Football

[Ivo]

I hope we have some Barca fans on here so they can join in the anti-Chelsea campaign after Drogba's antics against them...

MattE: You refer to Mr Frisk, correct?

Oswyntail: Don't go there I agree with you, but spite is a very powerful weapon in football.

Also, I've softened my sig a little. Football was already dead (as SS4 said), so I've changed it to the CL.

 

[sonic2009]

Whats George Osborne doing there?

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[MidnightFlyer]

Why is it a disgrace? Leaving his personal failings out of it, he is the club captain who has played in most of their CL games ....

I'm sorry, if he was suspended for the Final, he shouldn't get to lift the reward initially, regardless of how long he has been the Captain for. It devalues the whole thing to be honest. AVB was the manager through a lot of the campaign, does he get a reward too?

 

[SS4]

Whats George Osborne doing there?

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Officially: Establishing Trade links with Germany
Unofficially: A holiday at taxpayer's expense

 

[Ivo]

I suppose Terry doing it is better than Abramovich doing it

Officially: Establishing Trade links with Germany
Unofficially: A holiday at taxpayer's expense

You would say that

It turns out that the traitor (I say this as a Tory-supporter) is a Chelsea fan

 

[SS4]

I suppose Terry doing it is better than Abramovich doing it



You would say that

To be fair I'd believe that about any politician regardless of colour (they're all the same side of the one coin really).

Back to footballing matters and while I don't wish Drogba to die I would like to see him dishonourably retire from football - I hear the gymnastics team is in need of someone with his raw talent

 

[Zoe]

As for saying Chelsea did not deserve to win, the fact is that they scored the same number of goals as Bayern Munich did and scored more penalties, Bayern Munich had their chances to win the match (with that penalty in extra time and in the shootout when all they had to do was score their last two) but didn't take them. In the 2005 FA Cup Final Arsenal more or less played for penalties from the first whistle, got them and won even though Manchester United were overall the better team in that match.

 

[SS4]

As for saying Chelsea did not deserve to win, the fact is that they scored more penalties than Bayern Munich did, Bayern Munich had their chances to win the match but didn't take them. In the 2005 FA Cup Final Arsenal effectively played for penalties from the first whistle, got them and won even though Manchester United were overall the better team in that match.

What about Luiz's left foot being in the box when Robben took the penalty?

 

[SS4]

Off the pitch how long will ITV be allowed to spout such nonsense?

 

[Zoe]

What about Luiz's left foot being in the box when Robben took the penalty?

This is why there is a good case for video replay to be used.

 

[Ivo]

I hear the gymnastics team is in need of someone with his raw talent

Do the Ivory Coast even have a Gymnastics team? If not, they'll have plenty of money to start one up with

As for saying Chelsea did not deserve to win, the fact is that they scored the same number of goals as Bayern Munich did and scored more penalties, Bayern Munich had their chances to win the match (with that penalty in extra time and in the shootout when all they had to do was score their last two) but didn't take them. In the 2005 FA Cup Final Arsenal more or less played for penalties from the first whistle, got them and won even though Manchester United were overall the better team in that match.

In the same way that one Jose Antonio Reyes got himself sent off to avoid taking one? Arsenal didn't deserve that win and neither did Chelsea tonight. If you play for a draw you deserve a draw - at best.

Off the pitch how long will ITV be allowed to spout such nonsense?

Until approximately 0415 if their immeasurable bias is anything to go by

 

[Zoe]

Also Schwiensteiger did a run-stop-run penalty like Ronaldo in 2008. Taking penalties this way can be quite risky if the keeper doesn't move when you expect them to.
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In the same way that one Jose Antonio Reyes got himself sent off to avoid taking one? Arsenal didn't deserve that win and neither did Chelsea tonight. If you play for a draw you deserve a draw - at best.

So, would you prefer a replay?

 

[Ivo]

So, would you prefer a replay?

I suppose I would. It would take a miracle - or rather, an anti-miracle - for the tactic to work twice. Both would have been exposed and thus lost.

Also Swiensteiger did a run-stop-run penalty like Ronaldo in 2008.

'Twas very naïve of him. Everyone knows Ronaldo was and still is (far) too cocky for his own good - not a good model to copy. And the Law of Averages suggests that Chelsea should beat one team out of two that has a player try that

 

[Zoe]

'Twas very naïve of him. Everyone knows Ronaldo was and still is (far) too cocky for his own good - not a good model to copy.

It worked very well against Paul Robinson in 2006.
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I suppose I would. It would take a miracle - or rather, an anti-miracle - for the tactic to work twice. Both would have been exposed and thus lost.

So, if Germany had held on for two more minutes in 2006 against Italy and won on penalties would they have not deserved to have gone through? Also in the 2006 final France were outplaying Italy by the end but Italy won.

 

[CC 72100]

'Twas very naïve of him. Everyone knows Ronaldo was and still is (far) too cocky for his own good - not a good model to copy.

I remember that final well. Ronaldo and Nani were the two takers I had my worries about with respect to going cocky and just cocking it up. Thankfully Nani didn't try anything clever, and the rest is history as they say

 

[SS4]

I'd much rather the Champions League was wound up and a new pan-European competition was started where places would be gained by

8 places for the teams who's squads have the most home grown players
8 places for the teams who have the best fair play record
8 places for the teams who's financial position is best (excluding money from this competition)
8 places for the teams who do the most in their local communities.

And ITV would be barred from showing games involving clubs who play their home games in the United Kingdom (note the careful wording!) until they can prove they're capable of being neutral

 

[Ivo]

So, if Germany had held on for two more minutes in 2006 against Italy and won on penalties would they have not deserved to have gone through? Also in the 2006 final France were outplaying Italy by the end but Italy won.

The argument about who-deserves-what is fanciful at best Bayern probably deserved to win tonight. We (England) probably deserved to beat Argentina in the 1998 World Cup. Lewis Hamilton probably deserved to win the F1 world title in his debut season. Australia probably deserved to win the First Test of the 2009 Ashes series. None of them happened...

I remember that final well. Ronaldo and Nani were the two takers I had my worries about with respect to going cocky and just cocking it up. Thankfully Nani didn't try anything clever, and the rest is history as they say

I didn't really want United to win the CL Final that year - but I certainly didn't want Chelsea to win. Thus, I sided with my brother and cheered on United.

And ITV would be barred from showing games involving clubs who play their home games in the United Kingdom (note the careful wording!) until they can prove they're capable of being neutral

Even Northern Ireland?

8 places for the teams who's squads have the most home grown players
8 places for the teams who have the best fair play record
8 places for the teams who's financial position is best (excluding money from this competition)
8 places for the teams who do the most in their local communities.

Slight problem: On Criteria #1 and #4, Southend could play in the CL! I assume you mean top teams only?

 

[Whistler40145]

Poor old Blackpool, they played well, but just couldn't pull it off. I hope we can do better next year & have a good run.

I do hope Ian Holloway stays as Manager, he has been a breath of fresh air to the club.


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[Zoe]

The argument about who-deserves-what is fanciful at best Bayern probably deserved to win tonight. We (England) probably deserved to beat Argentina in the 1998 World Cup. Lewis Hamilton probably deserved to win the F1 world title in his debut season. Australia probably deserved to win the First Test of the 2009 Ashes series. None of them happened...

In the case of football though, unless you scrap penalty shootouts there will always be times where a team wins by defending for 120 minutes and winning on penalties.

 

[SS4]

I didn't really want United to win the CL Final that year - but I certainly didn't want Chelsea to win. Thus, I sided with my brother and cheered on United.

Was it Sun Tzu who said my enemy's enemy is my friend

 

[Zoe]

I'd much rather the Champions League was wound up and a new pan-European competition

The danger with setting up any new European competition is that it could be franchise based and so have no way of teams to be promoted or relegated from it.

 

[SS4]

Even Northern Ireland?

Yep. Although given the qualification rate of the home nations that are not England it's largely moot

Slight problem: On Criteria #1 and #4, Southend could play in the CL! I assume you mean top teams only?

If I had my way Southend would qualify but it'd be even more unworkable than it is now so it'd have to be top flight or top two flights

In case it's not obvious, I really didn't work out the practicalities in my head
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The danger with setting up any new European competition is that it could be franchise based and so have no way of teams to be promoted or relegated from it.

One might be tempted to say that about the current CL since it's virtually* always the same teams competing anyway.

* yes I know virtually isn't the same as actually always but it's still pretty close imo

 

[Ivo]

One might be tempted to say that about the current CL since it's virtually* always the same teams competing anyway.

* yes I know virtually isn't the same as actually always but it's still pretty close imo

On that point, am I right to think that United are the only club to have qualified for every competition since the CL was inaugurated?

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

I'd much rather the Champions League was wound up and a new pan-European competition was started where places would be gained by

8 places for the teams who's squads have the most home grown players
8 places for the teams who have the best fair play record
8 places for the teams who's financial position is best (excluding money from this competition)
8 places for the teams who do the most in their local communities.

....and, of course, alternatively in place of any 1 of the 4 above.......

8 places for the teams in the Midlands....

 

[YorkshireBear]

Bit of hatred on here tonight, i was supporting the english team... a fantastic final it was. And i am sorry, and english broadcaster being biassed to an english team.... its not like its the league...

 

[richw]

What was so bad about itv coverage? I watched on sky and the coverage was good.
Roberto Di matteo, not good enough for west brom just over 120 months ago, now wins champions league! That is a good achievement in my eyes

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[Ivo]

What was so bad about itv coverage? I watched on sky and the coverage was good.
Roberto Di matteo, not good enough for west brom just over 120 months ago, now wins champions league! That is a good achievement in my eyes

120 months? I don't think that zero should be there

On a more serious note, when Lampard scored his penalty, Tyldesley called "Yes!". When Bayern missed their next one, he took it to another level: "YESSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

Inappropriate - at best. A bit like Chelsea winning really.

No-one call tell me they have been good enough to win the FA Cup this year (remember we had City-United in January), never mind the Champions' League!

 

[SS4]

....and, of course, alternatively in place of any 1 of the 4 above.......

8 places for the teams in the Midlands....

Nah, the Villa only need one place

Bit of hatred on here tonight, i was supporting the english team... a fantastic final it was. And i am sorry, and english broadcaster being biassed to an english team.... its not like its the league...

English team? Are Nissan as an English car manufacturer because they have a factory here?

The bias is because a broadcaster should always be neutral in matters of fact and strive to give an accurate picture for those who cannot be there

 

[MidnightFlyer]

Bit of hatred on here tonight, i was supporting the english team... a fantastic final it was. And i am sorry, and english broadcaster being biassed to an english team.... its not like its the league...

An English team with just 4 Englishmen playing. Of course bias will slip in, but ITV make it so blatant, like 'YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS' when Bayern missed their fourth penalty. I am sure people would appreciate a fair and balanced report on the game, not ITV to use it for their own views. It isn't aided by drivel like saying Chelsea deserved to win. It may be an opinion, but it is also very close to being a lie.

 

[Ivo]

Thinking about it, I don't remember Tyldesley being that biased after United beat Bayern in 1999 - and that was far more dramatic and emotional. Although I guess having Atkinson (was it Atkinson?) for company and not Townsend would have explained that

EDIT: Just watched some highlights on Youtube. He was biased in that game - but not nearly as much as he was tonight.