"Fill-in" electrification ideas.

[py_megapixel]

By "fill-in" I mean those little bits which seem daft that they aren't electrified, because they could reduce diesel running elsewhere, or make a fleet far more homgeneous etc etc.
In a nutshell - I'm not talking about huge new routes being electrified, rather little bits which would really benefit.

High on my list would be:

• Coventry-Reading - would allow the XC Manchester to Bournemouth service - surely one of the worst offenders for running diesels on electrified lines - to go electric, assuming suitable dual-voltage EMUs could be procured
• Manchester-Warrington-Liverpool - a diesel island in a sea of electricity; it's madness that the wires aren't already up.

 

[PTR 444]

Some no-brainers here:

• Reading - Basingstoke
• Chippenham/Bristol Parkway - Temple Meads
• Windermere branch
• Felixstowe branch

These really all ought to be done before the end of this decade

 

[The Planner]

Not sure I would call Cov to Didcot "little" !

 

[swt_passenger]

By "fill-in" I mean those little bits which seem daft that they aren't electrified, because they could reduce diesel running elsewhere, or make a fleet far more homgeneous etc etc.
In a nutshell - I'm not talking about huge new routes being electrified, rather little bits which would really benefit.

High on my list would be:

• Coventry-Reading - would allow the XC Manchester to Bournemouth service - surely one of the worst offenders for running diesels on electrified lines - to go electric, assuming suitable dual-voltage EMUs could be procured...

You’ve unfortunately forgotten the gap between Reading and Basingstoke. I don’t think many people would describe Coventry to Didcot as a little bit of infill, but Reading to Basingstoke possibly could be.

 

[NoMorePacers]

Manchester - Liverpool via Warrington - although I'm not sure if that would fit in as being "little".

 

[High Dyke]

You’ve unfortunately forgotten the gap between Reading and Basingstoke. I don’t think many people would describe Coventry to Didcot as a little bit of infill, but Reading to Basingstoke possibly could be.

Ah, so the need for dual voltage stock for the Reading - Basingstoke part. AC at one end, DC at the other.

 

[Mag_seven]

• Reading - Basingstoke
• Chippenham/Bristol Parkway - Temple Meads

Add in the rest of the Thames Branches and Didcot - Oxford and you have the Great Western Electrification Programme as was (minus Cardiff to Swansea).

 

[CW2]

Wokingham - Guildford - Reigate (3rd rail).
Stockport - Stalybridge (to joint Transpennine electrification with WCML for through freight operation)
Crewe - Chester
Chester - Warrington

 

[GRALISTAIR]

Oxenholme to Windermere. All Manchester Airport to Windermere trains could be entirely electric- at the moment huge amount of running diesel under the wires.

Then down Filton Bank from Parkway to Bristol Temple Meads

 

[David Goddard]

Leeds - Church Fenton
Nuneaton - Coventry
Ely - Peterborough
Wokingham - Ash
Guildford - Reigate
Reading - Basingstoke
Didcot - Oxford
Hunts Cross - Deansgate
Wigan - Kirkby
Preston - Ormskirk

 

[bluenoxid]

Lancaster-Morecambe

It is a short run with shuttle service whose electrification could enable the replacement of one diesel unit. The electrification of Blackpool removes the excuse of no nearby local EMU operator. It’s electrification would be ideal practice for a rolling electrification programme and enable evidence of northern investment.

SE Manchester commuter lines (Marple)

I think this is just over 20 route miles. The problem is the various ideas suggesting Metrolink conversion. I am probably wrong but my understanding is that Tram Trains can be dual voltage so I would just suggest getting on with a design programme. It might be beneficial to use the lower light rail voltage due to existing structures but it is not my patch.

 

[43096]

• Windermere branch
• Felixstowe branch

These really all ought to be done before the end of this decade

Windermere should have been done back in 1974 with the northern West Coast scheme.

Likewise Felixstowe should have been done with Great Eastern/North London Line wiring in the 80s. There’s even less excuse now, as the local service is now worked by FLIRTs that have electric capability.

 

[Bald Rick]

Not sure I would call Cov to Didcot "little" !

Agree entirely. Its about the same distance from Market Harborough to Clay Cross!

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 24 Oct 2020 ==

Stockport - Stalybridge (to joint Transpennine electrification with WCML for through freight operation)

What freight is that?


We’ve done this thread before. Most have been mentioned, but I will chip in with the freigh5 only curves around Acton (but not the Dudding Hill Line), and the London Gateway branch.

 

[py_megapixel]

Not sure I would call Cov to Didcot "little" !

But it's little compared to the length of the services on it as a whole!

I'd forgotten that Basingstoke to Reading wasn't electrified... maybe that would be better served by an extension of the third rail, though I'm aware that ORR shudders at the mere thought of anything other than OHLE so maybe not...

 

[Bald Rick]

But it's little compared to the length of the services on it as a whole!

How many services on the line would convert to pure electric if Didcot - Coventry was electrified?

 

[SeanG]

Windermere should have been done back in 1974 with the northern West Coast scheme.

Likewise Felixstowe should have been done with Great Eastern/North London Line wiring in the 80s. There’s even less excuse now, as the local service is now worked by FLIRTs that have electric capability.

Is there any point in these given that BMUs are being used to Felixstowe and given that Northern have ordered batteries for some 331s for Windermere?
Whilst it would be great to see this electrification, would the money be better spent elsewhere for the greater good?

 

[py_megapixel]

How many services on the line would convert to pure electric if Didcot - Coventry was electrified?

The main one is CrossCountry. It is absolutely ludicrous the amount that this service runs on diesel under the wires or over a third rail - all the way from Manchester to Coventry, then from Didcot to Reading, then all the way from Basingstoke to Bournemouth.

That said a homogeneous fleet of bi-modes might serve them better, but I think we should ultimately be aiming to remove diesel from the rails altogether.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 24 Oct 2020 ==

Is there any point in these given that BMUs are being used to Felixstowe and given that Northern have ordered batteries for some 331s for Windermere?
Whilst it would be great to see this electrification, would the money be better spent elsewhere for the greater good?

It's a short single track branch which is already connected to an electrified line and causes hundreds of miles each day for diesel running under the wires. The cost to electrify it would surely be peanuts compared to one of the big headline projects like the MML.

I think Northern's new management decided that batteries weren't such a good idea after all, so I'm not sure the order has actually been placed.

 

[43096]

Is there any point in these given that BMUs are being used to Felixstowe and given that Northern have ordered batteries for some 331s for Windermere?
Whilst it would be great to see this electrification, would the money be better spent elsewhere for the greater good?

For Felixstowe the big win is enabling electric traction for freight. Decarbonisation of local services on the back of it is a bonus.

For Windermere have battery 331s actually been ordered? Last I saw the new Northern management were distinctly cold on the idea. Assuming no new grid feed is necessary it ought to be a relatively straight-forward fill-in and eliminates diesel or whatever bionic duckweed micro-fleet is flavour of the month as an alternative.

 

[Bald Rick]

The main one is CrossCountry. It is absolutely ludicrous the amount that this service runs on diesel under the wires or over a third rail - all the way from Manchester to Coventry, then from Didcot to Reading, then all the way from Basingstoke to Bournemouth.

But Didcot to Coventry doesn’t help with XC, unless you do some other gaps.

 

[py_megapixel]

But Didcot to Coventry doesn’t help with XC, unless you do some other gaps.

Why not? I can't see anything else that would need doing, other than the comparatively short hop to Basingstoke.

 

[Bald Rick]

Why not? I can't see anything else that would need doing, other than the comparatively short hop to Basingstoke.

There’s your answer!

And buying a new fleet of dual voltage trains of course, and a D.C. power upgrade south of Basingstoke. And after all that, you’ve only electrified half the cross country service on the corridor (in normal times).

 

[The Planner]

The main one is CrossCountry. It is absolutely ludicrous the amount that this service runs on diesel under the wires or over a third rail - all the way from Manchester to Coventry, then from Didcot to Reading, then all the way from Basingstoke to Bournemouth.

That said a homogeneous fleet of bi-modes might serve them better, but I think we should ultimately be aiming to remove diesel from the rails altogether.

The answer you are looking for is 1tph and only as far as Reading.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

High on my list would be:

• Coventry-Reading - would allow the XC Manchester to Bournemouth service - surely one of the worst offenders for running diesels on electrified lines - to go electric, assuming suitable dual-voltage EMUs could be procured

If this can be justified, then what about something at the London end to connect the GWML and WCML? That way, Paddington and Euston could provide some cover for each other.

 

[Railwaysceptic]

If this can be justified, then what about something at the London end to connect the GWML and WCML? That way, Paddington and Euston could provide some cover for each other.

There is of course a railway line in London running from the GWML to the WCML but the junctions face the wrong way for Paddington to be able to cover for Euston.

 

[Trackman]

Lostock - Wigan NW

 

[popeter45]

Bromsgrove - Cheltenham - Gloucester - Bristol Parkway - Bristol Temple Meads
as well as letting some XC services to go full electric would enable more freight services to use Electric Locos for the Lickey Incline

would then provide impetus for fill-ins on on the Gloucester–Newport line and Golden Valley line

 

[Bald Rick]

If this can be justified, then what about something at the London end to connect the GWML and WCML? That way, Paddington and Euston could provide some cover for each other.

Both are full. It would seem silly to try and divert trains to an a terminus that can’t take them.

 

[MarlowDonkey]

How many services on the line would convert to pure electric if Didcot - Coventry was electrified?

Oxford services could be operated by 387s rather than 802s and 165s shuttling from Didcot. There's also the local service from Leamington to Coventry.

 

[The Planner]

Oxford services could be operated by 387s rather than 802s and 165s shuttling from Didcot. There's also the local service from Leamington to Coventry.

Correction, Leamington to Nuneaton, so you would have to split the service again.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 24 Oct 2020 ==

Bromsgrove - Cheltenham - Gloucester - Bristol Parkway - Bristol Temple Meads
as well as letting some XC services to go full electric would enable more freight services to use Electric Locos for the Lickey Incline

would then provide impetus for fill-ins on on the Gloucester–Newport line and Golden Valley line

Again, 1tph XC and next to no use for freight as the Camp Hill line northwards isn't electrified.

 

[backontrack]

I think it'd make sense to get wires up on Leeds-Colton. Also, electrifying a diversionary route from Wakefield/Sandal & Agbrigg to Leeds via Methley could come in useful.