Football

[DarloRich]

It is a very sad state of affairs that Plymouth Argyle now find themselves and to see them in Division 2 is bad enough, then you see what position they occupy in that division...:cry:

I only hope that they do not emulate Stockport County, who went from the Championship - Division 1 - Division 2 - Conference in very quick succession, and they are now struggling in the Conference..:roll:

And we beat Stockport County 3-4 last night which was a VERY much needed win.

 

[SS4]

I'm afraid the Manager is largely academic....

With one or two exceptions we just don't have the players we had 15,20 or 30 years ago.

The Premier League and sky money has let all "the foreigners" in replacing the Scot's , Irish and Welsh who used to make up the backbone of most great English Club sides.

The knock on effect is mediocrity

Cannot agree more. England are going the same way now though

 

[blackettstreet]

Well here we go Spain v Scotland ....

it's on BBC1 Scotland and BBC1 England with different teams covering the same match

oh noooooo!!!! :cry: i didn't know it was on, missed it! :cry: :cry:

 

[MidnightFlyer]

oh noooooo!!!! :cry: i didn't know it was on, missed it! :cry: :cry:

The only half-decent thing you missed was David Goodwillie with one of the most selfish / unaware misses you will ever see in association rules football.

 

[blackettstreet]

Cannot agree more. England are going the same way now though

absolutely. at least these new rules about home-grown players will help english players get more chances.
i personally admire barcelona for having so many homegrown/ spanish players. even messi has been living there for years. and look what benefits it has given! a beautiful, flowing passing game with an almost telepathic understanding between players. man city could learn a lot from them!

 

[MidnightFlyer]

absolutely. at least these new rules about home-grown players will help english players get more chances.
i personally admire barcelona for having so many homegrown/ spanish players. even messi has been living there for years. and look what benefits it has given! a beautiful, flowing passing game with an almost telepathic understanding between players. man city could learn a lot from them!

Barca? Beautiful, flowing, telepathic?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhoBrOvs0DE&feature=related

Their football is beautiful, but they also have to resort to cheating methods at times, as is demonstrated above.

I wouldn't really tell a Barca fan that their team is 'Spanish' either!

 

[Minilad]

I see the Liverpool managing director Ian Ayre reckons the big clubs should be allowed to negotiate their own TV deals abroad. His argument is that overseas viewers only tune in to watch the big teams and teams like Bolton (his choice) don't have the same appeal.
Well in my opinion if football at the top level isn't destroyed enough already it soon will be if Ayres gets his disgusting greedy arrogant way.

 

[blackettstreet]

Barca? Beautiful, flowing, telepathic?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhoBrOvs0DE&feature=related

Their football is beautiful, but they also have to resort to cheating methods at times, as is demonstrated above.

I wouldn't really tell a Barca fan that their team is 'Spanish' either!

I don't admire the diving that happens in spanish football, watching real vs barca was idiotic. they're great players but a bunch of divers as well!

i know not all of barca's team is spanish - alves, abidal etc - but they really do have a lot of spanish players - valdes, puyol, pique, xavi, busquets, fabregas, iniesta, villa, pedro......

 

[MidnightFlyer]

i know not all of barca's team is spanish - alves, abidal etc - but they really do have a lot of spanish players - valdes, puyol, pique, xavi, busquets, fabregas, iniesta, villa, pedro......

I was referring to Catalonia and the mass support it has from Barcelona (as in splitting away from Spain).

 

[YorkshireRider]

I see the Liverpool managing director Ian Ayre reckons the big clubs should be allowed to negotiate their own TV deals abroad. His argument is that overseas viewers only tune in to watch the big teams and teams like Bolton (his choice) don't have the same appeal.
Well in my opinion if football at the top level isn't destroyed enough already it soon will be if Ayres gets his disgusting greedy arrogant way.

Agreed, cant believe he came out and said that, how disrespectful to the other clubs who may rely on this money.

 

[Butts]

Agreed, cant believe he came out and said that, how disrespectful to the other clubs who may rely on this money.

Considering the heights from which Liverpool have fallen, you would think he would be more aware and sensitive.

 

[alexjames]

Of course other clubs need the money.

The underlying problem is that many PL clubs are having their otherwise unsustainable businesses propped up by TV money. Ayres' point (and he did not express it well judging from the quotes I have read) is that TV rights are the property of the club playing at home. The more popular clubs are subsidising the others because of the PL TV revenue sharing arrangements. That is they do not get the full benefit of the TV rights to their home matches.

Let us examine Wigan. Last season they received about £41M in PL TV money. A generous estimate of their home matches value is about £10M. That value arises from their games vs ManU, Liverpool etc. There is little or no value in their matches vs Blackburn etc. Thus the more popular teams in the PL are subsidising Wigan to the tune of £30M per year. Much the same arithmetic applies for Blackburn, Bolton, WBA, Fulham, QPR and others.

We have a situation where the more successful businesses in a market are heavily subsidising their direct competitors. This would not be considered acceptable elsewhere. Its a ludicrous idea. Take pubs for example - a levy on successful pubs in order that the unpopulated dump of a boozer down the road stays in business. No sane person would support that idea.

The sole defence to the current arrangements is that it keeps the lesser teams relatively competetive thus ensuring the health of the PL and consequentially enhancing its marketability. There is some merit in that argument. But the Spanish analogy does not support the theory. Barcelona and RM get the lions share of TV money (they have recently agreed a modest reduction) and are the sole credible candidates to win La Liga but the TV rights for the league remain valuable. What happens is that the viewing numbers for the leading pair of clubs are very high (I understand that about half of the Spanish TV viewing audience consider themselves supporters of one or other of the two leading clubs. Of course they are deluding themselves - if they were supporters that is what they would be doing - attending matches rather than sitting on sofas) and the numbers tuning in for Villareal vs Mallorca, for example, remain low. Overall, the aggregate viewing numbers are satisfactory, at least, to the TV companies concerned plus their advertisers.

A partial solution to the problem is to allow the PL clubs to sell their home TV rights for whatever they can get. Wigan etc then become completely unviable businesses and are soon relegated. That in itself does not improve the competetiveness of the PL because they would be replaced by two or three equally unviable teams. The solution to that is to reduce the PL to 16 teams. Far too much PL football is played (to the detriment of contenders in the CL and to the disadvantage of sundry national sides and it is damaging to the fitness or injury levels of many players) and a reduction is overdue. That is one thing that Ferguson, Wenger and the managers of the other leading teams will agree on. Only Ferguson admits it in public - the others do not because they fear a very negative reaction. Perhaps I should rephrase my "too much PL football is played...." statement above. Too much sub PL standard football is played in the PL. Wigan vs Blackburn is rarely a good standard. It has little appeal - neither team will fill their ground for it and the TV audience is dismal. I propose that the health of the PL would be improved if such substandard fare was partially eliminated.

 

[ole man]

I've just seen Wayne Rooney has been banned for 3 games, is it worth taking him?. I can't see England doing that well there.
And is the ban harsh, or is because he's English?

 

[MidnightFlyer]

I've just seen Wayne Rooney has been banned for 3 games, is it worth taking him?. I can't see England doing that well there.
And is the ban harsh, or is because he's English?

Now that it has been extended I don't. Plenty of young blood could have come through before then, but I personally (as it stands) would take D. Bent, Caroll, Agbonlahor and Defoe, but a lot can change in a year...

And is the ban harsh, or is because he's English?

No, it's because he's a chavvy thug.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

If one single striker can be the cause of so much media speculation this week, does this not reflect upon the paucity of talented strikers who are qualified to represent England at the highest level of international football. But it is typical of the British media to blow such a story out of all proportion in their usual attempts to print "media-grabbing" back-page headline stories.

If this had been a player from Germany, Spain, France, Italy, etc, there would not have been the same amount of media speculation in the sports press of their own countries.

 

[blackettstreet]

Does this not reflect upon the paucity of talented strikers who are qualified to represent England at the highest level of international football.

If this had been a player from Germany, Spain, France, Italy, etc, there would not have been the same amount of media speculation in the sports press of their own countries.

or, if it wasn't rooney!

i'm not really sure about england's other strikers.....carroll's talented but drinks too much; crouch and defoe are getting on a little bit, and not as reliable as rooney; young's not really a number 9......and bent is a joke!

if we don't take rooney, i would go with defoe up front - the bulgaria hattrick proved he has ability

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Republic of Ireland will play Estonia in the two-legged play off matches for the European 2012 Championship.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

Come on Estonia!

 

[Butts]

Republic of Ireland will play Estonia in the two-legged play off matches for the European 2012 Championship.

That's great news - should be joining England at the Tournament !!

Wonder why ROI are so much more s'ful than NI - is it just population

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

In the European 2012 Championship competition, the team who had the best group runner-up record and thus automatically reached the final stages without having to play in the play-off matches was Sweden.

 

[SS4]

absolutely. at least these new rules about home-grown players will help english players get more chances.
i personally admire barcelona for having so many homegrown/ spanish players. even messi has been living there for years. and look what benefits it has given! a beautiful, flowing passing game with an almost telepathic understanding between players. man city could learn a lot from them!

Don't kid yourself. People under 21 are exempt in nationality and number and magically become English if they're here long enough. Such rules made Fabregas English! What will happen is that kids will be brought in.

An overhaul of the international system is needed IMO - you can either play for one of either your place of birth or your parents' place of birth.

Furthermore the issue about academy players was quietly changed to benefit the PL at the expense of everyone else (so what's new?)

I see the Liverpool managing director Ian Ayre reckons the big clubs should be allowed to negotiate their own TV deals abroad. His argument is that overseas viewers only tune in to watch the big teams and teams like Bolton (his choice) don't have the same appeal.
Well in my opinion if football at the top level isn't destroyed enough already it soon will be if Ayres gets his disgusting greedy arrogant way.

Agreed. If Liverpool want to get more money they can sod off to a league which will give them more money! It's not like they care about the fans beyond their £££s. There is something inherently wrong in the game when a club like Everton who have been consistently good in the PL do not have money.

I've just seen Wayne Rooney has been banned for 3 games, is it worth taking him?. I can't see England doing that well there.
And is the ban harsh, or is because he's English?

It's because he's English. The transgression merited the punishment

If one single striker can be the cause of so much media speculation this week, does this not reflect upon the paucity of talented strikers who are qualified to represent England at the highest level of international football. But it is typical of the British media to blow such a story out of all proportion in their usual attempts to print "media-grabbing" back-page headline stories.

If this had been a player from Germany, Spain, France, Italy, etc, there would not have been the same amount of media speculation in the sports press of their own countries.

The English media doesn't care if England succeed or fail, you can tell by what they print at important times.

 

[Zoe]

Don't kid yourself. People under 21 are exempt in nationality and number and magically become English if they're here long enough. Such rules made Fabregas English! What will happen is that kids will be brought in.

You have to have held a British passport though at the time you first played for a national team at youth level though or you can't play for England. This is why Areteta can never play for England as he played for the Spain U16 side and didn't have a British passport at that time.

 

[Minilad]

Of course other clubs need the money.

The underlying problem is that many PL clubs are having their otherwise unsustainable businesses propped up by TV money. Ayres' point (and he did not express it well judging from the quotes I have read) is that TV rights are the property of the club playing at home. The more popular clubs are subsidising the others because of the PL TV revenue sharing arrangements. That is they do not get the full benefit of the TV rights to their home matches.

Let us examine Wigan. Last season they received about £41M in PL TV money. A generous estimate of their home matches value is about £10M. That value arises from their games vs ManU, Liverpool etc. There is little or no value in their matches vs Blackburn etc. Thus the more popular teams in the PL are subsidising Wigan to the tune of £30M per year. Much the same arithmetic applies for Blackburn, Bolton, WBA, Fulham, QPR and others.

We have a situation where the more successful businesses in a market are heavily subsidising their direct competitors. This would not be considered acceptable elsewhere. Its a ludicrous idea. Take pubs for example - a levy on successful pubs in order that the unpopulated dump of a boozer down the road stays in business. No sane person would support that idea.

The sole defence to the current arrangements is that it keeps the lesser teams relatively competetive thus ensuring the health of the PL and consequentially enhancing its marketability. There is some merit in that argument. But the Spanish analogy does not support the theory. Barcelona and RM get the lions share of TV money (they have recently agreed a modest reduction) and are the sole credible candidates to win La Liga but the TV rights for the league remain valuable. What happens is that the viewing numbers for the leading pair of clubs are very high (I understand that about half of the Spanish TV viewing audience consider themselves supporters of one or other of the two leading clubs. Of course they are deluding themselves - if they were supporters that is what they would be doing - attending matches rather than sitting on sofas) and the numbers tuning in for Villareal vs Mallorca, for example, remain low. Overall, the aggregate viewing numbers are satisfactory, at least, to the TV companies concerned plus their advertisers.

A partial solution to the problem is to allow the PL clubs to sell their home TV rights for whatever they can get. Wigan etc then become completely unviable businesses and are soon relegated. That in itself does not improve the competetiveness of the PL because they would be replaced by two or three equally unviable teams. The solution to that is to reduce the PL to 16 teams. Far too much PL football is played (to the detriment of contenders in the CL and to the disadvantage of sundry national sides and it is damaging to the fitness or injury levels of many players) and a reduction is overdue. That is one thing that Ferguson, Wenger and the managers of the other leading teams will agree on. Only Ferguson admits it in public - the others do not because they fear a very negative reaction. Perhaps I should rephrase my "too much PL football is played...." statement above. Too much sub PL standard football is played in the PL. Wigan vs Blackburn is rarely a good standard. It has little appeal - neither team will fill their ground for it and the TV audience is dismal. I propose that the health of the PL would be improved if such substandard fare was partially eliminated.

With all due respect that is the biggest load of rubbish I have ever read on here

 

[YorkshireRider]

With all due respect that is the biggest load of rubbish I have ever read on here

Absolutley, if PL clubs are told they get X amount of money per year from t.v then they can budget around that. Wigan and Bolton (the team Aryes uses as an example) are well run clubs that spend within there means, if this money helps them spend a little more on wages then that can only help the competitivness of the PL. Why should they have the rug pulled from under them by greedy clubs. Anyway Ferguson agrees with the way the money is distributed and as Owen Coyle has said you will need at least 14 PL clubs to vote in favour of any changes 'no chance', so go forth and multiply Aryes you greedy prick.

Reducing the number of teams in the PL is a tricky one, but it should go down to no less than 18 if done at all.

 

[ole man]

You cant use language like that, however you disagree that is not the way

 

[ACE1888]

Gotta love Sky (Again) Man Utd v Liverpool tomorrow, it's suddenly the 'Biggest game in the world', wait until Utd play City (soon I believe), then no doubt that will be! Nobody cared about Man City there until they had Money, bit like Chelski not so long ago too....hmmm
Steve Cotterill new Forest Boss, will do well there I expect...and still no 'Takeover' at poor old Argyle...shocking state of affairs...

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Gotta love Sky (Again) Man Utd v Liverpool tomorrow, it's suddenly the 'Biggest game in the world'

I suppose that the 1-1 draw was not really an unexpected result at Anfield.

The Kilmarnock v Celtic game was rather more dramatic with Kilmarnock 3-0 up at half time, but then Celtic scored three goals in five minutes in the second half to let the final result be a 3-3 draw.

 

[SS4]

Norwich and Swansea sounds more interesting.

Here's hoping for an away win in the United Arab Emirates Manchester

 

[HST Power]

Here's hoping for an away win in the United Arab Emirates Manchester

I'm sure the FA are much more concerned about the money quality of football.

 

[Prodigy]

Pretty dissapointed with Manchester United's result today at Anfield but I suppose it's better than the most recent past games there. Didn't watch but heard Fergie ballsed the tactics up and De Gea pretty much saved us.