Do 158s have Air Conditioning ?

[PhilipW]

Various threads on this forum refer to Class 158s as having Air Conditioning.
Is this true ?

I thought they were were just "air cooled" (i.e air blown through them) rather than "air conditioned".

All the 158s I have seen have hopper windows that can be opened. Air conditioning and open windows are contradictory.

What is the situtaion ?

 

[Mojo]

They were originally built with Air Conditioning which relied on the use of CFCs. With the use of CFCs now banned the CFC replacement is frankly appalling meaning that they simply can't cope, hence the windows now being open.

A number of units (I know SWT at least) have had a different model fitted which actually works quite well.

So to answer your question, yes they do have Air Conditioning, but in the whole they might as well not bother.

 

[The_Rail_WAy]

I'm pretty sure that they did have fully functioning air conditioning units that were designed to use a now banned CFC gas (for environmental reasons) - these have not been re-designed leaving just the windows in the middle of the carriages to be used for cooling.

 

[TEW]

They have all had replacement systems fitted by they are usually unsuccessful. SWT and certain units in other TOCs fleets have had the successful Leibher system fitted.

 

[PhilipW]

Thanks for the replies but I am still rather puzzled. If they had Air Conditioning at new build, why were hopper windows fitted ? The two are incompatable. Other types of carriages with Air Conditioning do not have windows that can open.

The presence of windows implies that only "air cooling" systems were fitted. By that I mean that the outside air, whatever temperature that happens to be, is blown through without it being cooled.

If some Units have now been retro-fitted with Air Conditioning, I presume the hopper windows must be permanently locked.

 

[1D53]

They were built with air conditioning - the hoppers are secured with a T key for use when the air conditioning fails.

Units with SWT and Northern have been fitted with a new Liebherr system which is very very good - not sure about other TOC's.

 

[PhilipW]

Thanks JsT, I understand ... but it does raise another question.

Other carriages with Air Conditioning (e.g Class 377, 442, 444, 450 and others) have no windows that can be opened. So why did the Class 158s ? Were they expecting the Air Con to fail ?

 

[thelem]

On some units the windows are secured with a T-key, on others there is a small handle for passenger use.

 

[Jonfun]

Were they expecting the Air Con to fail ?

I would presume so, bear in mind they were one of the first MU classes to be built with air con, so I would think BREL provided them as a redundancy in case the 'new' technology failed. The other units you mention such as the 444/450 were built a lot later, with a lot more efficient technology.

 

[Pumbaa]

Electrostars 375, 276 and 377 all have hoppers that can be opened. Interestingly, I don't think the 357s do, and they were an earlier build.

 

[P156KWJ]

On some units the windows are secured with a T-key, on others there is a small handle for passenger use.

care to point out the latter ones? I often travel on 158s and never see them - ore are they TOC specific ones?

 

[Pumbaa]

care to point out the latter ones? I often travel on 158s and never see them - ore are they TOC specific ones?

All I thought. I've always noticed them when on 158s.

 

[DJC_158]

the hopper windows on 158s are indeed only able to be opened and closed via a key. the likes of 150s and 153s have hoppers that can be opened by passengers without the use of a key.
as for the air con- i believe there are some FGW 158s that have the leibher air con- i believe was from an ex wessex trains 158 though i could be wrong

 

[P156KWJ]

I doubt the ex-wessex ones have em, we have 4 of them round here and they are ever so nasty inside (inc. temprature)

 

[DJC_158]

good point may not have been an ex wessex one. have seen the leibher air con in one of the 158s we got round here thats for sure.

 

[37402]

The newer Leibherr system was fitted to the original fleet of Central Trains and Scotrail units. The ATW, TPx and the original higher numbered 1588xx Wessex fleet never got it (apart from 158799 which went through a mods programme sponsored by the leaseco).

It was retrofitted to the SWT 1588xx units when they went through refurb at Wabtec and a couple of the 'newer' batch of Wessex units (IIRC 747 was one) when they had the later Wessex-style upgrade (which are now split between 3-car 1589xx units).

 

[Mojo]

Wales & Borders started to fit a new system but it was stopped when the franchise ended.

 

[P156KWJ]

As far as I know, because the ex-TPE 158s had finished work for FTPE, they never bothered, and of course SWT refurbished them and did add the new system, whereas those that went to Central Trains weren't due to CT's lack of interest and more bothered about getting them in to service, they were never fitted

 

[adc82140]

FGW's 166s also (theoretically) have air-con, as well as hopper windows. The windows are openable by passengers, with two slightly awkward handles (as opposed to one wide handle on the non aircon 165s). There is a sticker on the window saying that the aircon will not work if the window is opened. Needless to say being a 166 it won't work with the window closed either!!

Interestingly the retro aircon fitted 165s in use with Chiltern have no hoppers I believe. They must be more confident about the reliablility of the system.

 

[TEW]

The Additional coaches for the FGW 3-Car 158s are all fitted with the Liebher system as they came from the Ex- Virgin the Wessex units the Wessex refurbished fitting air-con.

 

[John_158]

With Regards to the ex-Wessex 158s 158863/4/5/6 I remember that the air con units work quite well in these or did do.

I personally am not a fan of air con because it can be draughty like on the 185s it tends to give a draft across my head and sometimes it can be cold rather than just cool.

The noise of them as well annoys me I know the air con on 158881 & 882 is quite noisy for which incidentally on both units the air con units seem to have failed for sometime now.

 

[MCR247]

The noise irritates me, because when I went on my first 350 when thjey came out I wanted to hear the sounds but then the air-con would kick in then stop then kick in

 

[thelem]

care to point out the latter [windows with passenger handles]?

I can't give unit numbers, but I think I've seen this on the FGW services running Brighton - Great Malvern, if not then it would have been on SWT units.

 

[Mojo]

I don't think there are any with handles. You may have seen a 150 running the FGW Brighton service.

 

[P156KWJ]

I can't give unit numbers, but I think I've seen this on the FGW services running Brighton - Great Malvern, if not then it would have been on SWT units.

SWT ones certainly don't

 

[John_158]

Somthing may have been added to one of them as a tempory mesure or there is one going round with fixed T-Key in the locks they sometimes do things like this if a lock has broken and thus tyepe is the only one they have available in stock.

I can honestly sat that of all the 158s i have been on i have never seen any handles on the windows to open / close them.

A little off topic here but i notice EMTs 158s have now started to be fitted with Passenger Counting Devices.

 

[D9521]

I know ATW 158's have air con i don't know what type exactly but i remember one coming into Canton when i was doing my work experience with failed air con because one of the pipes had burst.

 

[thaitransit]

The Class 158 owned by SRT rail have aircon.

However it is the crappiest of the lot often too warm I.e stuffy inside or down right not working. The small windows are a godsend on these DMUs as they allow some fresh air into the hot stuffy carriages.

This is a picture of a SRT class 158 DMU with aircon.

They are used one long distance express train with a round trip distance of 1000km. The seating is reasonable comfortable with good recline but have that Gray plastic covers instead of cloth as is typical of SRT 2nd class seating. Which can get sticky when the aircon is not coping.

I have noticed on the UK versions of these 158 they have different door styles that appear to be automatic opening rather than manual open and close as on the SRT versions.

Also, What is the large black metal ring around the front and back of the UK 158s? it is around the inter carriage door at the front. They dont have this item on the SRT units.

 

[dan_atki]

Also, What is the large black metal ring around the front and back of the UK 158s? it is around the inter carriage door at the front. They dont have this item on the SRT units.

It is for when two or more units are coupled together - it allows a sort of indoor gangway for people to move between the units. With the 'ring', there is no exposure to the weather, and it is not possible to fall under the train when moving between the units.

 

[P156KWJ]

The Class 158 owned by SRT rail have aircon.

However it is the crappiest of the lot often too warm I.e stuffy inside or down right not working. The small windows are a godsend on these DMUs as they allow some fresh air into the hot stuffy carriages.

This is a picture of a SRT class 158 DMU with aircon.

They are used one long distance express train with a round trip distance of 1000km. The seating is reasonable comfortable with good recline but have that Gray plastic covers instead of cloth as is typical of SRT 2nd class seating. Which can get sticky when the aircon is not coping.

I have noticed on the UK versions of these 158 they have different door styles that appear to be automatic opening rather than manual open and close as on the SRT versions.

Also, What is the large black metal ring around the front and back of the UK 158s? it is around the inter carriage door at the front. They dont have this item on the SRT units.

You are correct about the doors, all of the UK's class 158s have air powered doors, whereas the SRT ones are inward opening slam. The air doors are prone to failure and are not fantastic. SRT had some thought and put full installation of hopper windows in its plans!!