GN Class 717

[Fred26]

It was dealt with quickly and the train left under its own steam (!).

There are actually quite a few reports of fire/smoke at Moorgate, and sometimes I wonder if it's down to a spark from the third rail lighting rubbish, or someone thinking they saw smoke which was actually someone vaping at the end of the platform. Many reports of smoke turn out to be false alarms, which gives credence to my theory.

If you saw it yourself you'd know it wasn't the latter.
It's usually down to oil/rubbish sparking. Flames aren't common, usually just smouldering and a lot of smoke.

 

[jon0844]

Fair enough. I just assumed that as people have no issues vaping on public transport that it could lead to false alarms. As you say, I'm not there often.

 

[717001]

Am hoping these will come into service on schedule but haven't seen any signs on realtraintimes of test runs into Moorgate happening this week or scheduled for next. Wondering if anyone knows whether things are on hold or if they are running elsewhere?

 

[700007]

Am hoping these will come into service on schedule but haven't seen any signs on realtraintimes of test runs into Moorgate happening this week or scheduled for next. Wondering if anyone knows whether things are on hold or if they are running elsewhere?

Hey it is my cousin!

 

[717001]

Hey it is my cousin!

Yes! Hoping to make it to the UK one day but still in Germany for now (I think!)

 

[BowesRanger]

Yes! Hoping to make it to the UK one day but still in Germany for now (I think!)

Two of the units are in the sidings at hornsey. A third is in the train care facility, and has been since the fire I think... You can see them all from the train as you pass.

 

[Agent_Squash]

Two of the units are in the sidings at hornsey. A third is in the train care facility, and has been since the fire I think... You can see them all from the train as you pass.

I think the member is referring to 717001, which is still in Germany.

 

[387star]

Odd that these will have charging sockets for such short journeys

 

[jon0844]

Odd that these will have charging sockets for such short journeys

More odd that the 700s didn't get them throughout. I think any new train should have them, although I wonder how it will work if TfL takes over the service?

 

[Domh245]

More odd that the 700s didn't get them throughout. I think any new train should have them, although I wonder how it will work if TfL takes over the service?

The new 710s are going to have USB sockets (36 per vehicle) so TfL aren't opposed to the idea of them

 

[jon0844]

The new 710s are going to have USB sockets (36 per vehicle) so TfL aren't opposed to the idea of them

That's good then. Personally, I think the 717s could have done with simple USB-A ports and not a 3 pin socket. Make it USB-PD compliant and it would be fine for charging phones and modern laptops and tablets.

 

[jellybaby]

I think the 717s could have done with simple USB-A ports and not a 3 pin socket.

I think any low voltage thing you put in today will be out dated and useless in 40 years time, or even 20 assuming they get a mid-life refurb.

 

[jon0844]

I think any low voltage thing you put in today will be out dated and useless in 40 years time, or even 20 assuming they get a mid-life refurb.

Perhaps, but I don't see USB-A ports going anywhere soon. USB-C may be the new standard, but USB-A to USB-C (and then of course anything else, like micro-USB, Lightning etc) cables are plentiful and small enough for anyone to carry, especially if they have their own power bank and use that cable.

Will they need higher voltages or amperages as time goes on? If anything, technology will go the other way and we'll be fine with less.

 

[jellybaby]

You can't charge most (any?) laptops with a USB-A port either.

 

[jon0844]

You can't charge most (any?) laptops with a USB-A port either.

As I said, it would need to be USB-PD compliant (which I am sure it would be, as it is for charging not data). I can ONLY charge my laptop this way. Likewise the new MacBooks are USB-C, and other high-end laptops.

If USB-A can't do that, then have a USB-C port instead (or both). Still a lot smaller than 240V sockets.

 

[jellybaby]

I can ONLY charge my laptop this way.

Your laptop didn't come with a mains adaptor in the box?

Still a lot smaller than 240V sockets.

The sockets tucked under the seat seem out of the way where they could be many times bigger and it still not be a problem. I suppose it is more bulk for people to carry as they need a charger rather than just a cable.

 

[jon0844]

It came with a phone style power adapter, with a USB cable. I can charge my phone with it, or my Nintendo Switch or anything else with USB-C. Likewise I can use other chargers to charge it (albeit slowly if not USB-PD).

The MacBook only has a USB-C port!

 

[GW43125]

717005 was visible in Hornsey depot this afternoon. Assuming it's been parked since delivery?

 

[Class455]

717005 was visible in Hornsey depot this afternoon. Assuming it's been parked since delivery?

As was 717007.
Have any 313's gone off lease yet?

 

[Fred26]

As was 717007.
Have any 313's gone off lease yet?

Last I head the 717s aren't even under GTR management until October, when testing is expect to be completed on the first unit(s), so I would doubt it.

 

[Aictos]

Last I head the 717s aren't even under GTR management until October, when testing is expect to be completed on the first unit(s), so I would doubt it.

Seeing as they were meant to enter passenger service this year, I wager that they're likely to be delayed entering said service and it won't be until 2019 that they will see passenger services and the last 313 service won't be until May 2019.

This takes into account the training and conversion training of the drivers as well.

That's how much confidence I have in the GTR leadership.

 

[Mikey C]

Odd that these will have charging sockets for such short journeys

Agreed, during rush hours with people crammed in and lots of standees, it does feel like a bit of an irrelevance

 

[jon0844]

Seeing as they were meant to enter passenger service this year, I wager that they're likely to be delayed entering said service and it won't be until 2019 that they will see passenger services and the last 313 service won't be until May 2019.

This takes into account the training and conversion training of the drivers as well.

That's how much confidence I have in the GTR leadership.

It takes two weeks to train each driver so I don't think that's as big an issue as the signal sighting problems and other work that is down to Network Rail.

If there are fires starting then questions must be asked about what is happening to keeping the lineside areas clear. If it is down to a train fault then that will obviously cause delays.

I am not sure GTR can be blamed just yet. Give it time!

 

[717001]

GN have updated their website to recognise that some units have arrived in the UK - saying first train into passenger service "in the autumn": https://www.greatnorthernrail.com/717trains

 

[choochoochoo]

Anybody have any thoughts why they decided one pantograph would be enough for 6 cars ? I know 3/4 cars run around with one pan, but surely 2 pans would offer some redundancy, especially for 6 cars. And then there is always gapping to think about too.

 

[sprunt]

Isn't all the seating in these longitudinal? Given that, where will the power sockets be located?

 

[717001]

Isn't all the seating in these longitudinal? Given that, where will the power sockets be located?

They are on the front of the seat - below the "padding"

 

[Domh245]

The seating on the 717s is conventional 2+2 transverse.

 

[Mikey C]

The seating on the 717s is conventional 2+2 transverse.

A bit inconsistent really if new trains from Moorgate have transverse seats, whereas the TfL new trains from Liverpool Street have longitudinal ones. Especially when for the last 40 years they've operated with near identical stock (313s and 315s)

 

[SteveOfTheStow]

A bit inconsistent really if new trains from Moorgate have transverse seats, whereas the TfL new trains from Liverpool Street have longitudinal ones. Especially when for the last 40 years they've operated with near identical stock (313s and 315s)

This came up on the 710 thread and I had a stab at trying to understand (not justify, mind) why transverse might have happened: https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/class-710-lo.145774/page-15#post-3519847

Also, two different manufacturers (Bombardier vs Siemens), and two different clients (GTR vs TfL), so, yes, unfortunately seemingly inconsistent from a passenger perspective, but the deals are completely unrelated at the order level, and GTR being the client, seem to have thought that transverse would be better for their product than longitudinal.