Delay Repay overpayment again!

[Dai Corner]

A charitable donation would attract Gift Aid from the Government (assuming the OP is a UK Income Tax payer) and therefore be worth more than £44 to the charity.

 

[talldave]

I would advise them that you're prepared to overlook their overpayment "just this once"

 

[Bletchleyite]

I decided to email customer services (can't be bothered phoning anyone), let's see what they say. In the email I suggested I donate the overpayment to charity, which is what I did last time this happened.

 

[43066]

I decided to email customer services (can't be bothered phoning anyone), let's see what they say. In the email I suggested I donate the overpayment to charity, which is what I did last time this happened.

You can just give it to me, if you like? I work for a TOC, so it’s sort of giving it back to the railway.

 

[Bletchleyite]

You can just give it to me, if you like? I work for a TOC, so it’s sort of giving it back to the railway.

Nice try

(Doubt that will fund the necessary pay settlement!)

 

[greyman42]

But would making a donation to a charity remove the “offence” being pursued by the TOC?

A TOC would hardly pursue this sort of mistake as it just heaps embarrassment on them.

 

[sheff1]

An interesting question is whether an appeal is enough to point it out (they clearly didn't read it, I suspect, and just saw an appeal on a 2 hour claim and rejected it) or whether I really should be contacting customer services, even if they're unlikely to have a process to repay it.

On the last DR award email I received it said something like 'if you think we have made an error in our calculation, please submit an appeal'. If yours says similar and they have rejected your appeal they must be content their decision is correct (or not bothered enough to check).

Edit: See you have contacted them further. Interesting to see what happens.

 

[Bletchleyite]

A (non-) update on this, SWR CS haven't even bothered getting back to me yet.

They've got until 23rd (a month from the incident) then it's going to the Railway Children. Hopefully if they do then get back to me later they'll accept that as a reasonable outcome.

 

[Bletchleyite]

So SWR have had a month and failed to get back to me in any form. This being the case the overpayment has been donated to the Railway Children. Hopefully if they do decide to wake up in 6 months' time they will be happy with this.

 

[maniacmartin]

I don't understand why you are querying this a second time with them. Just keep the money and move on - it will balance out against the times that the railway has let you down with its inconsistent customer service. It's probably not worth £44 to them to cover the admin of looking into the issue anyway.

 

[lyndhurst25]

I recently claimed for a 29 minute delay on Avanti, expecting a refund of around £13. I have been just been emailed saying that a cheque for a full refund of the £100+ return ticket is in the post. This was also a cross-London journey - maybe that is what is confusing the automated systems?

 

[Bletchleyite]

I recently claimed for a 29 minute delay on Avanti, expecting a refund of around £13. I have been just been emailed saying that a cheque for a full refund of the £100+ return ticket is in the post. This was also a cross-London journey - maybe that is what is confusing the automated systems?

I've had it do this before as well - there must be some sort of bug.

 

[edgar13]

Recently had a similar one from Northern, a delay caused me to miss a LNER connection to London of which I hold a Seatfrog upgrade on, so I submitted a claim with both the original ticket and the upgrade

They initially paid only the amount for the original ticket, so I appealed and (after that failed) sent an email detailing the journey and tickets, clearly stating I'm looking to claim the outstanding delay repay amount on the upgrade portion of the ticket.

They then emailed back saying they've made a note of it and after a few months, instead of paying the delay repay for the upgrade, they refunded the original ticket in full, which is £300+ more than what I requested for.

Upon receiving the email on this result I immediately tweeted and called them, and they promised to correct the claim again.

However, they eventually still sent me this excessive overpayment. It's been a week and I've received no further responses from them. Should I keep on pursuing this matter?

 

[Elecman]

I had a 30 minute claim rejected by Avanti as despite missing my connection and the next one being exactly 30 minutes later on a 4 minute journey Avanti say the 30 minute later train arrived only 29 minutes late so only paying a 15-29 minute delay ( the train actually arrived 1 minute later than advertised but i suspect the berth track circuit is well in advance of the platform

 

[Bletchleyite]

I had a 30 minute claim rejected by Avanti as despite missing my connection and the next one being exactly 30 minutes later on a 4 minute journey Avanti say the 30 minute later train arrived only 29 minutes late so only paying a 15-29 minute delay ( the train actually arrived 1 minute later than advertised but i suspect the berth track circuit is well in advance of the platform

I had LNR do this and successfully appealed it by asking them not to take the mick (in a more wordy sense) as every train that day apart from the cancelled one had been one minute early, thus the cancelled one probably would have been had it run.

 

[island]

I recently claimed for a 29 minute delay on Avanti, expecting a refund of around £13. I have been just been emailed saying that a cheque for a full refund of the £100+ return ticket is in the post. This was also a cross-London journey - maybe that is what is confusing the automated systems?

Avanti (and Virgin before them) had form for overpaying people when they had a backlog in the hope they'd go away.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Avanti (and Virgin before them) had form for overpaying people when they had a backlog in the hope they'd go away.

I don't think this is Avanti policy. In Virgin days they did have a thing where they'd just send you a £50 RTV without bothering to read your letter if you wrote in about pretty much anything, which was great if it was minor, but a pain if you had to write again and tell them you wanted the rest of your Delay Repay.

 

[devon_belle]

I was repaid the full 120+ mins delay repay when a rail replacement bus was cancelled, even when the delay was 60 mins.

I'm assuming that GWR simply didn't have the ability to verify whether the next bus arrived on time, and paid out in full as a result?

 

[greyman42]

Recently had a similar one from Northern, a delay caused me to miss a LNER connection to London of which I hold a Seatfrog upgrade on, so I submitted a claim with both the original ticket and the upgrade

They initially paid only the amount for the original ticket, so I appealed and (after that failed) sent an email detailing the journey and tickets, clearly stating I'm looking to claim the outstanding delay repay amount on the upgrade portion of the ticket.

They then emailed back saying they've made a note of it and after a few months, instead of paying the delay repay for the upgrade, they refunded the original ticket in full, which is £300+ more than what I requested for.

Upon receiving the email on this result I immediately tweeted and called them, and they promised to correct the claim again.

However, they eventually still sent me this excessive overpayment. It's been a week and I've received no further responses from them. Should I keep on pursuing this matter?

No.

 

[156421]

I was repaid the full 120+ mins delay repay when a rail replacement bus was cancelled, even when the delay was 60 mins.

I'm assuming that GWR simply didn't have the ability to verify whether the next bus arrived on time, and paid out in full as a result?

It's strange that they can't track RRBs given the coaches almost certainly have trackers fitted and may in some cases show up on bustimes.org working other (non-RRB) services. This would close a delay repay fraud/abuse loophole.

 

[AdamWW]

It's strange that they can't track RRBs given the coaches almost certainly have trackers fitted and may in some cases show up on bustimes.org working other (non-RRB) services. This would close a delay repay fraud/abuse loophole.

Yes it's frustrating when you can track service buses and trains but not RRBs. In my experience RRBs are rarely the same vehicles as service buses though and even when they are ex service buses they are unlikely to have a tracker because I believe they're usually in the ticket machines.

 

[156421]

Yes it's frustrating when you can track service buses and trains but not RRBs. In my experience RRBs are rarely the same vehicles as service buses though and even when they are ex service buses they are unlikely to have a tracker because I believe they're usually in the ticket machines.

All valid points. Replacement taxis, or as I once experienced on a cold December evening at Coventry arena... a replacement bus replacement taxi, are another one open to abuse. However on one occasion whilst being taxied from Inverness to Kyle of Lochalsh somebody (I don't know whether it was from the TOC to blame (TPE) or the Inverness station master or just the taxi firm) kept calling the driver asking for location updates.

 

[Bletchleyite]

And it's happened again! Different TOC this time. Put in for 15 minutes (and I definitely did, I checked) and been paid for 2 hours i.e. full return refund. Not a massive sum this time but still.

If this is happening a lot it must be costing TOCs a fortune. Is it perhaps the case that when the service falls to bits entirely (as it was a day when it did) some TOCs simply by policy approve all claims for that day with a 2 hour full refund to clear them off, in the manner Virgin Trains used to send you £50 if you wrote in with any complaint (leading some people to write in with frivolous but valid complaints just to get the money)? Or are they really *that* incompetent? Why does the system even allow payment of more than was claimed?

 

[Deafdoggie]

And it's happened again! Different TOC this time. Put in for 15 minutes (and I definitely did, I checked) and been paid for 2 hours i.e. full return refund. Not a massive sum this time but still.

If this is happening a lot it must be costing TOCs a fortune. Is it perhaps the case that when the service falls to bits entirely (as it was a day when it did) some TOCs simply by policy approve all claims for that day with a 2 hour full refund to clear them off, in the manner Virgin Trains used to send you £50 if you wrote in with any complaint (leading some people to write in with frivolous but valid complaints just to get the money)? Or are they really *that* incompetent? Why does the system even allow payment of more than was claimed?

It balances out, with all the times they don't pay valid claims! But I do think when the service falls apart they just payout everyone the maximum as they are simply swamped

 

[superkopite]

Is it perhaps the case that when the service falls to bits entirely (as it was a day when it did) some TOCs simply by policy approve all claims for that day with a 2 hour full refund to clear them off

If this were the intention, surely TOCs would just auto-approve the claimed duration? But who knows...

 

[sk99]

It balances out, with all the times they don't pay valid claims! But I do think when the service falls apart they just payout everyone the maximum as they are simply swamped

In my opinion if the railway have overpaid its based on there calculation as long as you've selected the correct delay repay time then your safe! They are at fault if they have calculated it wrong and then sent you the money. I wouldn't worry in the slightest

 

[mangyiscute]

I guess if say a person who doesn't know a lot about trains has a train cancelled on a particular route, they may wait around for the next train on that route despite their being a faster option because they are unaware of the faster option (say something like someone waits for a direct Hereford to London train rather than going via Newport) - therefore, the TOCs may want to ensure delay repay claims give compensation as though the route taken was the same, since otherwise they will have lots of people being underpaid by delay repay since they won't be paid as much as they are delayed.

 

[AdamWW]

I guess if say a person who doesn't know a lot about trains has a train cancelled on a particular route, they may wait around for the next train on that route despite their being a faster option because they are unaware of the faster option (say something like someone waits for a direct Hereford to London train rather than going via Newport) - therefore, the TOCs may want to ensure delay repay claims give compensation as though the route taken was the same, since otherwise they will have lots of people being underpaid by delay repay since they won't be paid as much as they are delayed.

I can see that as a reason not to quibble if someone claims a delay that would have been less if they'd taken a more complex route.

But if someone specifically claims for 15 minutes, there doesn't seem to be much sense in deliberately paying more.

 

[Gaelan]

And it's happened again! Different TOC this time. Put in for 15 minutes (and I definitely did, I checked) and been paid for 2 hours i.e. full return refund. Not a massive sum this time but still.

If this is happening a lot it must be costing TOCs a fortune. Is it perhaps the case that when the service falls to bits entirely (as it was a day when it did) some TOCs simply by policy approve all claims for that day with a 2 hour full refund to clear them off, in the manner Virgin Trains used to send you £50 if you wrote in with any complaint (leading some people to write in with frivolous but valid complaints just to get the money)? Or are they really *that* incompetent? Why does the system even allow payment of more than was claimed?

Out of curiosity, did you get a different train following a cancellation? At least one TOC appears to pay 100% for cancellations, regardless of the following services you could've gotten.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Out of curiosity, did you get a different train following a cancellation? At least one TOC appears to pay 100% for cancellations, regardless of the following services you could've gotten.

Certainly the recent one was a part cancellation - my direct Birmingham to Bletchley service "terminated" at Northampton, but didn't actually tip out and went forward to Euston in a later train's path.

That is a very odd policy costing them money. I get that it might be too hard to work out what you actually did (as no site seems to ask that any more) but in that case it'd make more sense just to pay out the lower of what was claimed or 100%, i.e. just to trust the claimant's selection of delay. And there was even an e-ticket scan at Bletchley to help them work it out!