East-West Rail (EWR): Consultation updates [not speculation]

[richieb1971]

sadly that is because you have no idea about project delivery, funding, approvals, statutory consents, designs, public consultation, political machinations, resource conflicts etc etc etc.

Oh I beginning to. 2 years to see if a badger is in the trees, 6 years to monitor how many people are crossing the public right of way on the railway, 4 years to see if anyone has noticed that nothing has been done. Then maybe, if you lucky you might see some movement.



Railways have the slowest funding, designing, approval, Statutory consenting, public consultation, political machination, resource conflicts processes known to man. In the UK of course.

Sometimes you need to have a sense of urgency, get the ball rolling, get into 5th gear.

 

[DarloRich]

Oh I beginning to. 2 years to see if a badger is in the trees, 6 years to monitor how many people are crossing the public right of way on the railway, 4 years to see if anyone has noticed that nothing has been done. Then maybe, if you lucky you might see some movement.



Railways have the slowest funding, designing, approval, Statutory consenting, public consultation, political machination, resource conflicts processes known to man. In the UK of course.

Sometimes you need to have a sense of urgency, get the ball rolling, get into 5th gear.

top flight cliches there Gary. :roll: It simply isn't worth trying to discuss things with you rationally. You are simply unwilling or unable to consider reality. Even something as simple as prioritising work load appears to pass you by!
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So has anything actually changed here? I thought Hendy said it was only going to get to GRIP 3 or 4 by the start of CP6? It was never going to open completely before 2022 based on that and having to be built alongside HS2.

no - but it seems announcement must be followed immediately by train running!

 

[richieb1971]

top flight cliches there Gary. :roll: It simply isn't worth trying to discuss things with you rationally. You are simply unwilling or unable to consider reality. Even something as simple as prioritising work load appears to pass you by!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


no - but it seems announcement must be followed immediately by train running!

An announcement telling the train is going to be late before its due would be nice.

The way these politicians and railway things work is just to stay really quiet for about 2 years until someone gets up and takes notice and calls them out on it.

In this case the investors have lost patience. They invested (I can't remember without looking but somewhere in the £46m ball park) and had NOTHING to show for it. Obviously these investors felt a bit like me, a sense of urgency is required.

What is Hendy going to say at this so called meeting that is going to sound positive? I doubt anything.. He will probably say a lot of things and it will lead to a glimmer of hope (1% chance) of anything done on time and the investors will have to be happy with that.

 

[davetheguard]

Meanwhile, on a positive note, here are a few pictures I took just over a week ago of work at Oxford station to accommodate Chiltern's half hourly service to/from London Marylebone.

All platforms at Oxford have been renumbered, with the existing northbound bay platform (now renumbered 2) already rebuilt. Alongside it, a new platform (which will become no. 1) is under construction.

 

[richieb1971]

Meanwhile, on a positive note, here are a few pictures I took just over a week ago of work at Oxford station to accommodate Chiltern's half hourly service to/from London Marylebone.

All platforms at Oxford have been renumbered, with the existing northbound bay platform (now renumbered 2) already rebuilt. Alongside it, a new platform (which will become no. 1) is under construction.

Is that where that parcel van carriage was located for a while? A year or so ago there was a siding with a really old bluish parcel van carriage in it.

 

[daodao]

I don't expect Bedford-Cambridge to be reopened for at least 20 years, if ever.

 

[swt_passenger]

Meanwhile, on a positive note, here are a few pictures I took just over a week ago of work at Oxford station to accommodate Chiltern's half hourly service to/from London Marylebone.

All platforms at Oxford have been renumbered, with the existing northbound bay platform (now renumbered 2) already rebuilt. Alongside it, a new platform (which will become no. 1) is under construction.

Might I suggest copying this post into the Chiltern to Oxford thread, where it possibly answers a recent question about the speed with which the staff building is coming down. It looks to me as though it doesn't actually prevent building most of the platform; just the eventual passenger access.

http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=73497&page=113

 

[jimm]

An announcement telling the train is going to be late before its due would be nice.

The way these politicians and railway things work is just to stay really quiet for about 2 years until someone gets up and takes notice and calls them out on it.

In this case the investors have lost patience. They invested (I can't remember without looking but somewhere in the £46m ball park) and had NOTHING to show for it. Obviously these investors felt a bit like me, a sense of urgency is required.

What is Hendy going to say at this so called meeting that is going to sound positive? I doubt anything.. He will probably say a lot of things and it will lead to a glimmer of hope (1% chance) of anything done on time and the investors will have to be happy with that.

I'm rather confused about who 'these politicians' that are staying quiet are supposed to be.

The East West Consortium - which has pledged the £45m towards the overall costs, rather than some 'investors' - is made up of councils, which are run by politicians like councillor Rose, who are the ones doing the complaining about how Network Rail is handling the project...

 

[TheKnightWho]

I don't expect Bedford-Cambridge to be reopened for at least 20 years, if ever.

The preferred option has been selected, and a final decision is incoming in the next few months. You have no idea what you are talking about.

 

[The Planner]

Might not be 20, but it will be a decade I would suspect.

 

[snowball]

The preferred option has been selected, and a final decision is incoming in the next few months. You have no idea what you are talking about.

A final decison within months is not possible. We only have a corridor, not yet a line drawn on a map. There are several rounds of design, consultation and authorisation to go through yet. Ten years to opening sounds highly plausible.

 

[davetheguard]

Is that where that parcel van carriage was located for a while? A year or so ago there was a siding with a really old bluish parcel van carriage in it.

Yes, in fact two old parcel vans that had not turned a wheel in twenty years or more.

Both are now gone at last, with the new platform being constructed in their place.

 

[HowardGWR]

I think it would be reasonable to expect detailed 'lines on a map' to be produced within the next few months. It should be technically possible, as the latest options report enumerated every listed house, commercial property, nature asset, and so on, within 300m. That must mean that the 'lines on a map' already existed, otherwise those data would be have been meaningless.

 

[swt_passenger]

Whenever I read these linked news articles, I come away with the thought that they never really say anything explicit, and that they often confuse dates for EWR phase 2 as we know it i.e. Bicester to Bletchley, (and on to Bedford), with hypothetical future plans for Bedford to Cambridge, which as we know are not yet confirmed.

It would much simpler if the projects could have completely separate names...

 

[158756]

I am confused from reading this thread. So please could someone clarify a few things;

1) What is the currently expected date for Bicester-Bletchley opening (which was 2017 not so long ago)? Is this actually definitely going to happen?

2) What are the chances of anything ever being built east of Bedford? Am I correct in thinking there is no funding for it and no timescale for when it might happen?

 

[The Planner]

In terms of 1) it is open now, but I really wouldn't expect much in the way of upgrades as part of E-W phase 2, as for 2) you are pretty much on the money with that.

 

[Tobbes]

I'm bullish that the Central Section (Phase 3?) will be built, but a decade seems reasonable. There is all of the optioneering, TWAO and construction to do. A decade also allows the beginning of, e.g., a new town at on Bassingbourne Barracks, which with a station to Cambridge would be very attractive place to stick say 10-15,000 homes.

 

[HowardGWR]

In terms of 1) it is open now, but I really wouldn't expect much in the way of upgrades as part of E-W phase 2, as for 2) you are pretty much on the money with that.

That's news to me. Where is Winslow station then (for example)?.

 

[The Planner]

Whoops, thought it said Bletchley Bedford, too much Sunday booze.

 

[eMeS]

That's news to me. Where is Winslow station then (for example)?.

I was over there one month ago, didn't see anything at Winslow, but the track at Verney Junction is again now well covered with weeds, as it is at the station beyond Winslow, Swanbourne. There's missing fishplates and misalignment on the track on the bridge above Claydon Brook, so it might be a bumpy ride.
I also noticed some legal notices along the track advising that something is about to happen.

 

[petersi]

Has Bicester to Bletchley got to Beyond GRIP stage 3 ?

 

[Bald Rick]

For the 'Central' section: It's a new railway through England's Green and Pleasant land. Even if there was committed funding for delivery now (there isn't), and a preferred (detailed) route selected after consultation (there isn't), it would be 8-10 years at best:

2 years for design / preparation of environmental statements / consents info
2 years to complete the consents process
1 year to buy property and complete design post consents
3-4 years to build

Realistically, I'd say 15 years at best, more like 20, if ever.

And before anyone whinges about how long it takes things to do things in this country - by European standards this is quick. For example the Nîmes-Montpellier bypass, a 60km mixed traffic line (albeit capable of operating TGVs at full speed), completed the consent process in 2005. It doesn't open until December 2017.

 

[petersi]

Being a pessimist I would be surprised if Bletchley to Bicester was opened much be mid 2020's which is 10 years to open a mothballed line

http://www.railtechnologymagazine.c...p-3-milestones-and-push-them-back-nine-months

No report that single option has been selected for design

I Would doubt any work on the ground other than surveys and ground clearance much before cp6

 

[snowball]

Being a pessimist I would be surprised if Bletchley to Bicester was opened much be mid 2020's which is 10 years to open a mothballed line

http://www.railtechnologymagazine.c...p-3-milestones-and-push-them-back-nine-months

No report that single option has been selected for design

I Would doubt any work on the ground other than surveys and ground clearance much before cp6

You do realise that link's a year old?

 

[petersi]

Yes
One might expect the east west rail web site to report that GRIP3 was complete or even some one reporting it in this thread I have not Sean anything but there are 2 working days left in August

 

[Andyjs247]

A few months ago I think the consensus was that opening of EWR phase 2 from Bicester to Bletchley plus Aylesbury to MK (and also Reading/Oxford to MK/Bedford) would likely slip from 2019 to 2022. Now even that seems too optimistic. Delay has been in part due to the knock on from other delayed electrification schemes and lack of resource at Network Rail. Yet it still hasn't been replanned and a new schedule announced.

Sometime within CP6 feels still doable, so by 2024. Though it still would depend on getting Oxford station rebuild and remodelling sorted out. But I now understand Council leaders along the proposed East West Rail route are seeking a meeting with Sir Peter Hendy to discuss concerns that the project may be postponed beyond 2024.

See this article from Rail Technology Magazine.
East West Rail ‘no longer third most important project in country'

Council leaders along the proposed East West Rail route are seeking a meeting with Sir Peter Hendy to discuss concerns that the project may be postponed beyond 2024.
The much-delayed project was originally due to open in 2017, then 2019, before being pushed back until the end of CP6.
There were signs of progress at the end of March when Network Rail announced its preferred route for the central section, through the Bedford-Sandy-Cambridge corridor.
However, Cllr Rodney Rose, deputy leader of Oxfordshire County Council and chair of the East West Rail Consortium, which represents the councils involved, told RTM: “It’s already going up to 2024 and that might slip a bit now. I’m getting very concerned about it. It’s a bit of a blow to the local authorities that have put money in.”

Notwithstanding the above I can still see a need to push on with the EWR infrastructure as it impacts on construction of HS2.

 

[jimm]

Andy,

The RTM story (and preceding Oxford Mail one) was posted three days ago on page 56, hence the current discussion

 

[daodao]

The preferred option has been selected, and a final decision is incoming in the next few months. You have no idea what you are talking about.

Please see others' later posts, which don't differ much from my cynicism.

 

[HowardGWR]

I agree that the actual build may take as long as others here have posted, but to me, the important factor is that the actual planning process proceeds. Perhaps because I doubt I will live to see it opened, (I'm 71), if I were local promoters, I would at least want to ensure that all the Local Plans had the chosen trajectory safeguarded and ready for that development when finance again became available. They should press on with achieving the stage of a sufficiently detailed design so that the project cannot be held up by planning issues.

 

[swt_passenger]

Yes
One might expect the east west rail web site to report that GRIP3 was complete or even some one reporting it in this thread I have not Sean anything but there are 2 working days left in August

GRIP 3 for phase 2 is a regulated output due Dec 2016, according to the March 2016 update to the CP5 plans. I wouldn't expect it in August...