EMR 180s in traffic from Mon 14th December

[Prudhoe]

180111 showing on 1M04 St Pancras-Corby

 

[dk1]

Plenty of photos of the pair at St.Pancras doing the rounds on social media.

 

[Railperf]

Any ideas of the diagrams yet M to F and Saturday?

 

[HST43257]

Is anyone aware of the allocations and diagrams for today?

 

[ExRes]

As shown on WNXX this morning

110 & 111 - 1C06 & 1D56

110 - 1D09 1B31 1D33 1B53 1B79 1F79

111 - 1M04 7P05 1D26 1B46 1B77 1P77

 

[Ianno87]

As shown on WNXX this morning

110 & 111 - 1C06 & 1D56

110 - 1D09 1B31 1D33 1B53 1B79 1F79

111 - 1M04 7P05 1D26 1B46 1B77 1P77

And in non-headcode-ese, please?

 

[JonathanH]

Reported elsewhere as 180111+180110

1C06 0519 Derby to St Pancras International

Then split for:
180110
1D09 0735 St Pancras International to Nottingham
1B31 1012 Nottingham to St Pancras International
1D33 1234 St Pancras International to Nottingham
1B53 1445 Nottingham to St Pancras International

180111
1M04 0749 St Pancras International to Corby
1P05 0932 Corby to St Pancras International
1D26 1105 St Pancras International to Nottingham
1B46 1312 Nottingham to St Pancras International
5B46 1528 St Pancras International to Cricklewood Depot
5D56 1555 Cricklewood Depot to St Pancras International

Combine for
1D56 1705 St Pancras International to Nottingham

Then split for:
180110
1B77 1912 Nottingham to St Pancras International
1P77 2130 St Pancras International to Derby

180111
1B79 1945 Nottingham to St Pancras International
1F79 2150 St Pancras International to Derby

A new thread posted here by '43055' https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/the-emr-diagrams-thread.212284/ contains the other diagram currently worked by a 222.

 

[43096]

1B31 reported delayed at Market Harborough with fire alarm activated!

 

[Railperf]

1B31 reported delayed at Market Harborough with fire alarm activated!

Seriously? Not on the 2nd day

 

[43096]

Seriously? Not on the 2nd day

Certainly delayed: Realtime Trains - 1B31 1012 Nottingham to St Pancras International

 

[Philip Phlopp]

1B31 reported delayed at Market Harborough with fire alarm activated!

I very much wish Neil from OOC was here to enjoy this schadenfreude.

 

[Mitchell Hurd]

1B31 reported delayed at Market Harborough with fire alarm activated!

There's a surprise - I knew that 180's would be a bad idea (much as I've enjoyed them). Should have kept the slam-door HST's in service for a bit longer then at least you'd have reliability!

 

[Hairy Bear]

That's right. We never have have false alarms on 222's and Hst's...........Oh yes we do......Oh no we don't. ............

 

[DB]

That's right. We never have have false alarms on 222's and Hst's...........Oh yes we do......Oh no we don't. ............

While those may not be exempt from it, there can't be many current classes which are as prone to fire alarms (some of them real) as 180s!

 

[43096]

That's right. We never have have false alarms on 222's and Hst's...........Oh yes we do......Oh no we don't. ............

First day of service. One diagram a no-show, the other two both fail during the day.

Is reliability measured in casualties per mile?

 

[43 302]

There's a surprise - I knew that 180's would be a bad idea (much as I've enjoyed them). Should have kept the slam-door HST's in service for a bit longer then at least you'd have reliability!

The slam door HSTs are still in service, just with five diagrams.

Worth noting that 43310 + NL57 + 43317 worked 1B79/1F79 vice 180110.

 

[Railperf]

It has been reported the 180s are a no show today after one of the units failed this morning.

 

[yorksrob]

Hate to say "I told you so".

They should have stuck with the HST's instead.

 

[bussikuski179]

What do you expect, when using a 180 you’ll be going nowhere.

 

[Wolfie]

Not a big surprise. Take an aging class notorious for it's unreliability even when much newer into service on a major line away from engineers who at least understand it's foibles (even if they couldn't ever solve them)... What could possibly go wrong?

 

[DB]

Not a big surprise. Take an aging class notorious for it's unreliability even when much newer into service on a major line away from engineers who at least understand it's foibles (even if they couldn't ever solve them)... What could possibly go wrong?

It's not really an age issue - Voyagers are a similar age and very reliable. More a case that the 180s have always been unreliable right from new.

 

[Wolfie]

It's not really an age issue - Voyagers are a similar age and very reliable. More a case that the 180s have always been unreliable right from new.

I thought that I'd seen figures that suggest that they'd got worse with age. You are, of course, entirely correct that they've never been great shakes reliability-wise.

 

[Railperf]

Let's see how much money needs to be thrown at them to get them running properly. EMR have got them for at least 2 years.
Worst case they will just add extra time In the diagrams for low power etc.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 16 Dec 2020 ==

Hate to say "I told you so".

They should have stuck with the HST's instead.

Easy for us armchair experts to say. There will be a few HSTs and any spare 222's deputising regularly I guess . Surely enough spare 222's while the reduced timetable is in operation. But I would imagine they need 180's running to keep drivers up to speed.

 

[yorksrob]

Let's see how much money needs to be thrown at them to get them running properly. EMR have got them for at least 2 years.
Worst case they will just add extra time In the diagrams for low power etc.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 16 Dec 2020 ==


Easy for us armchair experts to say. There will be a few HSTs and any spare 222's deputising regularly I guess . Surely enough spare 222's while the reduced timetable is in operation. But I would imagine they need 180's running to keep drivers up to speed.

To be honest, I doubt the railway engineers would have chosen to do that swap if it had been left to them.

 

[Bald Rick]

Worst case they will just add extra time In the diagrams for low power etc.

I’d say worst case is that there’s some long term cancellations and/or short forms. And that’s fairly likely given the current commercial situation, IMO.

It’s not easy to put extra time in the long distance schedules on the MML. One end screws up Thameslink, the other end screws up Cross Country, both with disastrous results for punctuality across the Network.

 

[_toommm_]

What do you expect, when using a 180 you’ll be going nowhere.

Do you think they checked the 3901 cupboard?

 

[Evolution]

A lot of nonsense being talked with regards to the 180s and their reliability. The 180s have certainly had their issues in the past but which trains haven’t? The GC ones are fairly reliable and I’ve had this information from a friend who’s a driver at GC.

The maintenance on both the HT and GC units hasn’t been the best and certainly not up to the standards you’d expect from a franchised TOC.

With a proper maintenance schedule and consistent use, these will prove to be just as reliable as any other rolling stock. And acceleration when running on all engines is better than voyagers, there will be no issues keeping to time. Give them time.

 

[yorksrob]

A lot of nonsense being talked with regards to the 180s and their reliability. The 180s have certainly had their issues in the past but which trains haven’t? The GC ones are fairly reliable and I’ve had this information from a friend who’s a driver at GC.

The maintenance on both the HT and GC units hasn’t been the best and certainly not up to the standards you’d expect from a franchise TOC.

With a proper maintenance schedule and consistent use these will prove to be just as reliable as any other rolling stock. And acceleration when running on all engines is better than voyagers, there will be no issues keeping to time. Give them time.

We shall see what we shall see.

 

[gaillark]

Having a giggle here ... with good quality retailers ...
EMR should ask for its 'money back' on the lease charges from the ROSCO as they have bought an item (well leased) that's .. well lets say ... not fit for purpose.
I'd image a fair few quid has been spent on them already.
Also I would image that the DafT and its chums at ORR will still want all HST's removed by May 2021 (logical step in retaining them) despite the poor performance currently of the 180's. I guess we'll see plenty of short formed 222's on the Midland from Easter 2021 and regular cancellations. And bucket loads of more cash thrown at the 180's.

 

[Nym]

And of course the Power Door HST conversions are doing so much better...? (Only real alternative)
Possibly take some of the Mk.5s in sub lease from TPE?