December 2025 Timetable Change - Confirmed changes only

[A S Leib]

Euston to Liverpool's up from 23 / 21 to 27 on weekdays / Saturdays and 18 to 19 on Sundays. Southbound goes from 24 to 26 on weekdays, 22 to 27 on Saturdays and 18 to 20 on Sundays.

Unless their paths just aren't in yet, I think the missing weekday services are 07:07, 09:07, 12:07 and 14:07 northbound and 12:08, 15:08, 17:08 (19:08?) southbound.

 

[MerlinRail 804]

Looking at Chiltern from Marylebone, most of it is the same, but 68 stuff changes. (and consequently some other diagrams). Looks like they’re getting ready for Mk5s!
Struggling to fully work out the diagrams because the platform plan at Marylebone seems a bit weird but the main points are:

• 1H17 0715 BMO - MYB 0913 is now not 68 hauled
• 1R17 0902 MYB - BMO 1105 is still down as 68 hauled but seems to form from what is currently an 8 coach pair of 168s and then seems to later form another 168 service (1G39 1436)
• 1H25 0815 BMO - MYB 1022 is now 68 hauled
• 1R25 1102 MYB - BMO 1305 is now 68 hauled
• 1H48 1345 BMO - MYB is now 68 hauled
• 1J49 1707 to SBJ is now 1J47 @ 1637
• 1J53 1807 to SBJ is now 1J55 @ 1837

It is a bit confusing with a bit of the platform plan in the afternoon as 1H45 gets in on platform 2 indicating forming the 1607 which is down as a 168. The ones you’d expect to be the 68s are formed from other arrivals.

Not really any changes at weekends apart from 0917 arrival from Moor Street is now from Stourbridge.

 

[Bald Rick]

I'm guessing that the 07:16 Euston to Glasgow via the West Midlands is staying and just isn't in systems yet? Also interesting to see Lumo Stirling paths in, under LF rather than LD.

It will be yeah, same for 9S65 (11:38)

TBC.

 

[ayubdaud]

I believe the Northern timetable may receive an update at some point

What sort of update?

 

[Class15]

Some small but interesting changes for London Overground:

Route retention for the Weaver line (Liverpool street -Enfield Town/Cheshunt) via South Tottenham appears to be dropped with the current parliamentary services at 05:30 Liverpool Street to Enfield Town on Saturdays rerouted to serve all stops via Stamford Hill.
Likewise the 23:42 Enfield Town to LST monday to Thursdays no longer runs via South Tottenham.
It would seem not even any LO ECS are booked over this route anymore

This is interesting - wonder why they have stopped route retention of what would appear to be a useful diversionary route?

Meanwhile on the GOBLIN/Suffragette Line the 2324 from Barking Riverside on a Sunday evening will now run to Willesden Junction instead of Gospel Oak running from Upper Holloway to Hampstead Heath then all stations to Willesden Junction Low Level. Reintroduces a regular timetabled service to the Gospel Oak avoiding lines since the PIXC buster pre-electrification. Also means Hampstead Heath to Willesden Junction gains a later last service on Sundays - 34 mins later than present.

Very interesting, nice to see that line have a use again! I suspect I will have to take that service at some point!

Finally all North London Line services arriving and departing Stratford after 21:00 on Saturday evenings appear to be booked to use platforms 10A or 11, instead of their regular platforms 1 & 2.

No freight so it can presumably be got away with on 10A, 11 is usually fine anyway as freight towards Lea Bridge goes via High Meads Jn.

 

[TrainzBK]

What sort of update?

Certain routes are expected to change.

 

[Killingworth]

Certain routes are expected to change.

I'd hope so, but when? The May timetable included a full hourly Sunday service between Sheffield and Manchester. That hasn't run for reasons we well know.

This December timetable appears to have accepted the reality that the underlying issue is too expensive to resolve any time soon! I in 3 services no longer appear.

That's probably a similar situation across the North West?

 

[hux385]

I'm guessing that the 07:16 Euston to Glasgow via the West Midlands is staying and just isn't in systems yet? Also interesting to see Lumo Stirling paths in, under LF rather than LD.

The 0939 and 1336 from Glasgow via the West Midlands are also missing. I would like for them to be continued into the new timetable, but preferably departing closer to an xx55 type of slot to be a bit more spaced out from the direct London departures. I suppose we will see.

Also interesting that it's only 4 Lumo services. I thought it was supposed to be 5 and starting next May. I'm guessing these are placeholder paths that won't actually be passenger services yet?

 

[hexagon789]

The 0939 and 1336 from Glasgow via the West Midlands are also missing. I would like for them to be continued into the new timetable, but preferably departing closer to an xx55 type of slot to be a bit more spaced out from the direct London departures. I suppose we will see.

Also interesting that it's only 4 Lumo services. I thought it was supposed to be 5 and starting next May. I'm guessing these are placeholder paths that won't actually be passenger services yet?

For the Lumo, is it not intended to only be four to/from Stirling and one each way only does as far as Preston? The placeholder timings show one working each way only running Preston/Euston & v-v. with an 0641 Preston-Euston / 1919 Euston-Preston.

 

[Class 170101]

The Highland Sleeper has been diverted to call at Birmingham International vice running via the Trent Valley.

 

[PGAT]

I’ve also spotted East Grinstead is returning to 2tph all day on Thursdays and Fridays only?

 

[Peter0124]

The 0939 and 1336 from Glasgow via the West Midlands are also missing. I would like for them to be continued into the new timetable, but preferably departing closer to an xx55 type of slot to be a bit more spaced out from the direct London departures. I suppose we will see.

Also interesting that it's only 4 Lumo services. I thought it was supposed to be 5 and starting next May. I'm guessing these are placeholder paths that won't actually be passenger services yet?

The empty stock workings are still there, which means the services are likely to continue

 

[The Planner]

The Highland Sleeper has been diverted to call at Birmingham International vice running via the Trent Valley.

Taken its time, that has been in the works for over a year.

 

[Some guy]

The 0939 and 1336 from Glasgow via the West Midlands are also missing. I would like for them to be continued into the new timetable, but preferably departing closer to an xx55 type of slot to be a bit more spaced out from the direct London departures. I suppose we will see.

Also interesting that it's only 4 Lumo services. I thought it was supposed to be 5 and starting next May. I'm guessing these are placeholder paths that won't actually be passenger services yet?

Those 2 services will be changed as they will be retimed to depart at the original times pre Covid. The reasoning is when Avanti went to network rail those was the only paths they had available departing 3 minutes behind the express service

 

[hux385]

Those 2 services will be changed as they will be retimed to depart at the original times pre Covid. The reasoning is when Avanti went to network rail those was the only paths they had available departing 3 minutes behind the express service

Ah I see. Fingers crossed then!

 

[Watershed]

Taken its time, that has been in the works for over a year.

Since at least 2022 to my knowledge!

It's supposedly in place of a certain other stop, but I don't know whether the plan is still for that to be withdrawn.

Having in International as a calling point is going to make things 'interesting' during certain closures.

 

[ainsworth74]

Having in International as a calling point is going to make things 'interesting' during certain closures

Surely that's what they invented sleeper buses for?

 

[Farigiraf]

It's supposedly in place of a certain other stop, but I don't know whether the plan is still for that to be withdrawn.

Would the withdrawn stop most likely be Preston or Crewe, or instead one of the lesser used halts in Scotland (e.g. Carrbridge is already skipped southbound, and the Carnoustie / Dalwhinnie / Ardlui calls probably don't attract many passengers).

 

[Sorcerer]

Pleased to see the increase in Avanti Liverpool services to 27 per day. By the looks of it there are only a few paths missing (no 0907, 1207 and 1407 from Euston, and no 1208, 1508, 1708, 1908 or 2008 from Liverpool on RTT). Sadly no confirmed inclusion of a Liverpool South Parkway stop yet though by the looks of it.

 

[Peter0124]

Would the withdrawn stop most likely be Preston or Crewe, or instead one of the lesser used halts in Scotland (e.g. Carrbridge is already skipped southbound, and the Carnoustie / Dalwhinnie / Ardlui calls probably don't attract many passengers).

If the line via Aston is closed does that mean we could have the sleeper pass through Birmingham New Street or would it just be sent trent valley?

 

[The Planner]

If the line via Aston is closed does that mean we could have the sleeper pass through Birmingham New Street or would it just be sent trent valley?

It will just go Trent Valley.

 

[Peterthegreat]

Most (all?) Northern services are now showing in RTT.

 

[Class15]

It will just go Trent Valley.

Really? So they’d prefer to drop the stop than go via New St?

 

[The Planner]

Really? So they’d prefer to drop the stop than go via New St?

If the route is blocked for any reason west of Rugby then what other choice is there?

 

[Class15]

If the route is blocked for any reason west of Rugby then what other choice is there?

If the line is blocked at Aston, then they could still run via New St and keep the call at International?

 

[GhostManDN91]

I've noticed that the Northern timetables are up from December change and it's staying the same at Wigan. What happened to the planned electric train services from Wigan NW to Stalybridge that I heard about?

 

[bigmanaiq]

I've noticed that the Northern timetables are up from December change and it's staying the same at Wigan. What happened to the planned electric train services from Wigan NW to Stalybridge that I heard about?

Somebody mentioned upthread somewhere that the Northern timetables may well not be the final product, is the Wigan to Stalybridge line live?

 

[GhostManDN91]

Somebody mentioned upthread somewhere that the Northern timetables may well not be the final product, is the Wigan to Stalybridge line live?

Yep it's been live for about a week or so now to passenger services. AC trains can use the wires for the full stretch.

 

[Minstral25]

It seems they have separated the stock on Bedford to Brighton and Bedford to Three Bridges services at Bedford.

Meaning from December the 9R arrival from Three Bridges at Bedford will now form a return 9R Three Bridges Service rather than a 9T Brighton one. Obviously similar change for Brighton services.

Hopefully that might mean better resilience for the 9R Bedford to Three Bridges services which normally disappear at the slightest sign of disruption or is that just wishful thinking.

 

[BillStampy]

TfW Rail's one is up, I don't have the time to look through it all but a nice change to see is that the Coryton line is gaining a Sunday service. Plus there's now a early service from Bridgend stopping at Pencoed, Llanharan and Pontyclun which provides them services into Cardiff Central for approximately 6am. Swanline still lacks on a Sunday, though.