DLR B23 Stock (CAF Inneo)

[torontoaddick]

B23 trains should be operating during the day (without passengers) between Beckton & Stratford International for most of next week starting on Monday (1 Sept)

 

[Russel]

B23 trains should be operating during the day (without passengers) between Beckton & Stratford International for most of next week starting on Monday (1 Sept)

Is that a positive sign that introduction into service is near?

 

[TheManWho]

Is that a positive sign that introduction into service is near?

This is the final stages of testing, so as long as this testing goes well the trains will enter service soon

 

[JCO1406]

I wonder how quickly they'll be able to roll out the trains, and when the old timetable would be reinstated.

 

[Snow1964]

I wonder how quickly they'll be able to roll out the trains, and when the old timetable would be reinstated.

I am fairly sure most are still in Spain.

Not sure how many road transporters there are available, but if coming by road and ferry (even the ferry from Santander), probably takes 7 or 8 days round trip from factory to Becton and back, allowing for loading and unloading for each unit

 

[JCO1406]

How many units are at Beckton and how many would be needed to restore the timetable?

 

[TheManWho]

How many units are at Beckton and how many would be needed to restore the timetable?

7 B23 units at Beckton at the moment

 

[Russel]

This is the final stages of testing, so as long as this testing goes well the trains will enter service soon

Ah, finally some positive news, fingers crossed then.

How soon is soon though?

 

[Kay_M]

B23 trains should be operating during the day (without passengers) between Beckton & Stratford International for most of next week starting on Monday (1 Sept)

Great stuff. Hopefully it won't be too long before we see it in service. The B90/92/2K has served the public well but they're really aging now

 

[Thirteen]

My guess for introduction is late October.

 

[JCO1406]

As someone who lives on the Beckton Branch, I hope 12tph gets restored soon after the introduction, it's rather cosy right now with the 6tph. Yes, I know it there will need to be more than 1 unit in service before frequencies are restored, but with 7 delivered, surely that would be close to enough to restore the frequency. Even a 10tph frequency would suffice for now, maybe operate it as Beckton - Canning Town till more become available to extend it to Stratford Intl.

 

[Thirteen]

The TfL have started advertising the B23s on socials so I think introduction is coming in the Autumn.

 

[OneTrackMinded]

TfL has previously said in their meetings that the trains are scheduled to enter service in September.

 

[Kay_M]

TfL has previously said in their meetings that the trains are scheduled to enter service in September.

Watch this space.

 

[Kite159]

TfL has previously said in their meetings that the trains are scheduled to enter service in September.

Did they happen to mention the year?

Although cue a new train entering service on an unadvertised additional train from Beckton to Canning Town* (or a station on the Beckton branch where it can cross back over to the Beckton bound line) late on the 30th September

 

[Taunton]

Actually saw train 201 running in the morning peak today on the Beckton line, though on test without passengers.

Given the same unit was on test in a photo above, in December 2022, this does seem some form of record for testing duration.

 

[simple simon]

209 was out and about on the first day of testing with other trains still in passenger service.

The platform 'next train' describers showed this as a passenger train but the train itself had 'not in service' as a destination.

I saw and filmed it at Stratford and Abbey Road stations and I've placed a short YouTube in the photography section.

 

[Thirteen]

The B23s entering service this month seems unlikely, I would have thought the daytime testing is going to last at least a month or so.

 

[A60stock]

Slightly off topic but related to the future.

As the B07s are being retained, what is the plan for these? Will they remain as they are or will they be relivered (and potentially refurbished) to match the b23s? Is anything official yet?

There is a risk that once the b23s are common sight across the network, that the b07s may soon after appear to be mistaken for being far older than they actually are, having an appearance which by far resembles the B90/92/2ks as it stands. Passengers may start to wonder why there arent enough "shiny new trains" to replace the "old" trains.

I don't know what sort of condition they're in but I have a feeling most users of the DLR cannot tell the difference between the B07s and the older trains.

 

[bluegoblin7]

I can't immediately place the link, but it was previously reported by TfL that the B07 stock would remain in the current livery at this time.

Whilst I don't doubt that - given TfL's financial pressures - it is worth remembering that the stock is nearing the age for a mid-life overhaul, and personally I would be surprised if they didn't receive the new livery at that stage.

With regards to the 'comparison' of old and new stock - and with knowledge of the 'old' P86/89 stock fresh in my mind from a weekend in Essen! - I think the contrast is overstated - certainly imo from the front the new trains have more in common with the B90/92/2K than the B07s, although from the side the livery would be a giveaway. All that said: as was seen with the A/C/D/S stock transition, the general public don't pay as much attention to a train as many enthusiasts suggest.

 

[Sunil_P]

Saw units 201 and 209 at Stratford low level this afternoon (Tuesday). Pictures all by me. Also, just for comparison including a pic of units 155 (B07) and 13 (B2K).

 

[OneTrackMinded]

I can't immediately place the link, but it was previously reported by TfL that the B07 stock would remain in the current livery at this time.

Whilst I don't doubt that - given TfL's financial pressures - it is worth remembering that the stock is nearing the age for a mid-life overhaul, and personally I would be surprised if they didn't receive the new livery at that stage.

With regards to the 'comparison' of old and new stock - and with knowledge of the 'old' P86/89 stock fresh in my mind from a weekend in Essen! - I think the contrast is overstated - certainly imo from the front the new trains have more in common with the B90/92/2K than the B07s, although from the side the livery would be a giveaway. All that said: as was seen with the A/C/D/S stock transition, the general public don't pay as much attention to a train as many enthusiasts suggest.

I think the difference here is that the new DLR trains are very much more like a light metro than light rail, in all elements of the design. It’ll be a big step change compared to the previous stock that feel like modified trams.

 

[Snow1964]

Slightly off topic but related to the future.

As the B07s are being retained, what is the plan for these? Will they remain as they are or will they be relivered (and potentially refurbished) to match the b23s? Is anything official yet?

The 24 B07 and 31 B09 might get a midlife refurbishment. But short term some might be stored.

There are effectively only 33 old trains to replace, the order included a few for service enhancements taking total to 43, and later another 11 were later added funded by a housing growth fund, taking total to 54.

If some of these enhancements take a while to materialise (and TfL doesn't have spare funds for speculative growth), then storing some trains until growth phase starts, seems likely. It does of course allow a refurb float short term until needed, or even stopped and stored if needing overhaul. Will just have to wait and see as no plan has yet appeared in TfL Board papers.

 

[DGP]

The 24 B07 and 31 B09 might get a midlife refurbishment. But short term some might be stored.

There are effectively only 33 old trains to replace, the order included a few for service enhancements taking total to 43, and later another 11 were later added funded by a housing growth fund, taking total to 54.

If some of these enhancements take a while to materialise (and TfL doesn't have spare funds for speculative growth), then storing some trains until growth phase starts, seems likely. It does of course allow a refurb float short term until needed, or even stopped and stored if needing overhaul. Will just have to wait and see as no plan has yet appeared in TfL Board papers.

Yes indeed. Though everything I've read and given the state of some of the B90/B92 trains suggests the the removal of those trains from service is first priority and the B07/B09s won't be able to be released for refurb until the last of the B90/B92s have gone. And as there are still on 7 B23 trains at Beckton (figure from an earlier post), that may be some time away.

 

[Thirteen]

I wonder what the B07/B09 refurb would look like? I assume it wouldn't be a huge overhaul but maybe new livery, new seating and maybe adding in LCD screens and USB ports like the B23s?

 

[Taunton]

With regards to the 'comparison' of old and new stock - and with knowledge of the 'old' P86/89 stock fresh in my mind from a weekend in Essen! - I think the contrast is overstated - certainly imo from the front the new trains have more in common with the B90/92/2K than the B07s, although from the side the livery would be a giveaway. All that said: as was seen with the A/C/D/S stock transition, the general public don't pay as much attention to a train as many enthusiasts suggest.

I imagine the public will notice they are blue instead of red, but more particularly the loss of the transverse seats. These have been quoted by TfL as "only one row lost", as if only the front of trains had these, whereas each car had them at both ends. Even in the middle cars they are the most popular seats, occupied first. So a full length train previously had 48 transverse seats, and now has 8.

 

[Sunil_P]

Saw units 201 and 209 at Stratford low level yesterday afternoon (Tuesday). Pictures all taken by me. Also, just for comparison including a pic of units 155 (B07) and 13 (B2K).

201 arriving from the south
201 at platform 16
201 departing north
155 and 13
201 arriving from the north
201 at platform 17
209 departing northbound
209 departing northbound

 

[TRAX]

It’s not exactly a looker, is it…

 

[Mr. SW]

It's "face" is too narrow and it looks like its wearing one of those bob hairstyles from the 1960s making it look even narrower.

 

[vuzzeho]

I like the front end design, but it kinda gives me that 2020s train design trend with the light strips around the front (like on the new Picc trains and the new Glasgow Subway trains), just without the lights. Since it doesn't really run in much tunnel I get why, though. Still though, love it.