East-West Rail (EWR) countdown to entry into service

[Falcon1200]

Some of us don't think it's OK for that 12-car train to run hundreds of miles in that manner.

East-West Rail trains will not be anything like that.

RMT has been one of the biggest proponents for nationalisation of them

Somewhat forgetting that the proponent and inaugurator of DOO was the nationalised British Rail!

 

[Peter Sarf]

Unfortunately this thread, much like EWR, has been taken over by a subject that should have been consigned to history last century.

Where are the trains with doors only controlled by passengers and unable to be locked ?.
(confined to history)

 

[ox_chap]

The off-peak Gerrards Cross, Princes Risborough, Bicester North and Banbury terminators have never been restored post-pandemic, so the intermediate calls have been picked up by the Oxford and Birmingham services. Oxford services mostly being 165s instead of 168s or 172s doesn't help either.

One Oxford per hour used to be non-stop from Marylebone to High Wycombe and the other used to be non-stop from Marylebone to Haddenham & Thame Parkway. In both cases, they then ran non-stop to Bicester Village.

It’s not quite that simple though. Because the 800s now do Oxford Paddington more quickly, as I understand it, Chiltern decided not to compete as a fast link to London. Instead it is more a semi-fast service that happens to terminate at Oxford, and at certain times, you can buy a cheap ticket but for a slower journey.

 

[rmHawk765]

It's not crazy because no one who wants the guard is saying it is alright that a 12 carriage train runs with only a driver.

Mind you, 12-car DOO operation was not introduced without issues either. GTR had to obtain an Injunction in 2016 to prevent ASLEF drivers from refusing to drive 12-car Gatwick Express trains as DOO, and RMT consistently fought (with strikes etc) between 2016 and 2017 with GTR's decision to downgrade the role of the 2nd person on Southern services to non-safety-critical.

Arguing over DOO is nothing new but union resistance is futile; nothing is changing without a government which is actually willing to fund a guard on every train.

 

[Peter Sarf]

Mind you, 12-car DOO operation was not introduced without issues either. GTR had to obtain an Injunction in 2016 to prevent ASLEF drivers from refusing to drive 12-car Gatwick Express trains as DOO, and RMT consistently fought (with strikes etc) between 2016 and 2017 with GTR's decision to downgrade the role of the 2nd person on Southern services to non-safety-critical.

Arguing over DOO is nothing new but union resistance is futile; nothing is changing without a government which is actually willing to fund a guard on every train.

Money that could be better spent on Nurses, Defence etc etc.

New thread any one ?.
(this subject is not specific to one line or service group)

 

[Zomboid]

Let's just not go down the DOO toxic rabbit hole, there be dragons.

 

[JamesT]

We'll see, but if the drivers have agreed to the concept and the new staff are recruited on the basis of not being guards then there'd be nothing to stop the EWR services starting.

Chiltern guards could then go on strike over it, but they're not under threat and have never been required for EWR, and that wouldn't prevent those trains from running.

ASLEF have stated they won't discuss EWR until something is agreed with the RMT.

 

[Carlisle]

ASLEF have stated they won't discuss EWR until something is agreed with the RMT.

No surprises there as they always sit on the fence in this manor in these scenarios.

Ideally we need robust management to call their bluff & offer transfer or redundancy to any drivers not wishing to operate the route with OBS type staff like Southern /Scotrail have for years .

Inform RMT that whilst actual job roles may alter over time employment is safe for all staff that want it currently working as guards north of Banbury & going on strike won’t change anything.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

No surprises there as they always sit on the fence in this manor in these situations. Ideally we need robust management to call their bluff & offer transfer or redundancy to any drivers not wishing to operate the route with OBS type staff like Southern /Scotrail have for years & inform RMT jobs are safe for staff north of Banbury & going on strike won’t change anything.

That’s not sitting on the fence. That’s siding with the RMT.

 

[JonathanH]

That’s not sitting on the fence. That’s siding with the RMT.

It isn't supporting the RMT though.

If the RMT are going to win this dispute they really need help from the driver's union. If the DfT are going to win, they need the driver's union to co-operate with their propsals. ASLEF appear to be doing neither, which can be translated as sitting on the fence.

 

[Carlisle]

It isn't supporting the RMT though.

If the original media reports of an agreement for OBS type staff are true then ASLEF might have moved the goalposts when the RMT later objected.
Similar to enforcing RDW agreements at various TOCs, it’s on the fringe of the legal/unofficial industrial action debate as the former boss of Avanti West Coats highlighted when in charge.

 

[Mag_seven]

I have created a separate thread to discuss the GWR diversions over this route.

GWR Diversions over East West Rail - Nov 2026

Moderator Note - split from: https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/east-west-rail-ewr-countdown-to-entry-into-service.275902/ GWR https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/search/detailed/gb-nr:WNO/2026-11-28/0600-2000?stp=WVS&show=all&order=wtt

www.railforums.co.uk

 

[fishwomp]

If the original media reports of an agreement for OBS type staff are true then ASLEF might moved the goalposts when the RMT later objected.
Similar to enforcing RDW agreements at various TOCs, it’s on the fringe of the legal/unofficial industrial action debate as the former boss of Avanti West Coats highlighted when in charge.

The Oxford Clarion in their weekly update published a link to an ASLEF article about the situation.. https://aslef.org.uk/system/files/2026-08/aslef_journal_august.pdf?ref=oxfordclarion.uk (page 9)

How not to do it
Whether we look north, south, east or west we want more and better services for passengers and freight. Because we want to build a better railway in Britain. That is why, more in sadness than anger, DO7 STEVE AUSTIN analyses how one train company has offered a masterclass in how not to deliver a railway project

 

[Carlisle]

Thanks for the information.
Sounds like all sides were fully aware from the outset how this was likely to play out & have essentially sat back & left it to the politicians to sort it out .

 

[Pinza68]

Are 196.010 and 168.329 actually working in service today, or are they on Test between Oxford and Bletchley

 

[Bletchleyite]

Are 196.010 and 168.329 actually working in service today, or are they on Test between Oxford and Bletchley

They appear to be on test/training runs. The service is not open to the public yet. Realtime Trains does seem to show them operating on EWR today though so those are the test/training units today.

 

[Sun Chariot]

Are 196.010 and 168.329 actually working in service today, or are they on Test between Oxford and Bletchley

Driver familiarisation, as per previous months. Their paths are 5Fxx and 5Mxx

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/search/detailed/gb-nr:WNO/2026-08-17/0600-2000?stp=WVS&show=all&order=wtt

 

[A S Leib]

What happened to 5F15 today? It went from Bletchley West Junction to High Level twelve minutes early then seemingly never got to Milton Keynes Central.

(I say seemingly; I didn't see it there twenty minutes after it was due to arrive, but did see 196010 on 5F19.)

 

[800002]

What happened to 5F15 today? It went from Bletchley West Junction to High Level twelve minutes early then seemingly never got to Milton Keynes Central.

(I say seemingly; I didn't see it there twenty minutes after it was due to arrive, but did see 196010 on 5F19.)

It ran to Oxford as 5F16, although the schedule pulled was the one to Bletchely West Jn.

 

[D1511]

I saw this pull into MKC today, so I lingered to see if the doors actually open on these units. Seemingly not, as the driver and other person in hi-vis (was he safety critical, I wonder ....) changed ends internally.......
These drivers must know the route with their eyes shut by now.........they've done more training runs than the Ethiopian national marathon squad.

 

[Peter Sarf]

Nice picture @D1511. Livery colours set off nicely by the blue sky and the grey buildings behind. The more I look the more I like the composition.

 

[ox_chap]

Just think how useful that would have been last Sunday with no XC trains northbound from Oxford. Could have got a bunch of people over to the West Coast mainline......

 

[zwk500]

Just think how useful that would have been last Sunday with no XC trains northbound from Oxford. Could have got a bunch of people over to the West Coast mainline......

And indeed yesterday (Monday 24th), with the fire around Canley which stopped anything running beyond Rugby for several hours. Ticket acceptance on Chiltern and XC, change Leamington for the Nuneaton train to Coventry, Bus to Rugby/Long Buckby/Northampton; Change Oxford for EWR to MKC, change there for Northampton/Trent Valley and Watford/Euston.

 

[150219]

Just think how useful that would have been last Sunday with no XC trains northbound from Oxford. Could have got a bunch of people over to the West Coast mainline......

There were additional trains in the paths of the XCs, or were you just trying to make a point!?

 

[Robin Edwards]

There were two "Chiltern" 196s seen around Bletchley yesterday. 196007 was seen at High Level on 5F24 from MKC to Oxford whilst 196008 came off the depot into P5 before heading towards MKC with 5F90. This one needed to reverse so driver stepped to platform. Another person wearing hi-viz remained onboard.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

There were additional trains in the paths of the XCs, or were you just trying to make a point!?

Who are you trying to defend (and why) by asking this?

It cannot be denied that the ability to jump on a train to Milton Keynes and straight onto a direct train to New Street, Stafford, Stoke and Manchester would have still been an incredibly useful contingency in such a situation, regardless of whether or not Chiltern were able to provide a two carriage Turbo to Moor Street SOME hours.

 

[XCTurbostar]

RMT now in dispute with Chiltern Railways over extension of DOO

 

[JonathanH]

RMT now in dispute with Chiltern Railways over extension of DOO

In a way, that is a positive move, as it now takes the dispute into the public view, rather than simply being an uncertainty. You really do wonder why a Labour government is holding firm on driver only operation and not authorising the recruitment of guards for this service.

 

[williamn]

In a way, that is a positive move, as it now takes the dispute into the public view, rather than simply being an uncertainty. You really do wonder why a Labour government is holding firm on driver only operation and not authorising the recruitment of guards for this service.

Probably because they have an eye on costs for which they're now wholly responsible for?

 

[Tom125]

Probably because they have an eye on costs for which they're now wholly responsible for?

Agreed and huge demand for tax payers money across public services, debt repayments and defence costs no one expected a few years ago.