COVID-19: School Closures

[yorkie]

Experts are saying that the earliest that they should reopen is on the 1st of June at the earliest so here's my thoughts and opinions on that:
My Opinon is that they should remain closed until for a few reasons

Firstly, what's the point of opening them up? because many primary and secondary schools will close for the summer around a month (or so) later. I personally see no point in them reopening past May half term. Many University and College courses will end in June anyway so I doubt that they will open before September.

Secondly, I think Social distancing will be a huge problem across the board ranging from Primary school students who don't understand what Social Distancing is or why we even have to social distance. Colleges and universities because of how many people go there, and some college and uni students go off campus to get food and they could catch the virus from someone else while on their way to college/university or while in town and then they could pass the virus on to people who the interact with. Finally High Schools, I personally find the concept of social distancing in a High School as something that will be very hard to maintain because of crowded dining hall's, the fact that everyone is wanting to rush home at the end of the school day and the gates are crowded, as-well as the crowds during breaks and lunches and finally you always get that one chavy Idiot (with less sense as a 5 year old) who thinks it's sensible and funny to block a doorway and hold it closed while others are trying to get out and then everyone goes to the doorway to find that someone's blocking it and everyone wanting to get out is crushed with literally no free space at all (which breaks the 2 metre rule).

I disagree for so many reasons.

Also the virus is going to be around until a vaccine is found, so you really propose to keep them closed until then?

 

[Harvey B]

I disagree for so many reasons.

Also the virus is going to be around until a vaccine is found, so you really propose to keep them closed until then?

No, I think they should just be closed until september

 

[Domh245]

Firstly, what's the point of opening them up?

To try and cover some of the stuff that they've missed out on in the preceding 2.5 months?

 

[Harvey B]

To try and cover some of the stuff that they've missed out on in the preceding 2.5 months?

I get your point but by then I personally don't see a point in opening the schools and then closing them a month later for summer holidays

 

[yorkie]

No, I think they should just be closed until september

What's going to be different in September?

I get your point but by then I personally don't see a point in opening the schools and then closing them a month later for summer holidays

It will be 7 weeks not 1 month

 

[Domh245]

I get your point but by then I personally don't see a point in opening the schools and then closing them a month later for summer holidays

Extend the term if it's practical

 

[chris11256]

I post this within the context of the school I work at.

It would be very beneficial for our pupils(would only be Year 12, Year 13's finish on Friday) to be able to come in even for a month before the summer holidays. Yes we're running lessons on Microsoft Teams, but that doesn't replace an actual in person lesson. Like many of us, a lot of pupils are struggling with being stuck at home.

 

[Mitch in Notts]

How are they going to reopen secondary schools full stop - especially in rural and out of city areas? I would guess 80 pupils board the 10-15minute frequency service buses at the 4 bus stops on our estate each morning to go to the secondary school in the neighbouring town. If social distancing is applied the bus will only carry half the usual number. The estate at the top of the village has a designated double decker bus each morning which is full. For social distancing you would need a second double decker bus. Multiply that nationwide and you have a problem unless you can stagger school start/finish times - and that isn't going to work in rural areas where kids already have long days travel on school buses. Costs and problems are already building.....

 

[Harvey B]

Extend the term if it's practical

or push the summer holidays forward

 

[Harvey B]

How are they going to reopen secondary schools full stop - especially in rural and out of city areas? I would guess 80 pupils board the 10-15minute frequency service buses at the 4 bus stops on our estate each morning to go to the secondary school in the neighbouring town. If social distancing is applied the bus will only carry half the usual number. The estate at the top of the village has a designated double decker bus each morning which is full. For social distancing you would need a second double decker bus. Multiply that nationwide and you have a problem unless you can stagger school start/finish times - and that isn't going to work in rural areas where kids already have long days travel on school buses. Costs and problems are already building.....

Agreed

 

[HH]

It would be great for the kids if they could re-open schools, but they won't be able to open them fully, so they still won't get a full learning experience. I know some schools are looking at splitting into two sets of pupils, each of them getting 3 days tuition, but that probably won't work for all schools. What it would mean is that, at best, those 7 weeks would be worth 4.

But the main reason I think it may not happen, is that the first thing to be eased is likely to be businesses. There are several good reasons for this, but it's probably beyond the scope of this thread.

 

[yorkie]

I'd feel happier if a school of say 700 students at least had, say, 100 of the most needy/vulnerable students in school. Right now you're looking at about 7 on a good day.

 

[The Ham]

For some schools I could see that it would be possible to reopen (1.5 form entry with a hall which everyone could sit in at once for lunch, so some classes are taught in there and everyone else spreads around the remaining classrooms).

However for others (like the local primary aged schools) where they already have to have split lunchtimes, 4 form entry (so the infant school has 360 children and the junior 480, the latter would need a space 50m * 60m if you could sit them perfectly with each child with its own 0.5m spaces to sit within).

Also I doubt that the children are actually missing out on that much which they have to learn. OK they might not be going over it quite so much, but by being able to work at their own pace then they can blitz through the stuff that they find easy and then focus more on the things that they find hard.

I know that my eldest is certainly finding that they can do one task quickly whilst others take longer.

There's also a fair amount of "admin" such as taking of registers, changing in and out of PE kits, going to assemblies and waiting for the teacher to help them and the like which aren't currently happening.

There's also things like BBC Bitesize Daily which my eldest is happy to watch over lunch and is willing to watch their age group and the next one up as well. As such they are getting exposed to information which they otherwise wouldn't need to cover until later.

As a classic example my early years child now understands the basics of negative numbers in that if you ask them for a number smaller than zero they will say (as am example) -5 and then when you ask them for a lower number will say -11 (OK they do like numbers and may have been watching a LOT of Number Blocks so they are able to count to 29, so were already ahead of where they should be anyway).

However it does show that there could be some surprised teachers when the children do go back. Although that could lead to other problems, such as a much bigger gap in ability between the top and bottom of a class.

 

[The Ham]

I'd feel happier if a school of say 700 students at least had, say, 100 of the most needy/vulnerable students in school. Right now you're looking at about 7 on a good day.

I'm aware that some organisations are encouraging children who are under their care to return to school, so that they don't fall behind (it can also helps with the protection of the child in certain circumstances).

 

[PTR 444]

or push the summer holidays forward

A handful of private schools have already cancelled their summer holidays to allow students to “make up for lost time”.

 

[johnnychips]

There will be a significant minority of children doing little or no work at the moment because:
- they have no technology to access online lessons
- they find the lessons too difficult
- their parents may not be in a position to support them because of work; or they find it difficult
- the house is crowded and noisy
- parents are not bothered if their children do work or not

However it’s done, the sooner these classes of students get back to education, the better.

 

[Bald Rick]

Word on the street is that it’s back to school from end of May for some students (certain years). Rumour only, but I’ve had it from two ‘well connected’ sources that are independent of each other.

 

[Darandio]

Word on the street is that it’s back to school from end of May for some students (certain years). Rumour only, but I’ve had it from two ‘well connected’ sources that are independent of each other.

No well connected sources needed, the exact same thing is on the news right now. The leader of the ASCL head teachers' union has said this is the earliest realistic date.

 

[HH]

No well connected sources needed, the exact same thing is on the news right now. The leader of the ASCL head teachers' union has said this is the earliest realistic date.

Yes, the earliest. Because even if it is announced soon, it will take some time to arrange everything.

 

[Busaholic]

Is the unfortunate lady from down your way Busaholic? We’ve been pretty fortunate in the southwest so far...
I hope she makes a speedy recovery.

My apologies for not having picked up on your query. As far as I know she is not a S.W. resident: I don't think my wife has heard any further news, but then she's had both iphone and ipad issues recently on account of the inbuilt obsolesence. She has a new iphone, which only took several hours to set up on account of the code allocated being 'not recognised', but hasn't the money or the energy to get to grips with a new ipad just yet.

 

[thejuggler]

Word on the street is that it’s back to school from end of May for some students (certain years). Rumour only, but I’ve had it from two ‘well connected’ sources that are independent of each other.

As the end of May is a school holiday how is this even possible?

 

[Bald Rick]

No well connected sources needed, the exact same thing is on the news right now. The leader of the ASCL head teachers' union has said this is the earliest realistic date.

Yes I know that, but that is her saying ‘the earliest they could open is...’

What people are telling me is ‘this is when they are opening’

Whilst Government clearly doesn’t want to announce anything yet, it is obviously having to arrange plans for some parts of the economy where lead times are longer than Boris announcing next Thursday that we can start doing more things from the following Monday. It’s not just schools either - all sorts of planning is going on all over the economy.

 

[Bald Rick]

As the end of May is a school holiday how is this even possible?

Fair point, I meant first of June, first day back after half term. Apologies.

 

[Busaholic]

As the end of May is a school holiday how is this even possible?

Monday 1st June in England is my prediction for primary schools and, quite possibly, secondary school pupils due to sit GCSEs next year, maybe another year too - I can't see the others going back. I suspect school uniform will not be de rigeur in any but the schools with pretentious attitudes.

 

[HH]

Monday 1st June in England is my prediction for primary schools and, quite possibly, secondary school pupils due to sit GCSEs next year, maybe another year too - I can't see the others going back. I suspect school uniform will not be de rigeur in any but the schools with pretentious attitudes.

I very much doubt that the younger children in primary schools will be among the first to go back. Even if they did, I think many parents would keep them at home.

 

[Busaholic]

I very much doubt that the younger children in primary schools will be among the first to go back. Even if they did, I think many parents would keep them at home.

I'm not disagreeing with you, particularly on the second point.

 

[trebor79]

Experts are saying that the earliest that they should reopen is on the 1st of June at the earliest so here's my thoughts and opinions on that:
My Opinon is that they should remain closed until for a few reasons
<snip>

You don't have kids, do you?

This situation is causing a massive loss of learning opportunity for children, and it's also quite traumatic for them, particularly the younger children to have had their routines completely upended with no notice. They suddenly find themselves in a strange world where they aren't allowed to see their friends or extended family.
Going back to some sort of normality before the summer holidays start is extremely important for their social and emotional needs, even if the educational benefit of a few weeks schooling may be relatively limited.

FWIW I think the "cure" to this situation is rapidly getting towards the point where it is worse than the disease. And as Sweden's epidemiologist (who persuaded that country not to impose lockdowns) pointed out in an interview in the Times on Monday, a model is just a model and is never perfect. It will give answers dependant upon the assumptions built into it.
Schools need to go back ASAP, and the rest of the economy needs to follow in fairly short order. Another couple of months of the current stasis and the after effects will be generational.

 

[farleigh]

Monday 1st June in England is my prediction for primary schools and, quite possibly, secondary school pupils due to sit GCSEs next year, maybe another year too - I can't see the others going back. I suspect school uniform will not be de rigeur in any but the schools with pretentious attitudes.

1. There is a value in ensuring the most vulnerable are in school but other than that there is little value in a partial reopening. When a school opens - IMO - it needs to be for all. Partial re-opening hampers parents getting back to work and those in school are exposed to others so what is the value in keeping some at home.

2. There is nothing pretentious about school uniform IMO but I agree that some schools will relax uniform codes.

 

[HH]

1. There is a value in ensuring the most vulnerable are in school but other than that there is little value in a partial reopening. When a school opens - IMO - it needs to be for all. Partial re-opening hampers parents getting back to work and those in school are exposed to others so what is the value in keeping some at home.

It might be your opinion, but it seems that Gavin Williamson doesn't agree with you.

 

[ChrisC]

This situation is causing a massive loss of learning opportunity for children, and it's also quite traumatic for them, particularly the younger children to have had their routines completely upended with no notice. They suddenly find themselves in a strange world where they aren't allowed to see their friends or extended family.
Going back to some sort of normality before the summer holidays start is extremely important for their social and emotional needs, even if the educational benefit of a few weeks schooling may be relatively limited.

I totally agree with everything that you say.
However, these are exceptional circumstances and I have the feeling that the younger children may be the most difficult group to be returned to school because they will not understand social distancing.
Social distancing is going to be almost impossible with many children in Foundation and Key Stage 1 classes.

Having not seen their teachers and friends for many weeks it will be very difficult to stop these children running into school hugging their teachers and friends. It would be very difficult, even with smaller numbers to stop young children coming into close contact with others. Young children gravitate towards each other, when they are working or playing, or when having their lunch.
What about the children with special needs such as those with various types of autism, who will grab hold and hug other children and will want to cling on to the teacher and other adults working in schools. Young children fall down and hurt themselves and expect a cuddle from an adult, they get upset and cry, want to go home, and have to be comforted by an adult often involving hand holding, hugging or even sitting on an adults knee.

It will be an almost impossible and extremely stressful task for teachers of young children to enforce and maintain social distancing at all times. Will we have parents who will blame the teacher and even threaten legal action if their child is hugged by another child?