Grand Central platform staff

[Andyh82]

How many stations, if any do Grand Central employ staff to deal with their customers. I know they apparently have half of one person at Kings Cross but how about anywhere else?

I've just been caught up in some GC disruption and it would have been nice to have a member of staff to take control rather than having to deal with East Coast staff in Doncaster who did their best to wash their hands of the situation 'nowt to do with us, they are a different train company' pretty much the attitude, which I suppose is technically right but not very helpful.

 

[WillPS]

How many stations, if any do Grand Central employ staff to deal with their customers. I know they apparently have half of one person at Kings Cross but how about anywhere else?

I've just been caught up in some GC disruption and it would have been nice to have a member of staff to take control rather than having to deal with East Coast staff in Doncaster who did their best to wash their hands of the situation 'nowt to do with us, they are a different train company' pretty much the attitude, which I suppose is technically right but not very helpful.

Not sure EC staff should be behaving in that way but it's difficult to know without more details.

 

[ModernRailways]

Not sure EC staff should be behaving in that way but it's difficult to know without more details.

It all depends how they said it.

In my view it's fair enough though. Grand Central don't have any station/ground staff other than maybe two or three.The East Coast staff will have had other priorities such as dispatching other services etc. so why should they be taken away from that for another train company's benefit? The EC members of staff will be the ones taking the abuse, why shouldn't it be the GC staff? I'm not saying the abuse is right, merely pointing out it will happen and if it is going to be directed towards someone then it should be toward the right people! Why should East Coast get a bad rep for a Grand Central problem?

OP - What happened in the end?

 

[Starmill]

Grand Central have 'Travel Ambassadors' iirc at Hartlepool and Eaglescliffe who turn up in orange jackets before each departure. I'm not sure where they go in between...

The EC staff at Doncaster sounds about right I'm afraid. But just think, no different to if you'd been waiting at Wakefield Kirkgate, Mirfield or Brighouse... (which all have nothing at all, bar maybe a help point, and I can't even think if Mirfield has one of those...)

 

[LowLevel]

As an open access operator it depends what GC pay EC for in their station access agreement - if it doesn't include customer service and they don't provide their own staff you pays your money and takes your chance. Where I used to work XC paid quite heavily for our services as station staff even though we didn't work for them directly so we used to treat their trains and customers pretty much the same as our own.

 

[Andyh82]

OP - What happened in the end?

1952 from KX to Bradford had to stop at St neots to fix a broken windscreen wiper. On arrival at Doncaster 20 mins late, we were again held for 10 mins before being told it was now a failed unit and to catch the East Coast to Leeds (presumably the 2003 from KX) which had pulled up in the adjacent platform.

As everyone dashed over there, the platform staff took great delight in closing the doors and dispatching as normal, saying they can't hold the service as we've used a different train company, which was met with an outcry from passengers after having been told to catch it by the GC conductor seconds earlier. The EC staff then locked themselves away.

We assumed we'd have to travel to Leeds on the next east coast, then about 20 mins later we were told there would be a bus provided from Wakefield to Halifax via all stations, then once on the East Coast service we were told to stay on the train to Leeds and use the 2308 Northern service, the offer of the bus seemingly had disappeared and travel plans having changed 3 times. This resulted in passengers arriving almost 2 hours late. Then I realise GC Don't do Delay Repay!

 

[Qwerty133]

As an open access operator it depends what GC pay EC for in their station access agreement - if it doesn't include customer service and they don't provide their own staff you pays your money and takes your chance. Where I used to work XC paid quite heavily for our services as station staff even though we didn't work for them directly so we used to treat their trains and customers pretty much the same as our own.

If XC pay, I'm surprised that GC don't, in most other ways they seem to follow the same rules, and even share a twitter team.

 

[ModernRailways]

1952 from KX to Bradford had to stop at St neots to fix a broken windscreen wiper. On arrival at Doncaster 20 mins late, we were again held for 10 mins before being told it was now a failed unit and to catch the East Coast to Leeds (presumably the 2003 from KX) which had pulled up in the adjacent platform.

As everyone dashed over there, the platform staff took great delight in closing the doors and dispatching as normal, saying they can't hold the service as we've used a different train company, which was met with an outcry from passengers after having been told to catch it by the GC conductor seconds earlier. The EC staff then locked themselves away.

We assumed we'd have to travel to Leeds on the next east coast, then about 20 mins later we were told there would be a bus provided from Wakefield to Halifax via all stations, then once on the East Coast service we were told to stay on the train to Leeds and use the 2308 Northern service, the offer of the bus seemingly had disappeared and travel plans having changed 3 times. This resulted in passengers arriving almost 2 hours late. Then I realise GC Don't do Delay Repay!

If Grand Central had organised proper ticket acceptance then the East Coast train would have surely been held. Where did the GC staff go in all of this?

I think this is as much Grand Central's failure than East Coast's. It sounds to me like Grand Central did very little to communicate with anyone (including East Coast) thus the East Coast staff didn't have a clue what to do.

 

[Rich McLean]

Don't forget GC are open access, and only run a few services per day, so they may not/cannot afford to pay the extra for other TOC staff to provide customer service to their passengers

 

[Suraggu]

GC do have a ticket acceptance agreement with EC but its up to negotians between XC control (who look after GC control Operations) and EC control which trains GC passengers are allowed on.

I can only imagine that the GC conductor acted prematurely telling passengers they could jump on the next EC Leeds service, when it was probably the train after that one from previous experience in dealing with situations like this.

 

[Starmill]

Then I realise GC Don't do Delay Repay!

They still operate a Passenger's Charter compensation scheme though and a 2 hour delay qualifies for this.

In your position I'd also be complaining about their terrible onward travel planning. I too have experienced it and been dumped at Mirfield (where as I mentioned, there is bugger all) at 2200!

 

[185143]

Mirfield has a help point, I've used it!

 

[Crossover]

They still operate a Passenger's Charter compensation scheme though and a 2 hour delay qualifies for this.

In your position I'd also be complaining about their terrible onward travel planning. I too have experienced it and been dumped at Mirfield (where as I mentioned, there is bugger all) at 2200!

I don't think "dumped" is the word starmill, and Mirfield isn't as barren as some places

 

[Starmill]

I don't think "dumped" is the word starmill, and Mirfield isn't as barren as some places

It was either dumped at Kirkgate, dumped at Mirfield or dumped at Halifax. Mirfield offered the shortest wait, even if not the fastest journey back (which would have been from Doncaster, but again the guard said he would update us in good time en route for connections to Leeds - which I don't count as being fulfilled by him announcing to run for the Northern service to Leeds after the doors had opened at Doncaster which did not wait anyway).

 

[northernchris]

The EC staff at Doncaster sounds about right I'm afraid.

Unfortunately this is true. I've been caught up in disruption at Doncaster before and the East Coast staff were disinterested (and it was one of their services which had failed blocking the line!) It's a shame really because Doncaster have some really good staff too

 

[TUC]

If this is about East Coast staff at Doncaster station then these would presumably be staff operating in East Coast's role as manager of the station on Network Rail's behalf, not East Coast as a rival TOC. I presume that this role includes responsiblities to impartially support all station users, regardless of TOC, in just that same way as they would have responsibilities toward disrupted TPE and Cross Country passengers.

 

[Starmill]

If my experience of the station staff at York when travelling with Northern is anything to go by... they don't know, and they don't want to know - and that's when they are there (which they aren't unless there's an East Coast train in the vicinity).

 

[Tom B]

This is not an issue symptomatic of East Coast - any TOC will try to blame another TOC and, generally, avoid taking responsibility for anything. There is more interest in commercial arrangements than customer service.

If only we had an integrated network with one brand with a well known name, short and descriptive. How about "British Rail"?

 

[Welshman]

If only we had an integrated network with one brand with a well known name, short and descriptive. How about "British Rail"?

That's a radical idea!
I just hope we don't need a 3rd World War to bring it about.

 

[Andyh82]

If my experience of the station staff at York when travelling with Northern is anything to go by... they don't know, and they don't want to know - and that's when they are there (which they aren't unless there's an East Coast train in the vicinity).

Back about a decade ago, staff at Sheffield used to not be not a great deal of use when Arriva Trains as it was then suffered disruption. This was back when Midland Mainline ran the station.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

GC do have a ticket acceptance agreement with EC but its up to negotians between XC control (who look after GC control Operations) and EC control which trains GC passengers are allowed on.

I can only imagine that the GC conductor acted prematurely telling passengers they could jump on the next EC Leeds service, when it was probably the train after that one from previous experience in dealing with situations like this.

The conductor literally said jump on the one currently in the platform. The resulting scramble I'm surprised there wasn't an accident or any belongings left behind.

 

[Urban Gateline]

This is not an issue symptomatic of East Coast - any TOC will try to blame another TOC and, generally, avoid taking responsibility for anything. There is more interest in commercial arrangements than customer service.

If only we had an integrated network with one brand with a well known name, short and descriptive. How about "British Rail"?

I don't think this is a fair conclusion...the station I work at is run by LM but Virgin Trains/Southern/LOROL/Scotrail all serve it, the former and latter pay for Train Dispatch as well as customer service and Southern are part of the GoVia group anyway.

All of us platform staff help out no matter what TOC is concerned, whether it be organising taxis for onward travel if last connections are missed or helping with queries/assistances. Maybe that is just because we are a good bunch of staff who take pride in our work rather than try to fob passengers off!

 

[alastair]

Unfortunately this is true. I've been caught up in disruption at Doncaster before and the East Coast staff were disinterested (and it was one of their services which had failed blocking the line!) It's a shame really because Doncaster have some really good staff too

I had fantastic service from the travel centre staff at Doncaster last autumn when I was on an EC train delayed by a broken down train in front. I was on an EC+Northern advance to Carlisle and a Club 55 Carlisle/Fort William. The lady in the travel centre wrote me out an authorisation to travel Doncaster/Edinburgh direct on EC so I could get my train to Fort William without any fuss at all. Excellent service.

 

[shedman]

I was witness to this incident at Doncaster yesterday and the EC train in question had already received the first tip to close the doors as the hordes of GC passengers started to run over to it. A couple of doors hadn't closed properly so the dispatch team had to manually slide the doors shut. This caused some passengers to become irate towards the team. I did hear a conversation between the two people dispatching the train after the train departed and they hadn't been told the GC was cancelled until it was too late.

 

[Clip]

If only we had an integrated network with one brand with a well known name, short and descriptive. How about "British Rail"?

Gosh what a great idea why hasnt anyone ever trotted out the exact same sentence on this forum before!:roll:

 

[Andyh82]

I was witness to this incident at Doncaster yesterday and the EC train in question had already received the first tip to close the doors as the hordes of GC passengers started to run over to it. A couple of doors hadn't closed properly so the dispatch team had to manually slide the doors shut. This caused some passengers to become irate towards the team. I did hear a conversation between the two people dispatching the train after the train departed and they hadn't been told the GC was cancelled until it was too late.

The man was particularly corporate by mentioning "Grand Central" by name everytime he made an announcement. Their train failed, They have arranged buses etc. Driving home that it was definately not an East Coast issue.

I had a feeling something was up when the display on the boards at Doncaster changed from "Due xx::xx" to "Delayed". The GC train manager initially said that they were contacting Network Rail for advice on how to proceed. If a wiper is broken I'm not entirely sure how it was fixed initially and whether it only became a failure issue because it started to rain heavily.

 

[shedman]

The man was particularly corporate by mentioning "Grand Central" by name everytime he made an announcement. Their train failed, They have arranged buses etc. Driving home that it was definately not an East Coast issue.

I had a feeling something was up when the display on the boards at Doncaster changed from "Due xx::xx" to "Delayed". The GC train manager initially said that they were contacting Network Rail for advice on how to proceed. If a wiper is broken I'm not entirely sure how it was fixed initially and whether it only became a failure issue because it started to rain heavily.

I think with him mentioning Grand Central by name he was trying to get people to understand it wasn't East Coasts fault their train had gone.

 

[reb0118]

[T]he East Coast staff were disinterested

I take it they offered impartial advice? Sorry to be a pedant, but my Mum picked me up on this the other day, in public too! I'm 47 3/4!

 

[Starmill]

I don't think this is a fair conclusion...the station I work at is run by LM but Virgin Trains/Southern/LOROL/Scotrail all serve it, the former and latter pay for Train Dispatch as well as customer service and Southern are part of the GoVia group anyway.

All of us platform staff help out no matter what TOC is concerned, whether it be organising taxis for onward travel if last connections are missed or helping with queries/assistances. Maybe that is just because we are a good bunch of staff who take pride in our work rather than try to fob passengers off!

A curious anomoly seems to exist in this fashion at Doncaster.

EMT clearly pay EC for staff dispatch here, because of their visiting HSTs + Meridians that rather need it I'd say. But Northern and TPE don't, so their trains are dispatched by their guards alone. So a Northern 153 at Doncaster won't be dispatched by the station staff, but an EMT 153 will do! I'm curious; do EC dispatch GC / HT at Doncaster? I watched the guard of a GC HST struggle all by herself at York recently.

 

[The North Briton]

If GC paid EC to despatch their trains, would the staff be more helpful? - Discuss

 

[LowLevel]

If GC paid EC to despatch their trains, would the staff be more helpful? - Discuss

I would have said so - you focus more on things that are your problem. Something that self dispatches and you're not paying any attention to 99 days out of 100 just fades out of interest and consideration.