Grand Central Discussion

[BOSCH]

Using a T key and the lock at the top of the carriage door. Just like any other door can be locked out of use. Yes there is no SDO on the HSTs but doors can be locked out of use.

No doors are ever locked out of use at short platforms !!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

hey bosch, any reason why 180107 was coming down from springburn down to heaton? she must be fixed so, what, refurbed?

107 has been refurbed,hence 105 went north this morning

 

[142094]

No doors are ever locked out of use at short platforms !!

Are you talking just on GC services or in general? I have definately been on a GC service, must be 2008 I think, and the guard came down the train and locked the door I was standing at.

 

[BOSCH]

Are you talking just on GC services or in general? I have definately been on a GC service, must be 2008 I think, and the guard came down the train and locked the door I was standing at.

GC services only !! That guard should never have locked that door off at all.I originally started as a guard and never ever locked a door off UNLESS defective !!!

 

[GNERman]

107 has been refurbed,hence 105 went north this morning

Excellent, the "unlucky one" out of the way for the moment, repainted?

 

[142094]

GC services only !! That guard should never have locked that door off at all.I originally started as a guard and never ever locked a door off UNLESS defective !!!

Right, I'll take your word for that, but what would happen if someone went to the wrong door and it wasn't locked out of use? Surely it would be better to lock the door just in case?

 

[Tomnick]

Rule Book module TW3 (preparation and movement of locomotive-hauled trains) states:

5.1 Doors which must be kept locked on
passenger trains
Before the train enters service, you must make sure that the
following doors are locked:
• gangway doors at each end of the train
• the doors on each side of a gangway connection which cannot
be made
• a door leading to an unattended brake compartment at the
extreme end of the train
• a door leading to any accommodation which is not in public use
or which is in special use
• a gangway door leading to sleeping car accommodation unless
access is needed to berths or a catering vehicle
• bodyside doors of brake vans carrying parcels
• mail compartments
• defective exterior doors
• exterior doors of parcel vans at the extreme ends of the train.
You must make sure that all other doors (internal or external) are
kept unlocked at all times.

It also seems reasonable that the following would apply if an exterior door was locked:

5.2 Defective doors
a) Entering service from a maintenance depot
You must not allow a vehicle or unit to enter service from a
maintenance depot, if any door is defective.
b) Entering service from somewhere other than a
maintenance depot
A vehicle can enter service with a defective door from somewhere
other than a maintenance depot, if you lock and label the door
OUT OF USE, as shown in section 5.3 of this module.
You must place the vehicle out of public use and, arrange to
transfer passengers to another vehicle, if:
• all doors normally used by the public are defective on one or
both sides of the vehicle (including doors used in an
emergency)
• a door at the leading end of the first passenger-carrying
vehicle is defective
• the trailing-end door of the last passenger carrying vehicle is
defective.

 

[spoony]

Very sure, before the platform at Eaglescliffe was lengthened, the guard made an announcement to people getting off that they had to use the doors towards the front and middle of the train. There were even signs there on the platform telling people to move along in the train. It has been the same at Hartlepool due to the renewal of the roof, with part of the train going beyond the useable part of the platform. Whether the doors are actually locked out of use I'm not sure but I'm sure I've seen it done a few times.

^^^^^I remember seeing this at Eaglescliffe as well.

 

[Sir_Clagalot]

There used to be some signs at Eaglescliffe at the North end before it was resurfaced advising passengers to move along the train to alight... Of course, some people just got off at that end of the train, but with the on board announcements and the signs, if they had tripped it would have been their own fault!

 

[Capybara]

I travelled frequently between Cheltenham and London in the eighties and early nineties when a full-length HST was the norm for through trains. These trains all stopped at Stonehouse which is, of course, a very short platform - not much more than two carriages. In those days a simple announcement was all that was needed for passengers to be in the correct part of the train. I don't recall there ever being a problem with passengers trying to get out on to the trackside. It's only twenty or so years ago but perhaps people were more sensible even then, and more inclined to listen to announcements. Or perhaps that there wasn't announcement overload made them more likely to listen.

 

[142094]

The main problem at Eaglescliffe was that the platform actually was long enough, but part of it had be disused for a number of years. So all GC HSTs were too long for the part in use. I can remember a few times that there were announcements but people getting on sometimes either did not see or took no notice of the platform signs (especially at night when you couldn't see them), so on some trains I travelled on the doors were actually locked.

 

[Lampshade]

BOSCH, Sir Clagalot:

I've heard (from a not-so reliable source) that HSTs are being strengthened to 7 coaches on weekends to cope with the Hitchin engineering works, any truth to this?

 

[GNERman]

due to most services being disrupted, the first monday morning train off KGX (0804) is extremely busy so an extra Standard coach is added to cope with extra demand...

 

[BOSCH]

BOSCH, Sir Clagalot:

I've heard (from a not-so reliable source) that HSTs are being strengthened to 7 coaches on weekends to cope with the Hitchin engineering works, any truth to this?

That past few weeks have indeed seen an HST set strengthened to 2+7 whilst the p/boro blockade takes place.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

due to most services being disrupted, the first monday morning train off KGX (0804) is extremely busy so an extra Standard coach is added to cope with extra demand...

Utter rubbish,the 0804 has never ever been "extremely busy" infact it has started at york the last couple of weeks !! :roll:

 

[tbtc]

Utter rubbish,the 0804 has never ever been "extremely busy" infact it has started at york the last couple of weeks !! :roll:

Is that for stock reasons/ disruptions/ staffing etc?

 

[BOSCH]

Is that for stock reasons/ disruptions/ staffing etc?

It has started from york on the monday due to not able to go through to kings x on sunday because of the p/boro blockade,it picks up its normal working on the monday from york to s/land and reverts to correct diagram for rest of day

 

[royaloak]

True, and my head says you're right...

...however you could also argue that 99% of stock is being used, meaning that there's a demand for any units out there - "spot hire" units like the Central Trains/ Porterbrook 170s.

I know it sounds naive, but I'd put money on any generic unit (e.g. a run of further 172s) being snapped up by some TOC. Just my optimism...

I can see what you mean, and agree, but would any TOC that has agreed terms with DafT then go and hire extra stock,
point 1 DafT would not be impressed
point 2 what about the profits! Any money spent on extra stock can only come out of the profits, nobody else is going to pay for them after all that is what the contract is for!

This is the joys of stupidly short franchises, the passenger is at the bottom of the pile. Is it right, no but until we start having longer franchises where the companies are allowed (or even encouraged) to innovate then things will stay as now, too many passengers, not enough decent length trains.

 

[Mojo]

Prior to the installation of SDO on the FGW fleet (necessary for stopping at stations with short platforms where there was not previously a HST fleet) there were a number of stations where HSTs stopped and where all doors were unlocked but where all doors were not alongside the platforms; allowed due to grandfather rights.

 

[GNERman]

Utter rubbish,the 0804 has never ever been "extremely busy" infact it has started at york the last couple of weeks !! :roll:

Sorry, I presumed that was the reason, in fact I thought that was what the GC website said...

 

[yorkie]

There have been 2 HST sets out for the past few days, they are formed as follows:

South to North:
43084 + TS + TS + TS + TS + TRSB + TF + 43123
43065 + TRSB +TF + TF + TF + TF + 43067

Times for tomorrow Sunday 11 April are here.

I have highlighted in bold the TFs used for first class; the others are declassified.

One of the departures in particular from York yesterday was absolutely brilliant, and reminded me of the days of Valentas on GNER/NXEC. The crews are friendly. The food on offer at the buffet car is pretty good these days.

Enjoy the Valentas while you can.

(And a reminder for anyone who is new to the forum who isn't on a pass, if you buy point to point tickets, to split your ticket at Hartlepool The price is so reasonable, there is no excuse!!)

 

[Lampshade]

There have been 2 HST sets out for the past few days, they are formed as follows:

South to North:
43084 + TS + TS + TS + TS + TRSB + TF + 43123
43065 + TRSB +TF + TF + TF + TF + 43067

I am very willing to bet those two will be out of service next time I go Valenta hunting

 

[Techniquest]

Typical innit, 43084's out at the moment and I'd love to go for it, but if I do she'll be taken out of service tonight! If I don't go for it, she'll be out and sounding fine! Options, options...

 

[BOSCH]

Typical innit, 43084's out at the moment and I'd love to go for it, but if I do she'll be taken out of service tonight! If I don't go for it, she'll be out and sounding fine! Options, options...

084 only has 4 power notches available !

 

[Techniquest]

Boo

Decided I'm going to try and take advantage of a possible GC HST bash tomorrow, might even have to shell out for the 1650 off the Cross
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
For the benefit of those not on gcrailgen (I think the message was posted by GNERman on here):

HST on 1A60 (0641 Sunderland to Kings Cross) passed Donny at 0840.

No mention of what power cars, but in theory that should then be on the 1127 back to Sunderland and 1730 back down to London. Hopefully it's not 43084 on that one, I want it on the 1918!

 

[GNERman]

Boo

Decided I'm going to try and take advantage of a possible GC HST bash tomorrow, might even have to shell out for the 1650 off the Cross
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
For the benefit of those not on gcrailgen (I think the message was posted by GNERman on here):

HST on 1A60 (0641 Sunderland to Kings Cross) passed Donny at 0840.

No mention of what power cars, but in theory that should then be on the 1127 back to Sunderland and 1730 back down to London. Hopefully it's not 43084 on that one, I want it on the 1918!

yep that was me, she has just gone north on 1127 ex kgx..

 

[Techniquest]

180112 worked the 1918 KGX > SUN yesterday, most frustrating! I see 43065+43068 worked the moves posted on here yesterday, if I had been able to do it today I'd have cleared them both for the magical thou!

 

[yorkie]

1918 KGX-SUN should be a HST today but there's always the chance of a diagram swap. Only one HST set out today.

 

[andylloyd]

1918 KGX-SUN should be a HST today but there's always the chance of a diagram swap. Only one HST set out today.

Thought as much as I saw one HST in the sheds at Heaton at approx 0940 whilst flying northbound to Berwick

 

[GNERman]

HST should work either 0641 or 0918 off SUN tomorow, most likely the 0641 then 1127 off KGX and 1730 off SUN, I think...

 

[yorkie]

Today would be a good day to go for the 1650 or 1918 as they're both currently allocated to be a HST, so it wouldn't matter (except to someone desperately trying to get a particular power car, I guess!) if the diagrams are swapped in London.

 

[Techniquest]

Haven't seen this mentioned anywhere else yet:

Read Todays Railways UK issue 101 a couple of days ago, in their HSTs section
they mention GC are to have their power cars renumbered into a 43901-906 series
upon re-engining. 43065 becoming 43901, 067 902, 068 903, 080 904, 084 095 and
123 906.

Just wondering if anyone knows if this is true.

Also, Driff47844 reports on HSTgen that 43067+43084 worked 1A63 last night, so in theory that puts them on 0804 KGX > SUN, 1230 SUN > KGX and 1918 KGX > SUN today. Got started on planning moves to London later but then realised there was a good chance of getting bowled out again, so decided to hold back on the desperate leap to London for now. Hoping they do the 1730 SUN > KGX tomorrow, might be able to make a GC bash on Friday if so