only repainted some of its locos into heritage liveries and nit stock)

However I should add that Chiltern aren't completely against "heritage", what with their 121 which has retained BR green livery and doesn't require contrasting doors.

 

[postye]

166220 has just left wolverton heading for reading

 

[FGW_DID]

166220 has just left wolverton heading for reading

5V65 Wolverton - Reading TCD

165101 heads the opposite way this afternoon:

5M65 13:33 Reading TCD - Wolverton.

 

[Melancholia]

5V65 Wolverton - Reading TCD

165101 heads the opposite way this afternoon:

5M65 13:33 Reading TCD - Wolverton.

So it's now the 165's turn for their splash of green?

 

[FGW_DID]

So it's now the 165's turn for their splash of green?

It is indeed

 

[MatthewRead]

It is indeed

Will they get the GWR interior?

 

[D1009]

Some photos of 158956 at Portsmouth Harbour earlier today.

Is 158956 in regular traffic? I pass through Temple Meads pretty frequently but haven't seen it in service.

 

[JN114]

Is 158956 in regular traffic? I pass through Temple Meads pretty frequently but haven't seen it in service.

It's spent today between Worcester and Weymouth

 

[PHILIPE]

Is 158956 in regular traffic? I pass through Temple Meads pretty frequently but haven't seen it in service.

Been about a couple of weeks now. See Post #1118

 

[CheapAndNerdy]

At Clapham Junction platform 17 this morning (11:50ish) I saw a rather dashing train. No passengers, but some rail staff, if the orange hi-viz jackets over the seats were anything to go by. It was dark green with grey doors and obviously very new and clean on the outside. Originally I thought it was maybe some new Southern livery, but I now realise it was GWR, although I don't recall if it had the logo on the side.

I had no means to photograph it, but it was a class 387. Looked reet smart it did. The scrolling destination panel on its side indicated Brighton.

 

[swt_passenger]

At Clapham Junction platform 17 this morning (11:50ish) I saw a rather dashing train. No passengers, but some rail staff, if the orange hi-viz jackets over the seats were anything to go by. It was dark green with grey doors and obviously very new and clean on the outside. Originally I thought it was maybe some new Southern livery, but I now realise it was GWR, although I don't recall if it had the logo on the side.

GWR units 387132 and 133. I just posted the RTT link for the service in the 387 thread, it's on the northbound return to Bletchley now. There are a number of pictures (or links to pictures or videos) of the GW livery in that thread, e.g. here: http://www.railforums.co.uk/showpost.php?p=2631614&postcount=3415

 

[Deepgreen]

I caught 166205 from Betchworth this morning - the leather seats in first class seem to wearing OK (was there some idea that they were not suitable?), but the re-sprayed tables are scratching badly. Is there a programme to fit further 166s similarly?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

GWR units 387132 and 133. I just posted the RTT link for the service in the 387 thread, it's on the northbound return to Bletchley now. There are a number of pictures (or links to pictures or videos) of the GW livery in that thread, e.g. here: http://www.railforums.co.uk/showpost.php?p=2631614&postcount=3415

I think I saw the same pair passing through platform 16 (i.e. northbound) at about 1725 yesterday.

 

[greaterwest]

I caught 166205 from Betchworth this morning - the leather seats in first class seem to wearing OK (was there some idea that they were not suitable?), but the re-sprayed tables are scratching badly. Is there a programme to fit further 166s similarly?

Good grief I hope not, I was on on 166205 yesterday and all the standard class seats were even more disgusting than last time I was on that unit.

They're all stained or marked in some way and I went and sat in first class in the end (class 2 stopping service thankfully, so no actual first class)

If I ever get this unit on a class 1 I will stand in the vestibule.

 

[leomartin125]

Look so like GWR Class 387130 maybe delivered to North Pole tonight...

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/O15594/2016/07/28/advanced

EDIT: This has now been cancelled.