Debranded GWR 387S?

[JonathanH]

Perhaps I'm being thick but aren't GWR also short of / going to be short of units due to Hitachi units going to Eastleigh (or elsewhere) for cracking repairs and the Class 387s to Cardiff would cover for this?

Why does 387s to Cardiff come up all the time? There aren't any self contained diagrams that could work all day, other than the partial diagram already allowed for starting with 0712 from Paddington to Cardiff. By the time the second train to Cardiff is leaving London, plenty of IETs have arrived from the West. The last train to Cardiff is the 1518 from Paddington, after which all services run to Swansea. GWR can't reduce the 80x requirement to any great extent by running 387s.

GWR will have taken the need for remedial work on Hitachi units into account in their plans for using them in the west, without the need for more 387s to Cardiff.

 

[FGW_DID]

Perhaps I'm being thick but aren't GWR also short of / going to be short of units due to Hitachi units going to Eastleigh (or elsewhere) for cracking repairs and the Class 387s to Cardiff would cover for this?

At the moment the SX 387 requirement is 27 units from 33. This will now be 27 from 30.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

At the moment the SX 387 requirement is 27 units from 33. This will now be 27 from 30.

Not the end of the world then. Certainly not the hardest-hitting of all the recent budget cuts.

 

[ChrisHogan]

GWR will have taken the need for remedial work on Hitachi units into account in their plans for using them in the west, without the need for more 387s to Cardiff.

I hope so. Last Friday three IET services cancelled no unit out of Paddington (1B20 1518, 1W04 1858, 1G29 1928) [although 1W04 now shows traincrew on RTT] while significant levels of shortforming for much of the week, particularly on WoE services. The rolling stock position for GWR looks very fragile to me.

 

[fgwrich]

I hope so. Last Friday three IET services cancelled no unit out of Paddington (1B20 1518, 1W04 1858, 1G29 1928) [although 1W04 now shows traincrew on RTT] while significant levels of shortforming for much of the week, particularly on WoE services. The rolling stock position for GWR looks very fragile to me.

I have to agree - there’s been a fair few HSTs covering for IETs over the last few weeks, including a 150 working a Plymouth to Bristol vice IET to Paddington service. There’s a lot of reliance on Hitachi to provide enough units for the core intercity services, as well as HST replacement and crack repairs. I do feel GWR, and now the DfT, seem to put like to put a lot of faith and reliance on certain particular types of stock which, hasn’t exactly gone to plan.

 

[62484GlenLyon]

387173 and 387174 are on Hornsey. I have eyeballed them both this afternoon from passing trains.

 

[Mzzzs]

You can just see them at Hornsey.

 

[62484GlenLyon]

With many thanks to Part Time Spotter for the information - 387172 and 387174 are reported as working 1T13 07.48 Kings Lynn to Kings Cross this morning. RTT suggests the next working is 1T22 10.42 to Kings Lynn.

UPDATE - both units worked as expected. Neither unit has any external branding though the letters GWR are still faintly visible. Inside, at least as far as 387174 is concerned, GN route maps and PIS are in place. The wifi option came up as GWR, which to no great surprise, didn't work.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 18 May 2023 ==

UPDATE - both units worked as expected. Neither unit has any external branding though the letters GWR are still faintly visible. Inside, at least as far as 387174 is concerned, GN route maps and PIS are in place. The wifi option came up as GWR, which to no great surprise, didn't work.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

With many thanks to Part Time Spotter for the information - 387172 and 387174 are reported as working 1T13 07.48 Kings Lynn to Kings Cross this morning. RTT suggests the next working is 1T22 10.42 to Kings Lynn.

Cheers @03_179 .

 

[03_179]

No problem guys

 

[heathrowrail]

At the moment the SX 387 requirement is 27 units from 33. This will now be 27 from 30.

Funny as since the May timetable change NBY to PAD services have dropped from 8 to 4 coaches, GWR now admitting they have a massive shortfall in stock and are scrambling to try and save the timetable. (According to emails from Bedywn Passenger Group) The DFT have made a massive balls up yet again.

 

[FGW_DID]

Funny as since the May timetable change NBY to PAD services have dropped from 8 to 4 coaches, GWR now admitting they have a massive shortfall in stock and are scrambling to try and save the timetable. (According to emails from Bedywn Passenger Group) The DFT have made a massive balls up yet again.

A very cursory check of RTT today shows that 8 cars have been operating Newbury - Paddington. It looks like there were 2x 8 cars and a 4 car on the 1Kxx from that very quick look.

There are less 387s required daily after the timetable change. As it stands at the moment it’s 24 of 30 required (SX).

 

[heathrowrail]

A very cursory check of RTT today shows that 8 cars have been operating Newbury - Paddington. It looks like there were 2x 8 cars and a 4 car on the 1Kxx from that very quick look.

There are less 387s required daily after the timetable change. As it stands at the moment it’s 24 of 30 required (SX).

17/06/2023 Only 4 cars operating NBY - PAD. 08:07 from Newbury rammed. 18:33 Reading to Newbury, rammed. I know I was on them. Quote Bedwyn Passenger Group email.

"We do now have some trains running with four carriages instead of eight. You know that we are charged with reducing costs as the DfT need to reduce taxpayer subsidy, and one of the ways we can do that is by making fleet changes.

That has included things like cancelling the Class 769 order, phasing out our heavy Castle Class diesel trains and in effect managing with fewer trains. That does mean some Intercity Express Trains are now running with five carriages and not ten, and some Class 387s running with four carriages. We looked very carefully at where the changes should be made, so that we are best matching customer patterns, but by making decisions like this, we can meet the financial challenge while protecting the timetable."

 

[Benjwri]

17/06/2023 Only 4 cars operating NBY - PAD. 08:07 from Newbury rammed. 18:33 Reading to Newbury, rammed. I know I was on them. Quote Bedwyn Passenger Group email.

"We do now have some trains running with four carriages instead of eight. You know that we are charged with reducing costs as the DfT need to reduce taxpayer subsidy, and one of the ways we can do that is by making fleet changes.

That has included things like cancelling the Class 769 order, phasing out our heavy Castle Class diesel trains and in effect managing with fewer trains. That does mean some Intercity Express Trains are now running with five carriages and not ten, and some Class 387s running with four carriages. We looked very carefully at where the changes should be made, so that we are best matching customer patterns, but by making decisions like this, we can meet the financial challenge while protecting the timetable."

They really should reduce some of the Didcot to London stoppers down to 4, I've never been one where I haven't found a seat, usually I'm the only one in the carriage, maybe in the peaks they could have some joining/detaching at Reading, but certainly they are running an awful lot of fresh air around

 

[FGW_DID]

17/06/2023 Only 4 cars operating NBY - PAD. 08:07 from Newbury rammed. 18:33 Reading to Newbury, rammed. I know I was on them. Quote Bedwyn Passenger Group email.

"We do now have some trains running with four carriages instead of eight. You know that we are charged with reducing costs as the DfT need to reduce taxpayer subsidy, and one of the ways we can do that is by making fleet changes.

That has included things like cancelling the Class 769 order, phasing out our heavy Castle Class diesel trains and in effect managing with fewer trains. That does mean some Intercity Express Trains are now running with five carriages and not ten, and some Class 387s running with four carriages. We looked very carefully at where the changes should be made, so that we are best matching customer patterns, but by making decisions like this, we can meet the financial challenge while protecting the timetable."

17/06/2023 There were 8 car formations running as well!

387151 & 387147

Realtime Trains | 1K06 0905 London Paddington to Newbury | 17/06/2023

Real-time train running information for 1K06 0905 departure from London Paddington to Newbury on 17/06/2023. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

387152 & 387162

Realtime Trains | 1K08 1006 London Paddington to Newbury | 17/06/2023

Real-time train running information for 1K08 1006 departure from London Paddington to Newbury on 17/06/2023. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

387144 & 387165

Realtime Trains | 1K10 1105 London Paddington to Newbury | 17/06/2023

Real-time train running information for 1K10 1105 departure from London Paddington to Newbury on 17/06/2023. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Even the email you have quoted says “some” 387s - not every service.

 

[HamworthyGoods]

Funny as since the May timetable change NBY to PAD services have dropped from 8 to 4 coaches, GWR now admitting they have a massive shortfall in stock and are scrambling to try and save the timetable. (According to emails from Bedywn Passenger Group) The DFT have made a massive balls up yet again.

Sone have dropped to 4 cars but the majority are still 8 cars. Your sweeping statement implies all have dropped to 4 cars.

 

[heathrowrail]

17/06/2023 There were 8 car formations running as well!

387151 & 387147

Realtime Trains | 1K06 0905 London Paddington to Newbury | 17/06/2023

Real-time train running information for 1K06 0905 departure from London Paddington to Newbury on 17/06/2023. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

387152 & 387162

Realtime Trains | 1K08 1006 London Paddington to Newbury | 17/06/2023

Real-time train running information for 1K08 1006 departure from London Paddington to Newbury on 17/06/2023. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

387144 & 387165

Realtime Trains | 1K10 1105 London Paddington to Newbury | 17/06/2023

Real-time train running information for 1K10 1105 departure from London Paddington to Newbury on 17/06/2023. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

View attachment 137828
View attachment 137829

Even the email you have quoted says “some” 387s - not every service.

Maybe there were but not on the peak services that everyone needed them. It's easy to just find services with eight carriages and say "oh yeah but".... that's not applying it to the real world context of the problem. I live in Newbury and use the service very often I know having 4 carriages has become a major issue since the recent timetable change.

 

[HamworthyGoods]

Maybe there were but not on the peak services that everyone needed them. It's easy to just find services with eight carriages and say "oh yeah but".... that's not applying it to the real world context of the problem. I live in Newbury and use the service very often I know having 4 carriages has become a major issue since the recent timetable change.

Where are all these peak 4 cars then?

Looking at AM peak services to Paddington from Newbury today with 387s:

06:52 1K05 - 8 cars
08:46 1K07 - 4 cars
09:20 1K09 - 8 cars

From Paddington to Newbury in the evening peak:

16:13 1K20 - 8 cars
17:08 1K22 - 8 cars

The rest of the Newbury trains are all IETs of Reading / Newbury local trains which have always been 4 cars.

 

[FGW_DID]

Maybe there were but not on the peak services that everyone needed them. It's easy to just find services with eight carriages and say "oh yeah but".... that's not applying it to the real world context of the problem. I live in Newbury and use the service very often I know having 4 carriages has become a major issue since the recent timetable change.

Your right it was quite easy to find services with 8 carriages but your original post was claiming there weren’t any and every Newbury - Paddington service was a 4 car, you claimed the same in your post about Sat 17th.

Funny as since the May timetable change NBY to PAD services have dropped from 8 to 4 coaches

17/06/2023 Only 4 cars operating NBY - PAD

 

[heathrowrail]

Your right it was quite easy to find services with 8 carriages but your original post was claiming there weren’t any and every Newbury - Paddington service was a 4 car, you claimed the same in your post about Sat 17th.

 

[Benjwri]

An interesting side effect of the shortening of some services to 4 car is that many of the platforms between Didcot and Reading don’t have a 4 car stop for the Class 387 (they often have a 2-6 car stop for the 166s but the 387s can’t use this), and therefore they end up stopping right at the end of the platform, past the station covers, which means everyone walks to the closest door, and even though the front is often almost empty the back ends up full and standing.