December 2014 TT changes

[infobleep]

Did you mean to write 'survived'? It would seem likely...

. Yes I did.

 

[Muzer]

In the latest FGW track access application for changes from Dec 14 timetable I noticed this:


These are the pair of daily 'route learners' that have previously run via Eastleigh without an advertised call, although people do sometimes blag their way on during the reverse at Eastleigh from what I've seen. Odd though that as well as making the Eastleigh call open to passengers (as that is a standard diversionary call anyway when Southampton is blocked) they've also asked to call at Southampton Parkway.

Some other FGW changes that are already being discussed, such as on the B&H, and the swapping of Paignton and Plymouth services around are also listed, but that one above is one that seems a bit unexpected...

Don't underestimate Airport Parkway. It's quite a good station to serve - much more convenient to access for large parts of suburban Southampton and it has a very large catchment area in the surrounding area. Not to mention the airport. If the path is available it would be silly not to stop there. This does not really surprise me.

 

[swt_passenger]

Don't underestimate Airport Parkway. It's quite a good station to serve - much more convenient to access for large parts of suburban Southampton and it has a very large catchment area in the surrounding area. Not to mention the airport. If the path is available it would be silly not to stop there. This does not really surprise me.

But not much use for air travellers at all, given the timings, don't forget we're talking about the last Portsmouth bound service of the day, and in the other direction it only goes as far as Westbury.

 

[Muzer]

But not much use for air travellers at all, given the timings, don't forget we're talking about the last Portsmouth bound service of the day, and in the other direction it only goes as far as Westbury.

No, fair point. But as I said, since the station is very useful to many simply due to its location and easy reach of a road (with a big car park!), stopping there is a no-brainer.

Plus, ORCATS raid

 

[Mike99]

2nd Last Portsmouth of the day, 20.30 Cardiff Central to Portsmouth Harbour is the last, does seem strange to call at Southampton Airport Parkway as it's only just behind the 22.00 Southampton Central, ex Weymouth to London Waterloo

 

[WatcherZero]

Not sure if already reported but December changes in GM area.

Immediate:
The 0645 York - Liverpool (0750 from Stalybridge) and 1622 Liverpool-Scarborough (1711 from Piccadilly), are to be strengthened permanently;
Its also allocated another train in the weekday peaks and on sundays (but not saturdays) to the Newcastle to Liverpool Liverpool-Scarborough diagram to try and improve service resiliance by allowing longer turnaround times at Liverpool.

From December:
On Sundays, the 0850 Manchester Piccadilly – Macclesfield will extend to Stoke on Trent, and the 1044 Macclesfield – Manchester Piccadilly will start back from Stoke on Trent. From December 0549 Hull to Manchester Airport will now call at Stalybridge at 0728 monday to Saturday.


Northern Rail annual Christmas strengthening will run from 8th/9th November to 20th/21st December, plans not decided yet but their considering hiring a locomotive to operate Preston-Manchester services.

 

[PHILIPE]

2nd Last Portsmouth of the day, 20.30 Cardiff Central to Portsmouth Harbour is the last, does seem strange to call at Southampton Airport Parkway as it's only just behind the 22.00 Southampton Central, ex Weymouth to London Waterloo

It runs this way for retention of route knowledge so why not call for and passengers travelling from another direction. Although not on a regular route, there are track access rights to call there. When bidding. TOCs do not always know what other TOCs are bidding.

 

[Starmill]

From December:
On Sundays, the 0850 Manchester Piccadilly – Macclesfield will extend to Stoke on Trent, and the 1044 Macclesfield – Manchester Piccadilly will start back from Stoke on Trent.

Excellent! I've been of a mind that this has been wanting for some time, it means a service increase of 25% at Congleton on Sundays! Presumably they're going to have to stretch a 323 out to operate it.

The line is open before 0900, so I always thought it was daft having the first Kidsgrove and Congleton service to Manchester at 1332 and 1339 respectively.

 

[Baxenden Bank]

Excellent! I've been of a mind that this has been wanting for some time, it means a service increase of 25% at Congleton on Sundays! Presumably they're going to have to stretch a 323 out to operate it.

The line is open before 0900, so I always thought it was daft having the first Kidsgrove and Congleton service to Manchester at 1332 and 1339 respectively.

The first train on Sunday from Stoke-on-Trent to Manchester (1024 or so) is far too late for a decent day out (e.g. walking from Hadfield or Edale), but OK I suppose for shopping trips to Manchester. As you say, the line is open so why not offer people a seven-day railway, as promised?

 

[infobleep]

The first train on Sunday from Stoke-on-Trent to Manchester (1024 or so) is far too late for a decent day out (e.g. walking from Hadfield or Edale), but OK I suppose for shopping trips to Manchester. As you say, the line is open so why not offer people a seven-day railway, as promised?

Well here's a solution. Just close line until 13.00 or whenever it's currently used on a Sunday.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

Well here's a solution. Just close line until 13.00 or whenever it's currently used on a Sunday.

I don't follow. The first passenger train over the Stoke-Manchester via Macclesfield line on a Sunday is roughly 0830 on the first Manchester-Euston

 

[Baxenden Bank]

Well here's a solution. Just close line until 13.00 or whenever it's currently used on a Sunday.

The line between Crewe and Derby via Stoke benefits from just such a non-service. As do many lines.

It depends on whether 'the railway' wants my business or not. Provide it and they will come. The converse is true, if an unattractive service is provided, people won't travel. Free market economics for you.

The holy grail of a 'seven day railway' has been promised many times. When will that promise be delivered? Or, in future, should I simply regard all railway announcements as being PR spin with little likelihood of implementation.

If I remember correctly we were also promised late night services following WCML upgrade.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I don't follow. The first passenger train over the Stoke-Manchester via Macclesfield line on a Sunday is roughly 0830 on the first Manchester-Euston

T'other direction.

That's the problem - trains having to come from depot / crew points in London / Birmingham to form the first services northbound.

 

[infobleep]

I don't follow. The first passenger train over the Stoke-Manchester via Macclesfield line on a Sunday is roughly 0830 on the first Manchester-Euston

Well cancel those services too. I'm being sarcastic of course. The theory being that if something isn't to stay the same, don't improve it, just make it worse. I know that wouldn't happen in reality.

 

[philjo]

The local paper has an article this week saying that Great Northern will be running more & longer off-peak trains on the Kings Cross-Cambridge route from the December timetable. Presumably this means more of the the KX-Cambridge semi-fasts running as 8 coaches. I can't see any extra services in the normal off-peak pattern from looking at RTT other than a couple of current empty stock movements from Royston/Letchworth running in service back to London late afternoon.
Does any one know more about this?

http://www.thecomet.net/news/increase_in_great_northern_train_services_planned_for_hertfordshire_1_3808167

The Comet, 16 October

Great Northern has announced a new timetable to be introduced on December 14 which it says will create an additional 15,588 seats on off-peak trains.
This will be done by adding more carriages to each train and raising their frequency.
The main routes affected will be the London King’s Cross to Cambridge line that passes through Stevenage, Hitchin, Letchworth, Baldock and Royston.
Great Northern chief operating officer Dyan Crowther said this week: “The December timetable changes will bring thousands of extra seats for our passengers in the off-peak, allowing them to have a more comfortable and enjoyable travel experience with Great Northern.”

Great Northern replaced First Capital Connect, which used to run the same service, from September.
For more visit www.thameslinkrailway.com.

 

[Aictos]

The local paper has an article this week saying that Great Northern will be running more & longer off-peak trains on the Kings Cross-Cambridge route from the December timetable. Presumably this means more of the the KX-Cambridge semi-fasts running as 8 coaches. I can't see any extra services in the normal off-peak pattern from looking at RTT other than a couple of current empty stock movements from Royston/Letchworth running in service back to London late afternoon.
Does any one know more about this?

http://www.thecomet.net/news/increase_in_great_northern_train_services_planned_for_hertfordshire_1_3808167

There is lot of changes coming in the Dec 14 timetable which will please Cambridge and Kings Lynn route passengers, more seats plus a additional semi fast train will run from Cambridge at 17:17 on the weekday so yes there is a lot of improvement coming to these passengers.

 

[Starmill]

The first train on Sunday from Stoke-on-Trent to Manchester (1024 or so) is far too late for a decent day out (e.g. walking from Hadfield or Edale), but OK I suppose for shopping trips to Manchester. As you say, the line is open so why not offer people a seven-day railway, as promised?

Exactly. Even small changes to the railway can have positive economic impacts, something which is often forgotten.

 

[evergreenadam]

Quite correct, have a look at LMs track access changed on the attached link for more detail, form P gives a summary of the WCML enhancements.

http://www.networkrail.co.uk/browse...tations\2014.09.24 LM 52nd SA closes 22.10.14

The link is no longer working, does anyone have a PDF or a new link to the document?

 

[swt_passenger]

The link is no longer working, does anyone have a PDF or a new link to the document?

It's moved from current to closed consultations as from 22nd Oct:

http://www.networkrail.co.uk/browse...014.09.24 LM 52nd SA - Closes 22 October 2014

 

[MidnightFlyer]

CrossCountry and TPE's timetables for December-May are online now.

 

[philjo]

East coast has the PDF of their new timetable as well.
use the "full timetable" link to get a PDf of the booklet.
The other version on the website omits the station names after the first page!

 

[darloscott]

The only change I can see in my area is the introduction of a new 0651 Middlesbrough-Nunthorpe service, converting the ECS into an earlier service to the hospital, Marton and Nunthorpe.

 

[adrock1976]

I have noticed that the 12:18 Paddington - Taunton service that is timed as an Intercity 125 will change to running from Paddington to Newbury, timed for a Turbo.

Links are below.

Present timetable:
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/C48441/2014/11/03/advanced

December timetable:
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/C27288/2015/01/12/advanced

Is there a particular reason for this change? There does seem to be a long gap between services from Newbury to Westbury after the December timetable change, with almost zero from Bedwyn. Even going Bedwyn - Newbury - Westbury is not possible due to the timings.

This means that I will now have to revise my plans for when I deviate from Westbury to nip up to Reading in March/April when I intend to do the Severn & Solent rover.

In peace

Adam

 

[greatkingrat]

Looks like it is being replaced by the new 1133 Paddington - Exeter

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/C27287/2015/01/12/advanced

 

[323235]

It looks like there are some additional London Midland Crewe - Euston Saturday services which should help to alleviate the overcrowding which occurs at the moment.

There is a new 0601 Crewe - Euston

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/P32216/2014/12/20/advanced

and another new train, the 0718 Crewe - Euston

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/P32217/2014/12/20/advanced

this train only stops at Crewe Stoke & Stafford so there is scope for 8 cars if things get really busy and it relieves the existing 0700 service which continues to serve all intermediate stations.

Looks like day trips to London should get a bit quieter in the up direction.

In the other direction it seems the last down service is still the 1846 Euston - Crewe which only stops at Stafford and Stoke so could possibly be a 8 car set.

All this is great except the new 0738 from Stoke - Euston leaves 4 minutes before the re-timed first Manchester - Stoke stopper arrives

 

[Thomas6187]

All this is great except the new 0738 from Stoke - Euston leaves 4 minutes before the re-timed first Manchester - Stoke stopper arrives

That Northern train is the same time as it is at the moment

 

[323235]

Oh I haven't been on it lately, it used to get in 0736 pre-May 14. It's still useless if I want to get to London early avoiding VT.

 

[thealexweb]

Edit: Never mind, please ignore. I didn't take in to account limited services on the 27th December.

 

[louis97]

I have noticed that the 12:18 Paddington - Taunton service that is timed as an Intercity 125 will change to running from Paddington to Newbury, timed for a Turbo.

Links are below.

Present timetable:
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/C48441/2014/11/03/advanced

December timetable:
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/C27288/2015/01/12/advanced

Is there a particular reason for this change? There does seem to be a long gap between services from Newbury to Westbury after the December timetable change, with almost zero from Bedwyn. Even going Bedwyn - Newbury - Westbury is not possible due to the timings.

This means that I will now have to revise my plans for when I deviate from Westbury to nip up to Reading in March/April when I intend to do the Severn & Solent rover.

Cheers

Adam

See my post earlier in the thread about the changes: http://www.railforums.co.uk/showpost.php?p=1927000&postcount=94

 

[Starmill]

I really wish somebody would do something about Sheffield to Manchester on Saturday night.

Last fast service at 2035?

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/sea...15/01/03/0000-2359?stp=WVS&show=all&order=wtt

 

[Deerfold]

I really wish somebody would do something about Sheffield to Manchester on Saturday night.

Last fast service at 2035?

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/sea...15/01/03/0000-2359?stp=WVS&show=all&order=wtt

Nope. Last fast at 2032.

2035 is a particularly slow one.

But at least there's a train at 2224 - it only takes 15 minutes longer.

and Mon-Fri there's a fast at 2211.