Gold Card £5 first class upgrades

[class303]

That'd be absolutely fine. The travelcard would be valid from 10am on a weekday (all day at the weekend), with the supplement having the same validity except it can't be used to depart a London Terminal, or travel between Clapham Junction and London, between 4pm and 7pm on weekdays.

In theory it'd be absolutely fine? what about in practice? What's the chances of them issuing it correctly? maybe i'll try it and report back.

 

[CyrusWuff]

As a Gold Card First Supplement has to be purchased for a specific journey, and is explicitly only valid for one Single or Return journey on a given day, I don't believe there's a way of issuing one such that you could effectively use it as a First Class Travelcard.

 

[TonyR]

One the way back, the train manager didn't know how to issue it & initially thought it was only available at weekends - when I showed him the upgrade ticket I had got for the outward journey he accepted it was valid on weekdays and said he would find out & get back to me. no one came back before the train had arrived into Paddington!

You wouldn't have needed one for the way back if it was on the same day. Although the supplement says its for A to B, its also valid for B to A on the same day. Others might be able to clarify but there is some suggestion that the destinations are irrelevant and its valid for all valid trains in the Network Southeast area for the day.

 

[TonyR]

As a Gold Card First Supplement has to be purchased for a specific journey, and is explicitly only valid for one Single or Return journey on a given day, I don't believe there's a way of issuing one such that you could effectively use it as a First Class Travelcard.

Its not clear that"s right. According to the section on Gold Card First Supplements on the National Rail website:

Holders of Annual Gold Cards Season Tickets and Travelcards may buy a special First Class upgrade for £5.00 (children £2.50) when travelling on a Standard Class ticket which has received an Annual Gold Card discount.
This allows travel in First Class accommodation on trains within the Network Railcard area on for the date shown on the supplement ticket. If the return journey is made on another day, a further Supplement ticket must be purchased.

Which implies that once bought you can use it on any train that day.

 

[TonyR]

I know how to do them on all of the ticket issuing systems I've come across at work. I wasn't shown - I just play around with the software when it's quiet to see what I can find. Even if I was shown during training, I'd probably forget as it's one of those once-in-a-blue-moon requests. When I worked at a London terminal, I only sold one in a year.

So if you ever manage to find me at work, rest assured you, any mystery shoppers, investigative journalists or any customer will be able to obtain your Gold Card supplements without any problems

You are a rare exception in my experience. When I asked at KGX the other day in a quiet period only one of about seven staff on the desks knew how to do it and even he spent some time playing around to find it. Why is it that unlike most industries there is not a manual at each desk that they can look up how to do anything they don't know how to do?

My MO now is first to ask "Do you know how to issue a Gold Card First Upgrade". If they answer yes, I buy one. If they say no, I just ask for a standard ticket & travel in First anyway and argue it out with the RPI if challenged. I don't see why I should not enjoy a benefit I am entitled to just because the TOC staff training is incompetent. If they were to ever try to challenge it, I have plenty of emails to Customer Services complaining about it. On FCC the problem is compounded by the ability of an RPI to issue one being removed from their machines a few years ago. In some ways that makes dealing with challenges easier by saying "The clerk at the station couldn't issue one but I'm more than willing to pay the £5 if you can issue one."

 

[Flamingo]

We got issued a memo about them a few years ago, I keep it in my pocket, and have used it two or three times.

Last time I told the chap the codes and he wrote them on the back of his gold card for future reference!

On-board they are a real rarity, as they are supposed to be purchased before boarding, (if an open booking office etc.), and TBH I would not even think to offer one.

 

[stut]

My experience of these is mixed - it's an odd mix of locations that know them and don't. I've had no luck at King's Cross or St Pancras (maybe I've been exceptionally unlucky here as the staff often don't know how to excess an off-peak to a peak ticket, and advised me to keep an excess ticket so they can see how it's done!). But at Biggleswade and Brockenhurst, no problem at all.

Paddington has been the best - never a question or quizzical look.

At several Southern stations, I've been told that the ticket was discontinued several years ago.

TBH, I rarely use it, but it can be very good for the longer SWT and FGW runs inside the network zone, or to/from Brighton on a 319 on a busy day!

 

[philjo]

You wouldn't have needed one for the way back if it was on the same day. Although the supplement says its for A to B, its also valid for B to A on the same day. Others might be able to clarify but there is some suggestion that the destinations are irrelevant and its valid for all valid trains in the Network Southeast area for the day.

I wasn't returning the same day. I was travelling out on a Friday and returning on the following Monday using a SVR. This is what caused the problems at my local station. I had bought them there with a CDR before but the lady in the ticket office couldn't get the machine to issue the supplements for different days for the same ticket (which I had already bought).

 

[Be3G]

I had bought them there with a CDR before but the lady in the ticket office couldn't get the machine to issue the supplements for different days for the same ticket (which I had already bought).

There appear to be two different ways of issuing these supplements. One is as an excess to a specific ticket, which would cause the difficulty you describe. However, they can also be issued as ‘standalone’ supplement tickets which have no link to any other ticket, which in my experience is their most common manifestation. Issuing them that way, there should be no problem trying to get what you needed. How they're issued must be just down to the staff member or ticket issuing system in use by that staff member I suppose.

 

[Flying Snail]

My experience of these is mixed - it's an odd mix of locations that know them and don't. I've had no luck at King's Cross or St Pancras (maybe I've been exceptionally unlucky here as the staff often don't know how to excess an off-peak to a peak ticket, and advised me to keep an excess ticket so they can see how it's done!). But at Biggleswade and Brockenhurst, no problem at all.

Paddington has been the best - never a question or quizzical look.

At several Southern stations, I've been told that the ticket was discontinued several years ago.

TBH, I rarely use it, but it can be very good for the longer SWT and FGW runs inside the network zone, or to/from Brighton on a 319 on a busy day!

I think you have provided your own answer as to why certain locations are familiar with them. I would guess that the relative high quality of First Class on FGW and SWT (444/159) mean there is more demand on their lines opposed to most other NSE lines where even a fiver is pushing it for the extra benefits of the upgrade.

 

[stut]

I think you have provided your own answer as to why certain locations are familiar with them. I would guess that the relative high quality of First Class on FGW and SWT (444/159) mean there is more demand on their lines opposed to most other NSE lines where even a fiver is pushing it for the extra benefits of the upgrade.

Very good point.

I suspect Biggleswade is the oddity in that trend, mostly because it has a thoroughly excellent, knowledgeable team, for whom nothing is too much trouble. I've praised them on here before, and I'll do it again!

 

[RJ]

There appear to be two different ways of issuing these supplements. One is as an excess to a specific ticket, which would cause the difficulty you describe. However, they can also be issued as ‘standalone’ supplement tickets which have no link to any other ticket, which in my experience is their most common manifestation. Issuing them that way, there should be no problem trying to get what you needed. How they're issued must be just down to the staff member or ticket issuing system in use by that staff member I suppose.

With Tribute, the only way I knew of to do it was to select a fare, then attach the supplement before basketing the lot. No option was provided to basket it as a standalone ticket or change the date from that of the selected ticket, but I found ways around the latter.

 

[CyrusWuff]

There appear to be two different ways of issuing these supplements. One is as an excess to a specific ticket, which would cause the difficulty you describe. However, they can also be issued as ‘standalone’ supplement tickets which have no link to any other ticket, which in my experience is their most common manifestation. Issuing them that way, there should be no problem trying to get what you needed. How they're issued must be just down to the staff member or ticket issuing system in use by that staff member I suppose.

On both FasTIS and Avantix Mobile, and if using Journey Planner (formerly RJIS) with any other TIS, they have to be issued for a specific flow, and the text in The Manual (as quoted in my Post 16 in this thread) implies the same, despite what the National Rail site says.

I would suggest that boarding in First Class on a train from Kings Cross to Cambridge with a Gold Card First Supplement issued for London Terminals to Ashford International would cause "issues"...Though I'd also guess that you'd have "issues" with one issued for Kings Cross to Cambridge with some of their RPIs.

 

[Be3G]

On both FasTIS and Avantix Mobile, and if using Journey Planner (formerly RJIS) with any other TIS, they have to be issued for a specific flow, and the text in The Manual (as quoted in my Post 16 in this thread) implies the same, despite what the National Rail site says.

Ah yes, but that wasn't quite what I was getting at. I think all gold card supplements we've purchased have been issued from a specific origin to destination, but looking beyond that I've seen two forms: one is where the ticket seems to be issued as an excess (i.e. it says something about only being valid with another specific ticket), whereas the other is issued as a ‘normal’ standalone ticket. I theorise that the former format is what causes issues if someone needs supplements for different days on the same return ticket.

I probably should add that it's been a few years since I last used one of these supplements so I suppose things might have changed! (I still remember when they were a mere £3 – a great price.)

 

[CyrusWuff]

Thinking on it some more, it's possible that the Supplement may have been removed from some Avantix machines, in which case it would have to be fudged through as a STD-1ST Excess and have a handwritten endorsement identifying it as a Gold Card one.

I'll have to have a play around and see what prints if I try issuing one. Of course, the "easiest" way to produce the desired effect would be to manually create the ticket in the TIS...but that could also result in ATOC being displeased.

 

[34D]

On-board they are a real rarity, as they are supposed to be purchased before boarding, (if an open booking office etc.), and TBH I would not even think to offer one.

Erm on the 5th March 2012 you said the opposite: link

 

[bb21]

Erm on the 5th March 2012 you said the opposite: link

I don't think he was talking about Gold Card upgrade in the other thread.

 

[Deerfold]

I don't think he was talking about Gold Card upgrade in the other thread.

No, that's on about weekend 1st.

 

[Flamingo]

Erm on the 5th March 2012 you said the opposite: link

I wasn't referring to Gold Card upgrades, they would never have even crossed my mind on that thread...