East coast question

[Railguy220]

I was at Edinburgh zoo yesterday looking at all the empty enclosures and you can get a pretty good view of the railway and had sat down to have a little look. I was sitting there and noticed a east coast Hst go by, and as I watched the train go by I saw what I think was something being towed on the back of it. Now I was about four miles away from the line but you could see it quite clearly it was navy blue like the GNER livery. Do they still have GNER blue Hst's or was it something else?

Railguy220

 

[IanPooleTrains]

It might have been the East Midlands HST that East Coast have on loan

 

[Railguy220]

No it was definatley was an east coast one

 

[ainsworth74]

Are you sure? From a distance a debranded EMT HST power car could quite possibly be mistaken for a GNER HST power car (see here) certainly though EC have no power cars still in GNER livery as far as I'm aware.

 

[MCR247]

No, he means an East Coast HST with an exEMT powercar on the end.

It could have been one still in MML livery like the powercar on this one:
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_6EkLO4Ao-Ms/TEYrt37TThI/AAAAAAAAAXQ/t6PBqH0g9_M/s1600/DSC_7189.jpg

or this one

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/17/EMT_HST_43058_Leicester_AB1.JPG

 

[scotsman]

The line is about a mile, if that, from the zoo

 

[junglejames]

GNER used to have a barrier vehicle at Craigentinny. Always used to be in the GNER colours. Could it have been this? Assuming its still there, and still in GNER colours.

Not often you would see this being towed around, but its all I can think of that could be towed around by a HST. Especially considering the colours mentioned.

 

[shedman]

Hi. I'll be honest and say I don't know which line runs near Edinburgh Zoo but could it have been a mk4 set? There is a few of them knocking around repainted with a 91 still in GNER/NX White stripe providing power. Just a thought and sorry if a non electrified route!

 

[jopsuk]

this would be possible if the train was on the farther away line- which is I'd have thought still visible from the zoo. The Bathgate/Falkirk/Fife (and beyond) line is about 0.8 miles from the zoo, the Shotts/Carstairs line about 1.8 miles (four miles away would be the bypass!)

 

[387star]

Yeah the barrier vehicle in question has a shabby white stripe with the old red visible underneath

 

[NightatLaira]

what is a barrier vehicle anyway?

 

[sprinterguy]

what is a barrier vehicle anyway?

Usually redundant mark 1 or mark 2 carriages converted to be used as coupling converters to couple locos to stock that is fitted with buckeye couplers (HST power cars, mark 3 & mark 4 carriages), or to modern multiple units with auto-couplers: Standard coupling hook at one end, auto-coupler at the other. Also used as brake force runners in some movements.

 

[Railguy220]

It think it was a barrier vehicle and it looked like a carrige so i will presume that was what it was. Thanks for the help!

And i didn't think i was so close to the line. Maybes i should get my eyes checked!

 

[MCR247]

Are you sure? I honestly doubt it. I reckon it was an EMT/ex MML PC I mean what on earth would it be attached to the back of a HST for?!?!

 

[ainsworth74]

Are you sure? I honestly doubt it. I reckon it was an EMT/ex MML PC I mean what on earth would it be attached to the back of a HST for?!?!

My thoughts exactly! The only two explanations that make sense is that it was IC225 silver set with a blue 91 on the back or an HST set with a former EMT/MML power car attached. Why on earth would the barrier vehicle be at the back, it would be in the middle of any formation!

 

[jopsuk]

It think it was a barrier vehicle and it looked like a carrige so i will presume that was what it was. Thanks for the help!

And i didn't think i was so close to the line. Maybes i should get my eyes checked!

Are you so sure it was the closer line? Just suggesting that you might not be quite such an awful judge of distance, as the "it was a mrk 4 set" theory seems a bit saner than it being a barrier vehicle. What else was on the line?

 

[DaveNewcastle]

If it was a MkIV set, then you might be interested to know that just a couple of weeks ago there was one in service through to Glasgow with 2 91's coupled together at the same end. The 'extra' one on the southern end was providing power and the other had its pantograph down. One was blue and the other silver-grey.

 

[Railguy220]

It wasn't a MK4 set as it was on unelectrified track. The only other stock I saw on the line was Turbostars and maybes a 158 i wasn't sure.

 

[MCR247]

Then it was probably on the of exEMT PCs

 

[Railguy220]

I think i'm going to have to leave this a mystery! I have seen a HST set towing something as i saw the end powercar, but i do agree that it is not very likely to be towing a barrier car.

 

[MCR247]

I really don't think you did. This is a HST, it isn't likely to be towing anything?! Either way if it was it would have to have a towbar...

 

[ralphchadkirk]

Was it towing a London Midland liveried cl87?

 

[duffman82]

Was it towing a London Midland liveried cl87?

LM Class 86 actually

 

[ralphchadkirk]

LM Class 86 actually

My mistake

 

[Railguy220]

No I don't really know. But why would a Hst set be pulling an exEMT power car?

From what i remember I saw a Hst pulling a boxy object. Remember i saw this from almost a mile away at quite a high velocity.

 

[jopsuk]

It wasn't a MK4 set as it was on unelectrified track. The only other stock I saw on the line was Turbostars and maybes a 158 i wasn't sure.

The far line is two track electrified. The closer line is four track, with at least two of the tracks electrified (I'm not sure how far along the wires go on the "north" pair of lines). But if it was Turbostars and 158s it was definitely the closer line (southern pair is Glasgow via Bathgate (Electric), Glasgow via Falkirk and Perth and beyond via Falkirk and Stirling (diesel), northern pair is Fife and beyond (all diesel)) so definitely not the Mrk4s.

 

[tbtc]

Are you sure? I honestly doubt it. I reckon it was an EMT/ex MML PC I mean what on earth would it be attached to the back of a HST for?!?!

Maybe it was an eight car Pendolino on loan to Cross Country?

 

[Railguy220]

I really don't know what it was but i can't be bothered to keep posting to find the answer! So I will say it was a Pendolino on loan to Crosscountry!!!

 

[MCR247]

No I don't really know. But why would a Hst set be pulling an exEMT power car?

From what i remember I saw a Hst pulling a boxy object. Remember i saw this from almost a mile away at quite a high velocity.

EC have an exEMT set which is blue. Therefore 1 of the PCs would have been working with an EC set. There would be an EC 43 + 9 MK3s + EMT 43. No pulling. No towing.

Actually thinking about it, it isn't possible for the HST to be towing something, as towbars have a max speed of 10mph IIRC

 

[DaveNewcastle]

But just to confuse things, at present, the EMT HST set on loan (or probs hire) to EC is currently operating with an EC power car at one end!