First Group: General Discussion

[317 forever]

Are they still 'Transforming Travel'......

First spent a few years transforming travel. Now TfL have announced they are transforming Oxford Street. I'll leave it to you to draw any parellels you like!

 

[Dentonian]

First spent a few years transforming travel. Now TfL have announced they are transforming Oxford Street. I'll leave it to you to draw any parellels you like!

The phrase "two wrongs don't make a right" spring to mind.

 

[smtglasgow]

Really noticeable how good First were at communicating how services were running over the last few days. Most opcos were doing a great job on Twitter. Which leads to the obvious question: why so bad at updating on services the rest of the time? They seem to view Twitter as a promotional tool rather than providing updates - no doubt a centralising cost-cutting measure – but other operators (as usual, I’m thinking of Lothian, but other companies do exist!) and some of the rail companies have shown how to provide excellent real-time info AND build their brand at the same time.

 

[GaryMcEwan]

Really noticeable how good First were at communicating how services were running over the last few days. Most opcos were doing a great job on Twitter. Which leads to the obvious question: why so bad at updating on services the rest of the time? They seem to view Twitter as a promotional tool rather than providing updates - no doubt a centralising cost-cutting measure – but other operators (as usual, I’m thinking of Lothian, but other companies do exist!) and some of the rail companies have shown how to provide excellent real-time info AND build their brand at the same time.

First Bluebird and First Aberdeen have the same Twitter staff and do provide updates and reply back to passengers. Glasgow on the other hand just push out updates. I've never seen the Glasgow feed ever reply back to anyone apart from within the last week.

 

[Goldfish62]

Really noticeable how good First were at communicating how services were running over the last few days. Most opcos were doing a great job on Twitter. Which leads to the obvious question: why so bad at updating on services the rest of the time? They seem to view Twitter as a promotional tool rather than providing updates - no doubt a centralising cost-cutting measure – but other operators (as usual, I’m thinking of Lothian, but other companies do exist!) and some of the rail companies have shown how to provide excellent real-time info AND build their brand at the same time.

First Kernow have been doing an excellent job, and also use Twitter routinely to advise of disruption. It's managed locally, which makes a difference.

 

[Jordan Adam]

On the whole i've been quite impressed with how the companies here have dealt with the snow. Stagecoach NScotland had their customer services on from 7AM to 7PM rather than 9AM to 5PM and were giving hourly updates on services from the website.

First Bluebird and First Aberdeen have the same Twitter staff and do provide updates and reply back to passengers.

Must have changed hands again then as the Aberdeen twitter for quite a while (from mid 2016 to recently at least) was being done by a team in Essex!

 

[DragonEast]

For the first time I can recall ever, there did seem to be some info direct from depots in Essex, on Facebook, like when depots pulled all services on several occasions then started to reinstate them a couple of hours later. Well done. However it now tells you to get home quickly as services may be withdrawn at any time! Until the next time . . .

In fairness it is not just bus companies, a lot (probably most) of us don't know how to communicate. We talk in shorthand or gobbledygook to people we know who know what we mean, and ignore the rest. The customer notices here are the instructions to drivers (and they have my sympathy too in trying to comprehend them). If passengers might want to know what stops are affected, or where to catch their bus then they've had it. As long as the drivers know the route, hopefully; everyone can be left to work out the rest for themselves.

However I get the impression that the Twitter staff (based, I thought, nationally in Norwich, not in Essex) normally have to rely on the GPS (like the passengers) info to tell what is running, or may be not if there is no current data on the app; as the depots rely too on the drivers as they try to operate routes to tell them whether individual routes are serviceable. So it meant that rush hour updates came out well after 9am when most of the travelers should have reached their destinations. Fortunately the passengers are learning to give First's twitter team the information on services/fares themselves (and making quite a good job of getting it right!). No luck though with the pre-7am (sometimes pre-5am) notifications that other companies managed! So when the passengers aren't told it's presumably because First don't know themselves!!! It's presumably a bit hard to post regular updates when the depots don't know themselves or don't monitor and collate the information. They just "run the buses" don't they? It seems to be down to anyone with a bit of initiative, but there isn't any incentive. (There looked to be an interesting example in Norfolk where the - perhaps exasperated - commercial manager of the OC actually overrode both his depots and the twitter team to tweet out what was running, and not! He made a good job of it. But elsewhere, with more complex networks - and as I've pointed out previously, that seems a particular difficulty with First, they don't do simple - it's not so easy presumably). Other OCs seemed to have someone "on the job", others didn't or they were too busy . . . or perhaps this modern technology is too hard as it is for many people. Many people are fearful of facebook and twitter.

I suppose that the apps GPS module and the web complaints form procedures do provide an easy management system for the depots. Why bother with anything more when you don't have to? Does good customer service make money? I don't know. I know it impresses the passengers but what's its cash value? You don't miss what you haven't got, so lost passengers who give up or don't bother, don't count!

 

[overthewater]

I sure the depot still have access to the twitter accounts, if the depots need to post an update.

 

[Dentonian]

Really noticeable how good First were at communicating how services were running over the last few days. Most opcos were doing a great job on Twitter. Which leads to the obvious question: why so bad at updating on services the rest of the time? They seem to view Twitter as a promotional tool rather than providing updates - no doubt a centralising cost-cutting measure – but other operators (as usual, I’m thinking of Lothian, but other companies do exist!) and some of the rail companies have shown how to provide excellent real-time info AND build their brand at the same time.

What about the three quarters of the UK population (as of 2017) who are not on Twitter? How do First communicate to them? First Manchester's obsession with Twitter nearly caused a riot at Shudehill Interchange last January when the curtailed all cross-city services one afternoon, just after they had given 90 days notice to all on-street Inspectorate.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

What about the three quarters of the UK population (as of 2017) who are not on Twitter? How do First communicate to them? First Manchester's obsession with Twitter nearly caused a riot at Shudehill Interchange last January when the curtailed all cross-city services one afternoon, just after they had given 90 days notice to all on-street Inspectorate.

OK - so how do you communicate with the 9% of people who have never used the internet? Especially on a day when actually getting around is pretty difficult.

Are we expecting hordes of people with sandwich boards to walk around with information? Twitter, facebook, web isn't perfect but it's better than before. I can use my smartphone now to understand where my bus is (or if it's not running) in most instances whereas go back 20 years ago, I'd have been stood like a lemon (and I was on occasion)!

 

[Dentonian]

OK - so how do you communicate with the 9% of people who have never used the internet? Especially on a day when actually getting around is pretty difficult.

Are we expecting hordes of people with sandwich boards to walk around with information? Twitter, facebook, web isn't perfect but it's better than before. I can use my smartphone now to understand where my bus is (or if it's not running) in most instances whereas go back 20 years ago, I'd have been stood like a lemon (and I was on occasion)!

There is a distinct difference between communicating with 21% of the population and (using your figures) 91% of the population. There is no obvious solution, other than not making human beings redundant to satisfy the shareholders who will then whinge at paying axes to support the jobless, but Twitter seems to be taking over the world of communication. I don't even now what it is, other than seeing it on media websites where it just quotes verbatim what the original story (or e-mail) said.

And whilst I accept that the recent weather caused major problems for many public transport users, and was out of the control of Transport providers, the corollory is that for most bus users up and down the country, the more general need to communicate was much less 20, or certainly 32 years ago, because punctualiity was better and headways were higher, so you would be much less likely to be "stood around like a lemon" in the first place.

 

[Andyh82]

It’s like when fares go up, and loads of people rant on Twitter that they didn’t know and nobody told them.

This despite the fact the news was mentioned on Twitter many times per day for weeks, was on the website and was on posters on board the bus.

They can’t win, unless they sent personal letters to all customers.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

There is a distinct difference between communicating with 21% of the population and (using your figures) 91% of the population. There is no obvious solution, other than not making human beings redundant to satisfy the shareholders who will then whinge at paying axes to support the jobless, but Twitter seems to be taking over the world of communication. I don't even now what it is, other than seeing it on media websites where it just quotes verbatim what the original story (or e-mail) said.

And whilst I accept that the recent weather caused major problems for many public transport users, and was out of the control of Transport providers, the corollory is that for most bus users up and down the country, the more general need to communicate was much less 20, or certainly 32 years ago, because punctualiity was better and headways were higher, so you would be much less likely to be "stood around like a lemon" in the first place.

I thought you said two thirds of the population - how does that equate to 21%? Actually, the ONS put the figure at 45.9% on twitter. I'm nearer the grave than the cradle but I use twitter and tracking apps to understand where my bus is. We can complain about excluding people who don't wish to do this or that, but time moves on. We might as well complain about not being able to go out and buy a nice typewriter!

As regards your comments on headways, that wasn't the case where I lived and being stuck in a miserable Bishop Auckland bus station because a knackered Leyland National had expired somewhere in Co Durham was not much fun! Now, I can just say "stuff it" and head off for a coffee/pint

 

[Dentonian]

I thought you said two thirds of the population - how does that equate to 21%? Actually, the ONS put the figure at 45.9% on twitter. I'm nearer the grave than the cradle but I use twitter and tracking apps to understand where my bus is. We can complain about excluding people who don't wish to do this or that, but time moves on. We might as well complain about not being able to go out and buy a nice typewriter!

As regards your comments on headways, that wasn't the case where I lived and being stuck in a miserable Bishop Auckland bus station because a knackered Leyland National had expired somewhere in Co Durham was not much fun! Now, I can just say "stuff it" and head off for a coffee/pint

No I said three quarters. The actual figure quoted by "Omnicore" was 13 million in the UK as of early 2017. I'm sure the total population of the UK is approaching £65 million. I also (sometimes) use tracking apps for both Stagecoach Manchester and my local rail route. However, neither are brilliant, albeit Stagecoach have improved recently. And, as discussed elsewhere - what about reception? Wi-fi on Stagecoach buses is very hit and miss, and t'internet superhighway can be just as slow (or gridlocked) as the M60. Its been very poor tonight for instance and after an earlier failure, I have had to log on to most of my forums (including this one) again from scratch.

Like I said, I don't even know what Twitter is. Does it cost money? Is it secure? Will I be inundated by unwanted adverts? At least I tried facebook once - when it finally accepted me, it sent me a page of mugshots that wouldn't have gone amiss on Police Five - so I tried to quit straight away. 18 months later, I stopped getting prompts from them!!!

 

[Dentonian]

It’s like when fares go up, and loads of people rant on Twitter that they didn’t know and nobody told them.

This despite the fact the news was mentioned on Twitter many times per day for weeks, was on the website and was on posters on board the bus.

They can’t win, unless they sent personal letters to all customers.

Maybe that says it all about those that ARE on Twitter. Posters on buses remain the most obvious and sensible way of communicating. Websites would be ok IF they are kept up to date AND they identify with the area you request.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Maybe that says it all about those that ARE on Twitter. Posters on buses remain the most obvious and sensible way of communicating. Websites would be ok IF they are kept up to date AND they identify with the area you request.

However, that is the truth of traditional media. Were I to travel a few miles from my house, there's a bus route with timetable cases containing info that is 2.5 years ago out of date. The previous operator withdrew the commercial service (and can't blame them), council tendered a replacement but haven't bothered to update the timetables and neither has the new operator.

Arguably, it is far easier to change a website than to update x number of posters etc.

 

[tbtc]

What about the three quarters of the UK population (as of 2017) who are not on Twitter? How do First communicate to them?

Anyone who can get online (which is surely a significant majority of the fare paying passengers who would be going out on buses in inclement weather) can get on Twitter.

You don't need to sign up to Twitter to view First's posts, you don't need to download an App, you can be certain that the information at the top of the page is the most recent, you don't faff about with information you don't need, outdated information doesn't stick around - it's short simple information - perfect for emergency updates

There is a distinct difference between communicating with 21% of the population and (using your figures) 91% of the population. There is no obvious solution, other than not making human beings redundant to satisfy the shareholders who will then whinge at paying axes to support the jobless, but Twitter seems to be taking over the world of communication. I don't even now what it is, other than seeing it on media websites where it just quotes verbatim what the original story (or e-mail) said

You have a lot of opinions about how bad Twitter is, considering that you admit that you don't even know what it is?

for most bus users up and down the country, the more general need to communicate was much less 20, or certainly 32 years ago, because punctualiity was better and headways were higher, so you would be much less likely to be "stood around like a lemon" in the first place.

Thirty two years ago, mileage may have been higher but headways were generally a lot poorer on each route - you might have had a dozen buses an hour on a corridor but not one simple five minute frequency, it'd often have been a miso-mash of twenty and thirty minute frequencies.

Modern networks are generally a lot simpler with good headways, Overground-style routes etc - maybe fewer buses but not the muddle of infrequent services with prefixes and suffixes.

Maybe that says it all about those that ARE on Twitter. Posters on buses remain the most obvious and sensible way of communicating. Websites would be ok IF they are kept up to date AND they identify with the area you request.

That's the beauty of Twitter though - it's easy to keep up to date and you can easily delete a tweet (or it sinks down the page as more recent updates come along - tweets are clearly dated too - rather than having to check the posters on a hundred buses in a depot.

Posters on buses really aren't much use for keeping up to date during inclement weather, given how often things may have changed during the worst of the day too - some routes in Sheffield were changing several times a day last week, as the snow fell/melted and traffic disruptions evolved.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

No I said three quarters. The actual figure quoted by "Omnicore" was 13 million in the UK as of early 2017. I'm sure the total population of the UK is approaching £65 million. I also (sometimes) use tracking apps for both Stagecoach Manchester and my local rail route. However, neither are brilliant, albeit Stagecoach have improved recently. And, as discussed elsewhere - what about reception? Wi-fi on Stagecoach buses is very hit and miss, and t'internet superhighway can be just as slow (or gridlocked) as the M60. Its been very poor tonight for instance and after an earlier failure, I have had to log on to most of my forums (including this one) again from scratch.

Like I said, I don't even know what Twitter is. Does it cost money? Is it secure? Will I be inundated by unwanted adverts? At least I tried facebook once - when it finally accepted me, it sent me a page of mugshots that wouldn't have gone amiss on Police Five - so I tried to quit straight away. 18 months later, I stopped getting prompts from them!!!

Apologies - I did misread your post. My figures came from the ONS and constitute the adult population - include every five year old etc and it will skew the figures.

You could always do some research on Twitter to understand what it could do (in terms of your questions)? After all, you could say all the same about the internet? The internet and social media provides much more extensive information than back in the day, especially for places you were unfamiliar with (e.g. visiting somewhere else on holiday). You're not FBB in disguise???

 

[Dentonian]

However, that is the truth of traditional media. Were I to travel a few miles from my house, there's a bus route with timetable cases containing info that is 2.5 years ago out of date. The previous operator withdrew the commercial service (and can't blame them), council tendered a replacement but haven't bothered to update the timetables and neither has the new operator.

Arguably, it is far easier to change a website than to update x number of posters etc.

It may be far easier, but doesn't mean to say it gets done! Unforgivable that the council haven't replaced publicity in 30 months, especially given its their own service. If TFGM don't replace bus stop displays in 30 days or 30 hours, he phones (and yes, e-mails, tweets) are ringing off their stand. FTR, the most common reason for not updating bus stop displays ASAP is jammed cases caused by vandalism (glue, chewing gum etc).

 

[Dentonian]

You have a lot of opinions about how bad Twitter is, considering that you admit that you don't even know what it is?



Thirty two years ago, mileage may have been higher but headways were generally a lot poorer on each route - you might have had a dozen buses an hour on a corridor but not one simple five minute frequency, it'd often have been a miso-mash of twenty and thirty minute frequencies.

Modern networks are generally a lot simpler with good headways, Overground-style routes etc - maybe fewer buses but not the muddle of infrequent services with prefixes and suffixes.



Posters on buses really aren't much use for keeping up to date during inclement weather, given how often things may have changed during the worst of the day too - some routes in Sheffield were changing several times a day last week, as the snow fell/melted and traffic disruptions evolved.

As I said, the recent weather has been an exception. Noting that the "Twitter" saga coincided with the incident at Shudehill, it was a "1984" style development. Apart from hordes of angry passengers threatening TFGM staff, I also heard that an elderly lady unfamiliar with Manchester city centre had been told to get off a bus from Bury at the bottom of Rochdale Road (about 500 metres from Shudehill) whilst trying to get to MRI. She went into Shudehill in tears and said when she complained to the driver about being thrown off in an unfamiliar area for no good reason, he/she said "It was on Twitter"!

As for simpler, "Overground" style routes - yeah, great if you live on one. Not so good if you have to walk a mile every day to catch a bus, in the name of "simplification". Albeit,around here, there wouldn't have been as many as six variations with the original "mish mash", except possibly at peak times. And besides, a simple "Frequent intervals" service doesn't automatically do what is says on the tin. Traffic lights, slow crew reliefs, passing schools at the wrong time etc etc easily cause bunching, so you can still get three buses arriving togeher after a gap of 25 minutes on simple frequent intervals routes.

 

[DragonEast]

All fair comments, but I remember when buses were cancelled (a frequent occurrence) forty years ago there were sandwich boards (with chalk) listing the cancellations at the appropriate town centre bus stops. With all the advances in modern technology it's something that neither the apps nor twitter and facebook (nor the electronic boards and traveline) manage though!

I don't know where other posters live but in the Shires there seem to be very few routes where the headway between services is vastly improved on what it was thirty or more years ago. The problem with both twitter and facebook in the recent inclement weather though was that the information posts were very incomplete, to find out what was happening on a particular route you would have to trawl through all the twitter conversations (dozens or more) and the replies were usually the route is or is not running (not saying what route) and find out what question and when the poster under reply had actually asked. Or ask and wait for your own (inevitably delayed) reply. Apart from enthusiasts who has the time or the inclination; though I suppose you could say at least it gives you something to do to pass the time whilst abandoned at the bus stop, or drinking your coffee or sipping your beer in comfort?

I know it's not the bus companies' "fault". The IT sector doesn't "do" customer service, anywhere! (A computer program can never be wrong by definition, we just have to create a perfect world to go with it!) It's the problem everywhere!

As I believe in all the Shires the Councils prohibit the bus companies from tampering with their physical timetable boards - as the OCs never tire of telling us - though I gather they are the Council's contractor for maintaining them - and apparently it didn't stop them on a least one weekend from putting diversion notices up (though perhaps as drivers often seem to use the wrong route it probably made little difference!) I know "the contract says . . . " but that seems to be more honoured in the breach, usually . . .

With the recent fare increase we were told that the twitter/PR team sent on-bus notices to all the depots and instructed them to be put on all buses, but some depots did, and some didn't at all, and some did on some buses but not on others. I suppose as they say in other parts of the country, there's nowt so queer as folk! Nor, it seems, such variety as at First Bus. Their diversity policy, perhaps they didn't hear the equality bit before the "and"?

 

[Robertj21a]

All fair comments, but I remember when buses were cancelled (a frequent occurrence) forty years ago there were sandwich boards (with chalk) listing the cancellations at the appropriate town centre bus stops. With all the advances in modern technology it's something that neither the apps nor twitter and facebook (nor the electronic boards and traveline) manage though!

I know it's not the bus companies' "fault". The IT sector doesn't "do" customer service, anywhere! (A computer program can never be wrong by definition, we just have to create a perfect world to go with it!) It's the problem everywhere!

I wouldn't have thought that sandwich boards located at just town centre stops would have been much use to passengers coming in to the town centre, or departing from anywhere other than the central stops !. Just goes to show that it was little real help even then.
At least the internet, Apps and Facebook/Twitter allow users a choice of communication channels to use if and when they wish - anywhere and at any time.

 

[Dai Corner]

I wouldn't have thought that sandwich boards located at just town centre stops would have been much use to passengers coming in to the town centre, or departing from anywhere other than the central stops !. Just goes to show that it was little real help even then.
At least the internet, Apps and Facebook/Twitter allow users a choice of communication channels to use if and when they wish - anywhere and at any time.

Pre-Internet the only way to get information out beyond the bus station / town centre would have been by phone (either a recorded message or someone actually in the office answering it; both of which would have had very limited capacity) or via local radio (hoping they'd read out your info and passengers would be listening).

 

[DragonEast]

Of course there's a simpler option which most of us choose than twitter or facebook. If the app doesn't show a bus due in less than 15 minutes with the green wifi symbol representing active monitoring, we give up. The bus companies loss. Not ours. And if they come to decide that the route isn't commercial, well at least we couldn't end up with a worse operator than Wirst. Anything, frankly, to encourage them to give up.

 

[DragonEast]

I wouldn't have thought that sandwich boards located at just town centre stops would have been much use to passengers coming in to the town centre, or departing from anywhere other than the central stops !. Just goes to show that it was little real help even then.
At least the internet, Apps and Facebook/Twitter allow users a choice of communication channels to use if and when they wish - anywhere and at any time.

True. The point though was that at least someone made the effort and the sandwich boards did give useful, usually accurate and concise information from the people "in the know", the supervisors on the ground,. I accept the problem today is there is no-one to make the effort, and when there is they often haven't much clue how to or even, access to the information.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

True. The point though was that at least someone made the effort and the sandwich boards did give useful, usually accurate and concise information from the people "in the know", the supervisors on the ground,. I accept the problem today is there is no-one to make the effort, and when there is they often haven't much clue how to or even, access to the information.

Sorry but the idea that you can have sandwich boards to advertise changes as per the last few days is just impractical. Take somewhere like Bristol. Yes, you can do the bus station but where else? Temple Meads, Horsefair, Colston Avenue, Old Market, Bond Street, Union Street... As Robert21a points out, it's no good for those travelling in from the 'burbs. Also, with changes happening by the hour/minute, is ANY firm going to be able to send out a legion of staff to update said boards? I have to say your endless criticism of First is getting a bit tiresome.

As I believe in all the Shires the Councils prohibit the bus companies from tampering with their physical timetable boards - as the OCs never tire of telling us - though I gather they are the Council's contractor for maintaining them - and apparently it didn't stop them on a least one weekend from putting diversion notices up (though perhaps as drivers often seem to use the wrong route it probably made little difference!) I know "the contract says . . . " but that seems to be more honoured in the breach, usually . . .

With the recent fare increase we were told that the twitter/PR team sent on-bus notices to all the depots and instructed them to be put on all buses, but some depots did, and some didn't at all, and some did on some buses but not on others. I suppose as they say in other parts of the country, there's nowt so queer as folk! Nor, it seems, such variety as at First Bus. Their diversity policy, perhaps they didn't hear the equality bit before the "and"?

Not correct at all. It depends on the council/area. In the former "Avon" area, it is the council. Go across the border into Wiltshire or Somerset, and it's left to the operator. Firms like First and Stagecoach (and even South West Buses and Faresave) DO update timetable cases with their changes but if it's a smaller independent like the one I quoted, then they're not.

Pre-Internet the only way to get information out beyond the bus station / town centre would have been by phone (either a recorded message or someone actually in the office answering it; both of which would have had very limited capacity) or via local radio (hoping they'd read out your info and passengers would be listening).

In that respect, use of web sites, Twitter and Facebook is massively more effective. It's the same for all companies. I remember "pre-internet" waiting for a bus in Hexham bus station in the mid-late 1980s. This would have been either United or Northumbria and, yes, one of the Carlisle to Newcastle buses had failed. The inspector did put a scrap of paper on the bus shelter to advise which was useful were you to be in Hexham bus station but no good to anyone else at any of the other stops on that route!

In terms of planned changes, I find that most firms (not just First) do put up notices on vehicles, bus stations and the few travel shops that do still exist. However, as we've experienced in the last few days, that just can't be done and so whether it is RTPI/live apps, Twitter, Facebook or websites, that really is the best medium we've got.

 

[Goldfish62]

There is a distinct difference between communicating with 21% of the population and (using your figures) 91% of the population. There is no obvious solution, other than not making human beings redundant to satisfy the shareholders who will then whinge at paying axes to support the jobless, but Twitter seems to be taking over the world of communication. I don't even now what it is, other than seeing it on media websites where it just quotes verbatim what the original story (or e-mail) said.

And whilst I accept that the recent weather caused major problems for many public transport users, and was out of the control of Transport providers, the corollory is that for most bus users up and down the country, the more general need to communicate was much less 20, or certainly 32 years ago, because punctualiity was better and headways were higher, so you would be much less likely to be "stood around like a lemon" in the first place.

I don't know about the other First companies, but First Kernow's tweets are linked to their Facebook page and also appear on the website. Not sure what else they can do.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I don't know about the other First companies, but First Kernow's tweets are linked to their Facebook page and also appear on the website. Not sure what else they can do.

Ah, but is it a substitute for a person writing on a blackboard in a bus station? In fairness, FK are one of the better exponents of social media etc.

One of my friends was one of two people responsible for updating FB/Twitter/web for another bus groups' (i.e. not First) Opcos. That was in addition to their regular duties, and was before live tracking was commonplace. It is very blase to criticise all bus companies but even with dedicated people, it is very challenging to keep up to speed.

It is an imperfect world. Ideally, bus companies would be able to have legions of people to walk round with blackboards but is that really the most effective way of quickly disseminating information? Posters and leaflets by all means but social media is a massively helpful tool.

There are better examples of the use of social media (like First Kernow) and perhaps that "best practice" should be adopted as the industry standard? However, were things better in the past? No, they weren't, and complaining about the use of twitter (and other stuff like e-tickets) is like bemoaning the loss of the quill and the florin.

NOTE: I mention travelshops. These were once a staple of many bus operators in many towns but now no more. Their justification was often supported by the ability to generate revenue from selling coach tickets and holidays - a source of revenue now broadly lost to the internet! Even here, there are variations - Stagecoach West have travelshops in their main towns whereas Stagecoach Wales (next door) have closed all theirs and some years ago.

 

[Mwanesh]

Ah, but is it a substitute for a person writing on a blackboard in a bus station? In fairness, FK are one of the better exponents of social media etc.

One of my friends was one of two people responsible for updating FB/Twitter/web for another bus groups' (i.e. not First) Opcos. That was in addition to their regular duties, and was before live tracking was commonplace. It is very blase to criticise all bus companies but even with dedicated people, it is very challenging to keep up to speed.

It is an imperfect world. Ideally, bus companies would be able to have legions of people to walk round with blackboards but is that really the most effective way of quickly disseminating information? Posters and leaflets by all means but social media is a massively helpful tool.

There are better examples of the use of social media (like First Kernow) and perhaps that "best practice" should be adopted as the industry standard? However, were things better in the past? No, they weren't, and complaining about the use of twitter (and other stuff like e-tickets) is like bemoaning the loss of the quill and the florin.

NOTE: I mention travelshops. These were once a staple of many bus operators in many towns but now no more. Their justification was often supported by the ability to generate revenue from selling coach tickets and holidays - a source of revenue now broadly lost to the internet! Even here, there are variations - Stagecoach West have travelshops in their main towns whereas Stagecoach Wales (next door) have closed all theirs and some years ago.

Stagecoach West generally the travel shops are down stairs and management upstairs same as in Bedford,Basingstoke Andover .In Wales the management are mostly based at the depot most which are not near town except Cwmbran and Brynmawr .

 

[oldman]

In the olden days it was word of mouth ('can we go home - one of the jannies says there's no buses running' was the usual thing where I worked). If a sizable proportion can found out something from the operator, then there is more chance of accurate word of mouth reaching the others.