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FGW Franchise

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Clarence Yard

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Will three car 158 units do the job on the Barnstaple line or are there some services which will get max'd out? It's years since I did that service and it wasn't a pacer then, thankfully!

A question was raised earlier about SWT cl.158 units going to GW. Apparently not is the answer and the existing one that is on hire at the moment cannot be hired past early 2017. A turbo is due to replace it afterwards.
 
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RPI

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Then why do the train crew regularly send complaints about overcrowding? Several of us went West in November and spent 4 days looking at loadings in Cornwall and Devon across a range of services at various times of day. Our report mirrored what we were being told by Operations staff. More stock was needed.

Maybe they're exaggerating! More stock is needed like I said but not on the branches of Cornwall, the mainline (as in my original comment) the only Gunnislake train that can ever be classed as full and standing is the 16xx from Plymouth which on a busy day may have about 10 people standing and only because it's a 150/1 and they don't want to fit 3 abreast, off-peak services on the Gunnislake are dead. Looe would actually be an ideal place to use Chiltern standard bubble cars
 

fairysdad

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London, Surrey... bit of a blur round here...
Will three car 158 units do the job on the Barnstaple line or are there some services which will get max'd out? It's years since I did that service and it wasn't a pacer then, thankfully!
I'm not a regular user, but I'd say that a 3-car 158 would do the job capacity-wise on the route, though I'll also admit to not knowing the intricies of capacities, I know that the last couple of times I've been on a 2-car 150 on the route it's been fairly full (the experience I posted above is probably the fullest I've seen it, and there were a couple of standees in the coach I was in from Crediton to Exeter). The last time I went from Umberleigh to Exeter, it was on a 2-car 143 and it was fairly full when I got on, but for most of the journey not essentially packed though it was late morning; the late afternoon 4-car 143s northbound haven't seemed especially full, at least in the half of the train I was in. Of course, this is personal experience, and I haven't really been paying too much attention to what's not directly affected me!

This was an interesting read from a regular Tarka line user, against my notes. I made two journeys on a Friday, recently (one to Barnstaple, and one from Barnstaple an hour later - both single 143s too, lucky me ;)) and both portions were scheduled to call at the same stations. I noted that neither train stopped at Copplestone (0/2), one stopped at Morchard Road (1/2) and two at Yeoford (2/2) and Umberleigh (2/2). It doesn't surprise me that Copplestone would usually have people alighting/joining with the new housing estate alongside, and I did only make two journeys, quite close together, which I can't generalise too much from so thanks for this.
I wouldn't consider myself a regular user of the line, but I have used it a lot more frequently recently as I've been jobhunting into a specific career which has taken me to London a fair bit! (Incidentally, my next trip up to London is later this week, but I'm going from Tiverton instead as I need to be back late on the same day rather than the next day as I can usually get away with!)

I wouldn't say that all the trains I've used have stopped at these stations, but a fair number of the services I've used have. I would say that the early(ish) morning and late afternoon services are used a lot by students at either Exeter College or Exeter University; I've seen a lot of studenty-types getting on with season tickets. And as I said in my post above, on one particularly busy service that was standing from Crediton, the guard did say that he was on the same service the day before and it was almost empty. As far as I know it wasn't a special day or anything, unless there's some amazing event that happens in Exeter on a Thursday.

Capacity on the line does need improving though, whether passenger capacity (longer trains - I don't mind Pacers, apart from the really pathetic legroom, and I'm not exactly tall!) or train capacity - I was quite surprised to see when I started using the line again when coming back down here that the loop at Lapford has been taken up, I know it hasn't been used in donkey's years, but I always thought that it could be a useful little passing loop if they were to rebuild the old down(?) (Barnstaple-bound) platform and use that as an island platform instead of the current one - except, of course - that it's not that far away from Eggesford.

Either Morchard or Copplestone could be used as a passing loop as well, the former platform at one of them (can't remember which off-hand, I think it's Morchard) is fairly clear of the overgrowth and seems more open for a second platform. And of course, there's the possibility of using the Okehampton line more, instead of having the lines diverge at Crediton, have them split at Yeoford so you'd have a longer loop for trains to pass. Or you could go the whole hog and redouble the whole route (I know that even in the heyday of the line it wasn't fully doubled by the way, it's just easier to say 'redouble'!).

Of course, this is just an enthusiasts dream, and there will be plenty of flaws in my argument, not least to do with timing between loops which could cause trains to have to wait. And actually, I think that by-and-large, a capacity increase would be better by improving the capacity of the trains themselves rather than how many trains are served, mostly because it's more realistic.

Oh, and later trains would be nice so one can get back from London later in the day! (As I said, I'm going via Tiverton later this week because I need to get back on Thursday night rather than Friday morning, but if I were to go from Umberleigh as usual, I could get to Waterloo earlier on the Super Off-peak ticket than I can get into Paddington from Tiverton!)

(Apologies, much longer and much more pointless post than I intended to write...!)
 

Ingleborough

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Barnstaple 4 car 158 in the peaks, two car outside. Obviously there will be 150s at time to time, but the plan is 158s on the longer distance runs.
The only 3 car 158 will be 798.
 

plymothian

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Longer trains may mean more seating capacity, but 158 dwell times are longer, and more local door operation would be needed, slowing down trains, possibly leading to less line capacity.
 

Rapidash

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Torbaydos, Devon
I wouldn't be that worried about dwell times up the Barnstaple side - The vast bulk of people will be going from Barnstaple to Central and reverse, so I'd be expecting a delay at EXC before heading to Axminster. Axminster - Central on the other hand....thats where there will be significantly more people boarding/exiting.

Could always keep the Pacers for 'em;)
 

RPI

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Like Rapidash said, vast majority of pax on the Barny line are traveling Barny to Exeter with Copplestone and Crediton being the busiest of the intermediate stations although Yeoford is relatively well used probably because there is no bus service to the village. Another area that 150/143 units struggle on that line is their lack of luggage space, of which 158's have more.
 

CC 72100

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I wouldn't be that worried about dwell times up the Barnstaple side - The vast bulk of people will be going from Barnstaple to Central and reverse, so I'd be expecting a delay at EXC before heading to Axminster. Axminster - Central on the other hand....thats where there will be significantly more people boarding/exiting.

Could always keep the Pacers for 'em;)

And in the current timetable, Exeter-bound there is a 5-6 minute wait at Crediton anyway - surely any extended dwell times (and even then, I can't see said dwell times being that longer) could eat into this 'dead' time waiting at Crediton?
 

387star

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Will station signage be replaced with the new branding and standardised like southern rail etc

Even northern rail have replaced all station signage but the west is very outdated and a right mixture

Signage at places such as warminster and romsey is especially old

Mind you Romsey will be in the right colour scheme now...
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
@FGW being asked to move from standing in the first class corridor had some parallel to black people being asked to move to the back of bus... @FGW still akin to travel apartheid? Has awful connotations for people of colour and based on economic discrimination
2:58pm - 31 Mar 15

:roll:
 
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Flamingo

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@FGW being asked to move from standing in the first class corridor had some parallel to black people being asked to move to the back of bus... @FGW still akin to travel apartheid? Has awful connotations for people of colour and based on economic discrimination
2:58pm - 31 Mar 15

:roll:
I'm presuming you are copying a tweet?

Please tell us you are not the muppet that twited it? :)
 

fgwrich

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I'm presuming you are copying a tweet?

Please tell us you are not the muppet that twited it? :)

Fortunately not, I've just spotted it too. Looks like someone trying to wind up FGW who now want's to see the rules and claim legal advice. :roll:

https://twitter.com/FGW/status/582921352195280896

Manawar JAN-KHAN @Oxfordmjk
· 8 hrs 8 hours ago
is there a new law FGW trains have invented to stop people standing outside 1st class? Has anyone any legal advice? How can it b challenged?

0 retweets 0 favourites

Manawar JAN-KHAN @Oxfordmjk
· 10 hrs 10 hours ago
first Great Western nasty conductor on 7.33 Reading to Penzance makes up own rules and We subsidise them 4 poor service Nationalise Railways
 
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vast majority of pax on the Barny line are traveling Barny to Exeter with Copplestone and Crediton being the busiest of the intermediate stations

Crediton and Umberleigh are the busiest, followed by Eggesford, then Yeoford, then Copplestone (which has only recently overtaken Morchard Road).
 

Flamingo

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Fortunately not, I've just spotted it too. Looks like someone trying to wind up FGW who now want's to see the rules and claim legal advice. :roll:

https://twitter.com/FGW/status/582921352195280896

It wasn't my train (more's the pity...).
"You mean I can't stand next to a First Class Toilet?"
"No Sir, we have eight Standard Class toilets you can stand beside further down the train" :
 
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RPI

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Crediton and Umberleigh are the busiest, followed by Eggesford, then Yeoford, then Copplestone (which has only recently overtaken Morchard Road).
I beg to differ. If you're going by passenger numbers from the anual footfall then remember that Crediton is vastly over inflated by passengers buying Paddington to Crediton tickets in order to get around peak restrictions that apply to Exeter, also Devon evening rangers completely destroy any accurate footfall as there are no start or end stations when one is issued. It also appears that a lot of scholar passes seem to be issued to either Eggesford, Umberleigh or Barnstaple instead of the actual station that they are travelling to, now that scholar passes are issued through Star they will actually show as journeys to/from the stations shown on the ticket.
add to that an Off-peak day return from end to end is £10 then passengers are automatically sold a Devon Day ranger in order to offer flexibility then i think its fair to say footfall figures for that line are a mess.
 

387star

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If anyone has news on the GWR branding and what will be the first DMUs treated that would be great

The local lines livery is particularly drab and a class 158 in GWR livery sounds very enticing

Several class 158s have had replacement vestibule carpets fitted recently
 

Rich McLean

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If anyone has news on the GWR branding and what will be the first DMUs treated that would be great

The local lines livery is particularly drab and a class 158 in GWR livery sounds very enticing

Several class 158s have had replacement vestibule carpets fitted recently

Some hints have been dropped that 158798 could be the first to appear in the new Livery
 

Hartington

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5 Jul 2013
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165
The following e-mail just dropped into my inbox (and no, my real name is NOT Mr Male!). The link below leads to a map where you can click on stations to see improvements. I would say some of them are misleading in the extreme but I'll leave you all to make up your own minds.

https://content.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/greater-west/?utm_source=BAGWDM&utm_medium=DM&utm_campaign=BAGWcrm


Dear Mr Male,

I wanted to let you know about our exciting network plans and service developments following the announcement of our new franchise.

You can see the improvements planned for individual stations in your area on our interactive network map. Here is an overview of what's planned for the network in your area:

• 45 more services will run every day between Bristol and London, cutting journey times by up to 17 minutes from December 2018, replacing older local trains with 90mph Turbos - increasing capacity on Bristol local services by 52% starting May 2017



• Super Express Trains will also be introduced in the Cotswolds, speeding up journey times between Cheltenham and London by up to 14 minutes, giving a 2 hour journey from Worcester to London



• A £50 million investment will be made on station improvements, including 2,000 new car park spaces, improvements to customer information and PA systems, and new ticket vending machines.




From free WiFi on trains to three million additional seats a year, our ambitions extend across the whole First Great Western network. We are also raising our commitment to local communities with a £2.2 million fund for targeted stations and service improvements to encourage growth in areas of social need.

Over the coming weeks and months, we will be able to tell you about other changes in the pipeline. For more information on the plans for your area, please visit our website

Yours sincerely,

Mark Hopwood
Managing Director
First Great Western
 
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Great to see that FGW aren't bothering to flag up any improvements on the south Wales mainline <(

I thought there was going to be 3 tph from Cardiff at peak times AND new trains and electrification...
 

Flamingo

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Great to see that FGW aren't bothering to flag up any improvements on the south Wales mainline <(

I thought there was going to be 3 tph from Cardiff at peak times AND new trains and electrification...

Unless you mean Intercity, ask Arriva Train Wales. The clue is in the name...

Given current usage, there is no need for a more frequent Swansea-Cardiff-London service.
 
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FGW run services along the south Wales mainline, I clearly wasn't referring to ATW.

On that topic, is there really a need for 4 kph from Bristol - PAD (5 in the peaks)?
 
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Flamingo

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Well, here is the official release for South Wales

.

We would like to share our new plans for the network in your area.

First Great Western
A GREAT FUTURE FOR A GREATER WEST




Here is an overview of what's planned for the network in South Wales:

• With train and service upgrades, travel times between Swansea and London will be reduced by up to 20 minutes, with a journey from Cardiff to London in an hour and 45 minutes from December 2018

• In addition to two intercity trains running every hour to and from Cardiff – there will be three available at the busiest times – with one train per hour extending to Swansea

• Higher-capacity, predominantly five carriage Turbo trains will be introduced on the popular Cardiff-Bristol-Portsmouth route and on services to Weston-super-Mare and Taunton from May 2017

• 100 more customer-facing colleagues will be introduced to serve you on long-distance train services.

From free WiFi on trains to three million additional seats a year, our ambitions extend across the whole First Great Western network. We are also raising our commitment to local communities with a £2.2 million fund for targeted stations and service improvements to encourage growth in areas of social need.

Over the coming weeks and months, we will be able to tell you about other changes in the pipeline. For more information on the plans for your area, please visit our website
 

fgwrich

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From a reliable source ive heard 158798 will feature another advertising livery in afew weeks time when the Pompey contract ends

Good, I'm afraid it's going to take a while for me to get over the current smart Plain Blue / Dynamic / Local Lines liveries (Ok, Local Lines when it's looking shiny).

FGW run services along the south Wales mainline, I clearly wasn't referring to ATW.

On that topic, is there really a need for 4 kph from Bristol - PAD (5 in the peaks)?

Don't forget though some of it's going to be handled with shorter 5 Car IEPs vs the present 8 car HSTs and 2 out of the 4 will be via Bristol Parkway with the other two remaining via the present Bath Spa / Chippenham route.
 

VisualAcid

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17 Oct 2013
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142
Hope I'm not being simple but how would 5 car turbo's work without DOO? With a 2 + 3 formation?
 

infobleep

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Don't forget that this is a short franchise so the growth on existing services to 2019 would have to be pretty spectacular to outstrip the number of units that are to remain on the franchise.

I understand the DfT wanted to take even more units out but nobody wanted another 2006 situation, especially just before an election!
Why were DfT so keen to have a 2006 situation again? Do they think it's better for the railways?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
I've been taking this line fairly often recently, and I can see how it has improved slightly over the years since when I used to take it years ago. I've generally been getting it at Umberleigh (as it's the closest station to where I'm currently living, and I can park there for free!) and being able to know that I can get an Exeter train at ten to each hour (pretty much) is useful, and the last time I took it it was rather busy - I caught the 7.51 from Umberleigh and had to sit on one of the pull-down seats by the doors (was a 150) - although from the guard's comments it seems fairly erratic as he said he was on the same service the day before and it was much emptier.

I've also been surprised at how many people are using the intermediate stations, usually Morchard Road and Copplestone seem to be almost guaranteed stops, often Yeoford as well.

My reason for commenting here though is in reply to the comments about Newton St Cyres and Chapelton - I can understand Chapleton not getting a 'decent' service given it is pretty much in the middle of nowhere with no dwellings nearby (except a couple of farms and the station house itself and the RGB yard which was probably in days gone by the reason for the station in the first place), but Newton St Cyres I cannot as there are houses quite close to the station, and it's not that far from the village itself (< 1 mile if Google Maps is accurate). That said, even if it had a regular rail service, I'd imagine that the bus service from the village into Exeter would probably be a better shout for anybody wanting that journey as it'd not take that much longer (including the walk to the station) and would take you into the city centre better than the railway can...

Given Chapelton is in the middle of nowhere, I'm surprised it didn't close in the 1960s or even earlier.
 
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