Edinburgh Tram developments

[sng7]

In fairness it has taken me 40 minutes to get from the bus station to ferrytoll park and ride on stagecoach before without the trams, they can't be making it worse than it can be without them

 

[90019]

The trams have had a big impact on stagecoach/first services, due to the frequent c@ck ups at the West End!

Have you seen how long they take at bus stops?!

Many trams have been and gone, civilisations have risen and fallen, whole continents have split to form new lands in the time it takes them to load 10 people at a stop.

 

[Starmill]

↲I agree that motorists have no cause for complaint here however another group youv overlooked is those on foot and those who have already got off badly delayed buses trying to get on with our lives.↲

I'm confused by how a tram impedes the passage of a pedestrian.

Manchester City Centre is choc full of trams and I'm very rarely inconvenienced by them?

 

[AngusH]

I'm confused by how a tram impedes the passage of a pedestrian.

Manchester City Centre is choc full of trams and I'm very rarely inconvenienced by them?

At the pedestrian crossings I get the impression that some of the wait times have been extended, particularly at the east end of Princes Street. The junction there is where the tram joins the main bus thoroughfare so it gets very congested. There is also a road up from the railway station.

(I have no actual evidence of the timing changes, it may be entirely my imagination)

I seem to recall from somewhere that the timings are still being worked on, so hopefully it will get better.


As a pedestrian I think the best plan might be to remove one of the foot crossings at the east end and give more time on the other.

Not that I actually know anything on this topic, so that might make things worse.

 

[Liam]

Have you seen how long they take at bus stops?!

Many trams have been and gone, civilisations have risen and fallen, whole continents have split to form new lands in the time it takes them to load 10 people at a stop.

Aye, but you only have 4 buttons to press. Adult single, day ticket, child single, day ticket.

No change to count out either.

 

[90019]

Aye, but you only have 4 buttons to press. Adult single, day ticket, child single, day ticket.

I wish.

No change to count out either.

That's the best bit.

 

[Blindtraveler]

and if you drive for First you have the much cursed Almex Machines to fight with - v slow! I can state for a fact pedestrian crossing times have gone up and they had better be working on them, I missed my train the other day having left home
early!
Removing a crossing at the East end wouldnt help much as pre tram the intigration betweeen these 3 was rather good and its just the poorly implimented tram thing thats messing it up. Furthermore the pavements couldnt hold the numbers wating if a crossing point was removed!↲

 

[Stan Drews]

Have you seen how long they take at bus stops?!

Many trams have been and gone, civilisations have risen and fallen, whole continents have split to form new lands in the time it takes them to load 10 people at a stop.

It's funny how we all see the same thing, but interpret them so differently!

I've lost count how many times I've been on a Stagecoach bus that has been held up by Lothian buses at stops, but at least when they get going they don't mess about.

The trams blocking junctions is the biggest issue for other road users, as this has been happening at key city centre junctions far more often than it should be. Until they sort that aspect out, I can't see any improvements to the current regular delays being suffered to buses etc.

 

[overthewater]

In fairness it has taken me 40 minutes to get from the bus station to ferrytoll park and ride on stagecoach before without the trams, they can't be making it worse than it can be without them

Before all the crap started you used to be able to do that within 35mins, Since 2000 its taken longer and longer. Thankful someone at Stagecoach had the hindsight to not operate into the bus station during York place closure, I dread to think of the deleys.

I believe the trams should have went down the middle of George St, ie getting rid of the parking spaces.

 

[chiltern trev]

Well, for the second time in as many days, the tram signals at the West End failed this evening, stranding an eastbound tram at the junction with South Charlotte Street (it was both a westbound and eastbound tram last night), causing buses to be diverted while they fixed it.

It was only stuck for about 15 minutes or so, but not exactly good for it to happen in the same place on two consecutive nights.
Not sure the punters on board would be best pleased, as I doubt they'd disembark them there due to the tram lines being in the middle of the road and that being a rather busy junction.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


Just so you know, that isn't true.

So are there any 'processes' for the tram driver to take the initiative here in the event of a tram being stranded due to failed traffic signals?

And in these 2 instances, what does stranded mean? I presume it means a tram has ended up being part way across an intersection so some or all of the tram is fouling one or more traffic lanes or pedestrians crossings.

If there is still power to the tram, is not a case of wait for a few minutes, then proceed at walking pace whilst sounding the bell and hazard lights flashing until the offending traffics lights/intersection has been cleared?

 

[90019]

So are there any 'processes' for the tram driver to take the initiative here in the event of a tram being stranded due to failed traffic signals?

Apparently not.
They failed again this evening, but this time at 5.45pm, apparently causing chaos. :roll:

I was rather glad to be out past Gilmerton when the message came over the radio.

And in these 2 instances, what does stranded mean? I presume it means a tram has ended up being part way across an intersection so some or all of the tram is fouling one or more traffic lanes or pedestrians crossings.

They were stuck at the lights, I'm not sure if the eastbound one was fouling either junction, but the westbound one was stuck on Princes Street before the junction.

 

[Blindtraveler]

Apparently not.
They failed again this evening, but this time at 5.45pm, apparently causing chaos. :roll:Indeed it was a bit mental, I got delayed on the 37 at the West end, not helped by its current diversion and missed the 44 to whitecraig which bus tracker was showing on time at Haymarket. Then discovered the previous one half an hour before it was delayed so raced it to Musselburgh on a First Limmited stop and overtook him. ↲

a great exersize in journey planning though it may be, thats 3 failures in less than 2 weeks. Are notwork rail involved? and having now taken a trip to airport and back, with a totally open mind, I was far from impressed by them yesturday!↲

 

[Clip]

This is what makes Britain great isnt it? The British people.

It's only been open what, a week or so and early teething issues now mean that the whole of the Tram Project in Edinburgh is a massive failure, a White Elephant if you will*, keeps breaking down, signals dont work, what a load of rubbish. Hang the council. We're all doomed.


Im sure after a few weeks of bedding in that it will settle down and people will get used to the Trams being there you impatient buggers.







* I do however agree that it has cost far too much.

 

[90019]

It's only been open what, a week or so and early teething issues now mean that the whole of the Tram Project in Edinburgh is a massive failure, a White Elephant if you will*, keeps breaking down, signals dont work, what a load of rubbish. Hang the council. We're all doomed.

They were testing them for months to iron out things like signal problems, and yet they're still failing in the same places.

It feels like they rushed to get the trams going by the 31st, as a face saving exercise because they'd announced that the trams would be running in May, and ploughed on regardless of problems that were still there.

 

[Zoidberg]

They were testing them for months to iron things like signal problems, and yet they're still failing in the same places.

It feels like they rushed to get the trams going by the 31st, as a face saving exercise because they'd announced that the trams would be running in May, and ploughed on regardless of problems that were still there.

Exactly - and I wholeheartedly agree with the observation in your second paragraph.

 

[CallySleeper]

They were testing them for months to iron out things like signal problems, and yet they're still failing in the same places.

It feels like they rushed to get the trams going by the 31st, as a face saving exercise because they'd announced that the trams would be running in May, and ploughed on regardless of problems that were still there.

Absolutely. Classic Edinburgh.

 

[DynamicSpirit]

This is what makes Britain great isnt it? The British people.

It's only been open what, a week or so and early teething issues now mean that the whole of the Tram Project in Edinburgh is a massive failure, a White Elephant if you will*, keeps breaking down, signals dont work, what a load of rubbish. Hang the council. We're all doomed.


Im sure after a few weeks of bedding in that it will settle down and people will get used to the Trams being there you impatient buggers.

I can't help being reminded of how unpopular the Sheffield Trams were when they were being built 20 years ago - due to the disruption caused by building the lines, and the perception of being a bit of an expensive white elephant (A big years-long 'teething problem' over how to connect to the railway station didn't help either).

I no longer live in Sheffield, but from what I gather online, the trams there are now generally regarded as a success.

 

[Clip]

I can't help being reminded of how unpopular the Sheffield Trams were when they were being built 20 years ago - due to the disruption caused by building the lines, and the perception of being a bit of an expensive white elephant (A big years-long 'teething problem' over how to connect to the railway station didn't help either).

I no longer live in Sheffield, but from what I gather online, the trams there are now generally regarded as a success.

As I am sure these ones in Edinburgh will be but lets bitch and moan about them now when they have just started service.

 

[Blindtraveler]

the comparison you make is oft made by people on and off the forums but is unfare. Tramways in *insert name of city or area thats had them built in the last 25 years*
actually
go
somewhere
vaigly
helpfull, where as all theyv ever done and will ever do here is:
Cost the city and its residents far far more than the councils spin suggests
Doesnt actually go anywhere the bus doesnt go in a by and large more cost effective manner
serve as a great example of how to not impliment a light rail system
show a blatent diseguard for the views of those who live and work here.

↲

The admition that the whole thing isnt worth its while is made, not so much in words but in actions and by this I mean removing the X12 and 12 bus service from the Ingleston P and R accept for a limmited few, forsing foalk onto the tram which effectively removes the choice the tram was ment to create whilst at the same time removing many journey opportunitties that have existed for quite some time all tìs is before Iv started on teething issues that had they implimented things correctly!

 

[Tom B]

I was most amused to find that the trams, costing many millions of pounds of taxpayers, ratepayers and farepayers money, apparently cannot cope with rain. The one on which I travelled last week had to wait at each stop whilst the driver wiped the windscreen with blue roll!

 

[Blindtraveler]

and the track drainage at some stations way out West is not great, rather damp at the Gyle on Monday

 

[90019]

The admition that the whole thing isnt worth its while is made, not so much in words but in actions and by this I mean removing the X12 and 12 bus service from the Ingleston P and R accept for a limmited few, forsing foalk onto the tram which effectively removes the choice the tram was ment to create whilst at the same time removing many journey opportunitties that have existed for quite some time all tìs is before Iv started on teething issues that had they implimented things correctly!

There's going to be lots of people turning up at Ingliston Park and Ride this summer hoping to get the bus to the Zoo, only to find that the 12 has been cut back and the tram doesn't serve it. Now they'll either have to drive to the zoo and try to get parked nearby (have fun with that in the middle of summer...), or get the 35 to the Gyle and change onto the 12 there.

I was most amused to find that the trams, costing many millions of pounds of taxpayers, ratepayers and farepayers money, apparently cannot cope with rain. The one on which I travelled last week had to wait at each stop whilst the driver wiped the windscreen with blue roll!

Presumably the cab aircon doesn't work particularly well.

Though, of course, the passengers don't get aircon, but instead get three hopper windows on each side of the tram. Most people I've spoken to who've been on the trams so far have complained about the heat inside, and those were on days when it wasn't particularly hot outside.
I wonder if they'll still like the trams so much during the middle of summer, and especially the festival, when Princes Street gets really busy and they're stuck in traffic with no air flow through the tram.

 

[kylemore]

I was most amused to find that the trams, costing many millions of pounds of taxpayers, ratepayers and farepayers money, apparently cannot cope with rain. The one on which I travelled last week had to wait at each stop whilst the driver wiped the windscreen with blue roll!

Perhaps being Spanish they didn't think coping with the rain was that important (except on the Plain of course).

 

[Blindtraveler]

more great points there from
90019.
As a bus driver, he out of all of us know just how many zoogoers the 12 used to shift at weekends and holidays to and from the Park and Ride. having used the tram on a day when rain was the topic of conversation I too agree that airflow is, well
crap!
If they wanted to sell more Dae tickets and Readercards then they could have done it another way than building a tram, cutting the buses and, surposidly offering people more choice.

 

[90019]

more great points there from
90019.
As a bus driver, he out of all of us know just how many zoogoers the 12 used to shift at weekends and holidays to and from the Park and Ride.

And someone who actually drove the 12 until last saturday, when it changed depot.

 

[Liam]

There's going to be lots of people turning up at Ingliston Park and Ride this summer hoping to get the bus to the Zoo, only to find that the 12 has been cut back and the tram doesn't serve it. Now they'll either have to drive to the zoo and try to get parked nearby (have fun with that in the middle of summer...), or get the 35 to the Gyle and change onto the 12 there.

Are Ratho folks p****d off at losing their direct bus to the City Centre?

 

[Zoidberg]

Are Ratho folks p****d off at losing their direct bus to the City Centre?

Just a wee bit. There was some mention in an Edinburgh Evening News article and in comments to the various "aren't the trams wonderful" articles recently.

 

[90019]

Are Ratho folks p****d off at losing their direct bus to the City Centre?

Yes.

As are the people who work out at Ratho and Newbridge who used the 12 to get there, particularly those starting or finishing late at night.

 

[Tom B]

Ratho must surely class as the most altered service in recent years. It was on the X48, then the 12, then back on the 48/X48, then back on the 12, now it has a piddly link service! Doubtless that is a Council stipulation to push people on to the tram. Is the 12 now back on its pre-2009 route to the Gyle?

 

[90019]

Doubtless that is a Council stipulation to push people on to the tram.

It seems not, as the 20 doesn't go into Ingliston Park and Ride.