Football

[Tetchytyke]

You have a huge name in Italian football saying that there are too many black players, yet it's "English football" that is full of racists. Of course. Italy and eastern Europe are far far worse.

You get idiots at every club, it's not just about Chelsea. Those fans are clearly idiots (did they not notice what colour Drogba was?), and they don't behave like that here because they know they won't get away with it. In France they clearly thought they would.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

You get idiots at every club, it's not just about Chelsea. Those fans are clearly idiots (did they not notice what colour Drogba was?), and they don't behave like that here because they know they won't get away with it. In France they clearly thought they would.

They must be low in intelligence if they do not know how much of the African continent, not just the north African countries, were part of the French empire in days of yore.

 

[CC 72100]

You have a huge name in Italian football saying that there are too many black players, yet it's "English football" that is full of racists. Of course. Italy and eastern Europe are far far worse.

You get idiots at every club, it's not just about Chelsea. Those fans are clearly idiots (did they not notice what colour Drogba was?), and they don't behave like that here because they know they won't get away with it. In France they clearly thought they would.

I agree - I think that racism in the English game has dramatically reduced (I'm not saying that 'war' is won, but many of the key 'battles' are), however incidences like this which are isolated but then reported in the press make it seem as if things haven't moved on. There is always a 'press lag' on these sorts of themes - recurrence of isolated incidences does nothing to help with this.

As you say, looking at the bigger picture, things are far worse elsewhere, particularly in Russia, which makes the world cup there deplorable given the social situation there with this sort of thing. (A well debated point, probably not worth another debate on!)

To take nothing away from the incident, in my experience some of the behaviour on the metro in Paris would not take place here - I'm not trying to make out that racism is common in Paris, but I know for a fact that women feel particularly unsafe on the metro, and many of my colleagues reported instances of behaviour that we'd probably consider sexual assault.

 

[Antman]

I agree - I think that racism in the English game has dramatically reduced (I'm not saying that 'war' is won, but many of the key 'battles' are), however incidences like this which are isolated but then reported in the press make it seem as if things haven't moved on. There is always a 'press lag' on these sorts of themes - recurrence of isolated incidences does nothing to help with this.

As you say, looking at the bigger picture, things are far worse elsewhere, particularly in Russia, which makes the world cup there deplorable given the social situation there with this sort of thing. (A well debated point, probably not worth another debate on!)

To take nothing away from the incident, in my experience some of the behaviour on the metro in Paris would not take place here - I'm not trying to make out that racism is common in Paris, but I know for a fact that women feel particularly unsafe on the metro, and many of my colleagues reported instances of behaviour that we'd probably consider sexual assault.

My sister spent some time living in France and sexism and such like is far more commonplace over there.

I do think we go a bit too far to the opposite extreme in this country sometimes but the incident in Paris is totally unacceptable and shouldn't be used as a stick to beat Chelsea fans with, of course Didier Drogba is a living legend.
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A bit of nonsense over who should take Liverpool's penalty last night with Balotelli, Sturridge and Henderson looking like three little kids squabbling over it.

Steve Gerrard watching in the studio didn't pull any punches about it.

 

[Drogba11CFC]

Winchester City 4...Moneyfields 0 (Robinson 24, 48, Dempsey 66, Bentley 68; Bayley s/o 37) Attendance: 462

Perhaps the best night of the season, even more than the 4-3 win over Winchester Castle. The biggest attendance of the season as well, and we go within three points of second-placed Moneyfields with two games in hand.

Unfortunately, my enjoyment of the match was marred slightly. I found myself near the club shop after waiting in the queue for the snack bar. I found one of my fellow regulars and asked him what he was doing at the weekend, thinking he'd have a ticket to the Southampton game. He then looked pointedly at me and said he'd be "beating up racist Chelsea fans.". Attempting to brush it off, I tried to continue, by saying that I had a ticket to the Chelsea-Burnley game, after which I planned to ring up Call Collymore to air my grievances about him generalizing Chelsea's fanbase as racist. He then says that Collymore was spot on, and that what I wrote (I'd criticized Collymore on social media) was "utter bollocks". I tried to point out that it was only a small minority, but he (in very aggressive tones) tells me to "**** off". I did kiss the badges on my gloves and the one in my coat button to say "You don't scare me", but does this count as being physically threatened? Either way, I won't be speaking to him for the rest of the season.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

You can't beat a good Collymore meltdown on Twitter, the man's an absolute moron. Like someone said before, compared to a lot of other European nations England is relatively peaceful when it comes to racism in football. There are bad eggs in every club's fanbase: there were reports on Twitter a few weeks ago of some Liverpool fans making hissing noises when they played Spurs, and I'm sure others will have done the same before against a variety of victims. It was just quite unfortunate in Chelsea's case that there was quite blatant footage captured. The club have however reacted quite well by banning various people and I'm sure both they and the French authorities will exercise their right to punish the perpetrators sufficiently.

The bloke you spoke to sounds like an absolute wrong 'un, pay no notice.

 

[fowler9]

Winchester City 4...Moneyfields 0 (Robinson 24, 48, Dempsey 66, Bentley 68; Bayley s/o 37) Attendance: 462

Perhaps the best night of the season, even more than the 4-3 win over Winchester Castle. The biggest attendance of the season as well, and we go within three points of second-placed Moneyfields with two games in hand.

Unfortunately, my enjoyment of the match was marred slightly. I found myself near the club shop after waiting in the queue for the snack bar. I found one of my fellow regulars and asked him what he was doing at the weekend, thinking he'd have a ticket to the Southampton game. He then looked pointedly at me and said he'd be "beating up racist Chelsea fans.". Attempting to brush it off, I tried to continue, by saying that I had a ticket to the Chelsea-Burnley game, after which I planned to ring up Call Collymore to air my grievances about him generalizing Chelsea's fanbase as racist. He then says that Collymore was spot on, and that what I wrote (I'd criticized Collymore on social media) was "utter bollocks". I tried to point out that it was only a small minority, but he (in very aggressive tones) tells me to "**** off". I did kiss the badges on my gloves and the one in my coat button to say "You don't scare me", but does this count as being physically threatened? Either way, I won't be speaking to him for the rest of the season.

He sounds like a proper idiot mate putting it politely. I think you would be kind not speaking to him for the rest of the season. Perhaps not speaking to him again would be more appropriate.

 

[RichmondCommu]

It was just quite unfortunate in Chelsea's case that there was quite blatant footage captured.

Why do you think it was unfortunate? Chelsea should welcome the fact that racist thugs who associate themselves with CFC are hopefully going to be punished by the French authorities for their behavior. Not only that but I dare say the Chelsea faithful will not miss them at the Bridge if indeed they are banned for life.
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Y The club have however reacted quite well by banning various people and I'm sure both they and the French authorities will exercise their right to punish the perpetrators sufficiently.

Its worth mentioning here that none of the people identified in the video have been banned, as it stands they have only been suspended from attending games at the Bridge. Lets not jump the gun here.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

Why do you think it was unfortunate? Chelsea should welcome the fact that racist thugs who associate themselves with CFC are hopefully going to be punished by the French authorities for their behavior. Not only that but I dare say the Chelsea faithful will not miss them at the Bridge if indeed they are banned for life.

I meant with regard to their image and reputation: the whole world has now seen one incident and solely associates the club with the matter. Usually any racist incidents that occur with fans would lead to a removal from the stadium or arrest, the club are informed and the rest of the matter is carried out in relative privacy. The polar opposite as happened here and whilst I am sure CFC will be glad to root out the undesirables I am sure they wish they could have done it on a much more low-key scale!
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Its worth mentioning here that none of the people identified in the video have been banned, as it stands they have only been suspended from attending games at the Bridge. Lets not jump the gun here.

I would be amazed that if any legal charges were brought against the individuals that they would be ever allowed back in. Of course that indeed hasn't happened yet but judging by the reaction so far and the amount of evidence that exists against some of the identified I can't imagine Chelsea would want to be seen to let them off.

 

[RichmondCommu]

Brentford have confirmed that Mark Warburton will be leaving at the end of the season, surely one of the craziest decisions ever?

As a Derby fan I have to agree that this is utter madness and may well have the affect of destabilising the club in the short term and a denying them a possible play-off finish.

For what its worth I once worked with Mark many years a go. He's a lovely bloke and very intelligent. Why he entered the madness of professional football is beyond me!
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I meant with regard to their image and reputation: the whole world has now seen one incident and solely associates the club with the matter. Usually any racist incidents that occur with fans would lead to a removal from the stadium or arrest, the club are informed and the rest of the matter is carried out in relative privacy. The polar opposite as happened here and whilst I am sure CFC will be glad to root out the undesirables I am sure they wish they could have done it on a much more low-key scale!

In which case racism is quietly brushed under the carpet. That is not the way to tackle racism in football or indeed anywhere else in society. If Chelsea or indeed any other institution are embarrassed by racist thugs who claim to be connected to them that can only be a good thing.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

In which case racism is quietly brushed under the carpet. That is not the way to tackle racism in football or indeed anywhere else in society. If Chelsea or indeed any other institution are embarrassed by racist thugs who claim to be connected to them that can only be a good thing.

Not necessarily, it usually makes the media once a verdict is reached and quite rightly the police and club looks good for taking action and the berk making the comments is reprimanded. Further, as what is probably the most prominent UK football of the last decade, racism is hardly swept under the carpet any more as it is.

I'm not entirely sure why it's fair Chelsea should be embarrassed for this debacle, it's not like they can monitor everything their fans say and do, especially outside of the confines of the stadium. It's just an unreciprocated association with views they certainly won't give consent to, why they deserve to have their entire reputation worldwide dragged through the mud on that basis I can't fathom. I won't say any more on the matter as I can recall our debates on this matter in the past and most of those were wasted time.

 

[RichmondCommu]

Not necessarily, it usually makes the media once a verdict is reached and quite rightly the police and club looks good for taking action and the berk making the comments is reprimanded. Further, as what is probably the most prominent UK football of the last decade, racism is hardly swept under the carpet any more as it is.

But surely this has got nothing to do with CFC or indeed any other club "looking good". I would hardly describe a convicted racist as being a "berk". At best he is a racist thug. If the only time you hear about racist behavior at football grounds is a few words in the local paper I would indeed suggest that it is swept under the carpet. It is far better that this kind of behavior is out in the public domain for everyone to see.
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I'm not entirely sure why it's fair Chelsea should be embarrassed for this debacle, it's not like they can monitor everything their fans say and do, especially outside of the confines of the stadium. It's just an unreciprocated association with views they certainly won't give consent to, why they deserve to have their entire reputation worldwide dragged through the mud on that basis I can't fathom. I won't say any more on the matter as I can recall our debates on this matter in the past and most of those were wasted time.

So you think discussing racism is a waste of time? Try telling that to my wife who is of Indian descent or indeed anyone else who has suffered racial abuse.

CFC and every other football club are more than capable of monitoring the behavior of their supporters, it all depends on whether they have the will to do so. I would suggest that the word debacle is not really appropriate to describe someone who has been racially abused for simply wanting to make their way home on the Paris metro.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

We'll agree to disagree as I said, since I doubt we're going to make any headway. On this point however...

I would hardly describe a convicted racist as being a "berk". At best he is a racist thug.

I'll use whichever words I choose, I think you knew what I meant regardless. There are more choice words I could have used however I doubt yorkie et al would have been approving!
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So you think discussing racism is a waste of time? Try telling that to my wife who is of Indian descent or indeed anyone else who has suffered racial abuse.

You read far too much into what I type (or you deliberately misunderstand me) - I said our exchanges were wasted time because I recall our discussions on this in the past and the many hours and posts whereby we made no progress whatsoever. Of course racism is an important topic and I'm sorry to hear your wife has had problems with it, alas I'm just walking away this time before there's another prolonged period of exchange which establishes nothing worthwhile.

 

[Chapeltom]

In the middle of a nice 10 hour day and would usually look forward to following the football at 10pm but chances are I'll be too tired and its Derby County away for my Sheffield Wednesday. We don't score goals and we definitely do not beat Derby.

Looks like I'll have a game tomorrow after work in the Bangkok area. Choice of six matches at: BCC Tero, Chamchuri, Globex - Division Two or Ayutthaya, Thai Honda in Division One, always the Toyota Premier Cup match at the National Stadium between BEC Tero and Sagun Tosu of Japan.

 

[RichmondCommu]

We'll agree to disagree as I said, since I doubt we're going to make any headway. On this point however...

I'll use whichever words I choose, I think you knew what I meant regardless. There are more choice words I could have used however I doubt yorkie et al would have been approving!

The word "berk" would suggest that the whole thing was a bit of a joke that had gone badly wrong. Fortunately CFC appear to be taking the whole disgraceful episode rather more seriously.
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You read far too much into what I type (or you deliberately misunderstand me) - I said our exchanges were wasted time because I recall our discussions on this in the past and the many hours and posts whereby we made no progress whatsoever. Of course racism is an important topic and I'm sorry to hear your wife has had problems with it, alas I'm just walking away this time before there's another prolonged period of exchange which establishes nothing worthwhile.

Given that I've never met you its only fair that I take what you post on this forum at face value.

And in terms of "progress", "progress" towards what exactly? Incidentally the forum rules do not stipulate that you have to reply to everything that is posted on this forum.
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In the middle of a nice 10 hour day and would usually look forward to following the football at 10pm but chances are I'll be too tired and its Derby County away for my Sheffield Wednesday. We don't score goals and we definitely do not beat Derby.

Looks like I'll have a game tomorrow after work in the Bangkok area. Choice of six matches at: BCC Tero, Chamchuri, Globex - Division Two or Ayutthaya, Thai Honda in Division One, always the Toyota Premier Cup match at the National Stadium between BEC Tero and Sagun Tosu of Japan.

Given how badly Derby are playing at the moment I think the Wednesday have every chance of taking something away from Pride Park this afternoon.

 

[kelv]

3,800 to Bern with widespread praise for fans.

4-1 away win against a team unbeaten at home for 3 years in Europe.

great week for Everton.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

The word "berk" would suggest that the whole thing was a bit of a joke that had gone badly wrong. Fortunately CFC appear to be taking the whole disgraceful episode rather more seriously.
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Given that I've never met you its only fair that I take what you post on this forum at face value.

And in terms of "progress", "progress" towards what exactly? Incidentally the forum rules do not stipulate that you have to reply to everything that is posted on this forum.

Not at all, it is a very serious incident, but like I said I had to water down what I thought of him (stupid f***ing tw*t was closer to my thoughts if that satisfies you). I use words like berk and idiot to cover a range of people but always with appropriate levels of severity. I apologise if my choice of language was not up to a suitable standard of condemnation for you.

Progress in the sense that, as was demonstrated last time and as is being demonstrated here, we just go around in circles with no meaningful conclusions or concurring reached.

 

[Antman]

Winchester City 4...Moneyfields 0 (Robinson 24, 48, Dempsey 66, Bentley 68; Bayley s/o 37) Attendance: 462

Perhaps the best night of the season, even more than the 4-3 win over Winchester Castle. The biggest attendance of the season as well, and we go within three points of second-placed Moneyfields with two games in hand.

Unfortunately, my enjoyment of the match was marred slightly. I found myself near the club shop after waiting in the queue for the snack bar. I found one of my fellow regulars and asked him what he was doing at the weekend, thinking he'd have a ticket to the Southampton game. He then looked pointedly at me and said he'd be "beating up racist Chelsea fans.". Attempting to brush it off, I tried to continue, by saying that I had a ticket to the Chelsea-Burnley game, after which I planned to ring up Call Collymore to air my grievances about him generalizing Chelsea's fanbase as racist. He then says that Collymore was spot on, and that what I wrote (I'd criticized Collymore on social media) was "utter bollocks". I tried to point out that it was only a small minority, but he (in very aggressive tones) tells me to "**** off". I did kiss the badges on my gloves and the one in my coat button to say "You don't scare me", but does this count as being physically threatened? Either way, I won't be speaking to him for the rest of the season.

Sounds to me like that bloke at Winchester is a complete idiot anyway, I'd leave it longer than the rest of the season if I were you.

There has always been some bitterness and envy towards Chelsea and the unsavoury incident in Paris has just given the haters some more ammunition.

 

[familyguy99]

Hyde 1-1 AFC Fylde

AFC Fylde top of Conference North division but can't beat team who sit at bottom of that division.

Hands up who thought Burnley will get point at Etihad and Stamford Bridge this season?

Just like last week Oldham lost to team who in bottom 4 again as they lost 3-0 to Leyton Orient it mean that Oldham haven't beaten any of bottom 4 teams this season, aleast we are two points behide top 6 but Bradford who sit in sixth place got game in hands against us.

None of bottom 5 in League one lost today.

 

[CC 72100]

Another disappointing result today. Why oh why was McNair (an inexperienced centre half) started at right back, while the much more experienced Valencia was left on the bench? No surprise that he was hauled off at half time. (No disrespect to the lad, but he is inexperienced and is being played out of position!)

More lots of possession (64%) and lots of 'moving the ball around' according to SSN, but once again it counts for sod all if this doesn't create chances.

Of course, we played with a lack of width again - Di Maria being kept narrow, and Herrera is a CM by trade.

We can all be armchair experts, but Van Gaal seems to be missing the same problems time after time. I just don't understand it.

 

[richw]

Another disappointing result today. Why oh why was McNair (an inexperienced centre half) started at right back, while the much more experienced Valencia was left on the bench? No surprise that he was hauled off at half time. (No disrespect to the lad, but he is inexperienced and is being played out of position!)

You cant blame the inexperienced lad for defeat then. The winning goal only came near the end of the second half...

 

[CC 72100]

You cant blame the inexperienced lad for defeat then. The winning goal only came near the end of the second half...

I'm not blaming him for the defeat, I'm highlighting some of the bizarre decisions of Van Gaal.

You could also make a claim that had we had Valencia on from the start that we'd have been able to make more of the 1st half by actually having somebody who can go forward on the wing effectively, but that is ifs and buts and maybes - you can't ever be sure what would have happened, but I'd imagine that Valencia makes a more effective right back than McNair.

The fact remains that it was a very strange (poor?) decision.

 

[Darandio]

We can all be armchair experts, but Van Gaal seems to be missing the same problems time after time. I just don't understand it.

Don't worry, he has it covered today with yet another gem......

"Today we played well - only we forgot to score."

 

[CC 72100]

Highlights my point perfectly. He also harped on about possession and control of the game in the interview with sky just after the game on SSN - which as I've said, count for nothing if it doesn't equate to quality chances.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Hyde 1-1 AFC Fylde

AFC Fylde top of Conference North division but can't beat team who sit at bottom of that division.

Hyde were leading 1-0 at half-time, but matters tuned nasty near the end which saw two AFC Fylde players being shown red cards.

 

[richw]

I'm not blaming him for the defeat, I'm highlighting some of the bizarre decisions of Van Gaal.

You could also make a claim that had we had Valencia on from the start that we'd have been able to make more of the 1st half by actually having somebody who can go forward on the wing effectively, but that is ifs and buts and maybes - you can't ever be sure what would have happened, but I'd imagine that Valencia makes a more effective right back than McNair.

The fact remains that it was a very strange (poor?) decision.

McNair has been my top bargain signing on Football Manager 15 by the way, first season he was ok, second season he has been superb.

 

[CC 72100]

McNair has been my top bargain signing on Football Manager 15 by the way, first season he was ok, second season he has been superb.

I'm also in second season in my game, have taken Nottingham Forest up. Don't think McNair has turned into anything special on mine, although Chris Solly from Charlton is proving to be a real bargain, even in the Premier League. A few free agents (Diego Laxalt, Roberto Peryera and Frederik Sorensen) have also been good signings.

Anderson has disappeared off the face of the planet - much like in real life!

 

[richw]

I'm also in second season in my game, have taken Nottingham Forest up. Don't think McNair has turned into anything special on mine, although Chris Solly from Charlton is proving to be a real bargain, even in the Premier League. A few free agents (Diego Laxalt, Roberto Peryera and Frederik Sorensen) have also been good signings.

Anderson has disappeared off the face of the planet - much like in real life!

I've played a few different games. In one of them I signed Will Keane for Stoke and came second in the league in season 2. Keane was top scorer in the league by a considerable number of goals.
I've found signing too many players is disastrous unless they have a high stat is a certain area that I cant remember at the moment.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

My sister spent some time living in France and sexism and such like is far more commonplace over there. I do think we go a bit too far to the opposite extreme in this country sometimes but the incident in Paris is totally unacceptable and shouldn't be used as a stick to beat Chelsea fans with, of course Didier Drogba is a living legend.

From what I hear, not being satiated by their display of racism in Paris, they decided to treat the British an encore at St Pancras on their return.

Chelsea have acted against five of their "fans" already.

 

[12CSVT]

Hyde 1-1 AFC Fylde

AFC Fylde top of Conference North division but can't beat team who sit at bottom of that division.

AFC Fylde are no longer top as a result of dropping two points.