Covered Bus Stations

[Teapot42]

A VR on the X40 would've been a rarity as Peterlee depot never had that many, or at least until the 1990s.

It was 92 to 94 I was a regular on the X40. It was more often than not a National, but VRs and - after TMS were taken over - Dennis Dominants were occasional visitors. From memory Peterlee depot wasn't able to accept newer buses for a long time as there was a slope to access it, and newer low floor buses grounded out.

Towards the end of my time there it seemed more and more common that a Merc Mini ended up on the peak departure from Durham though. Probably one of my first introductions to the concept of diagrams as I realised the bus I saw doing the opposite journey in the morning was the one we'd get home in the evening.

(Apologies if this is getting OT for the thread!)

 

[Buzby]

think Edinburgh bus station is one of them.

I don’t believe it was - as back in the 60’s, the passengers were under cover whilst the buses drove into and out of the stances as St Andrew Square. This was replaced with the current one, however passengers only are under cover, whilst the buses drove into the operational area in the open, simply nose-in under the building above.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I don’t believe it was - as back in the 60’s, the passengers were under cover whilst the buses drove into and out of the stances as St Andrew Square. This was replaced with the current one, however passengers only are under cover, whilst the buses drove into the operational area in the open, simply nose-in under the building above.

Edinburgh was partly under cover in the 70's, 80's and 90's because of an office block being constructed over it. Coach stands were in the open.

The current one is much more undercover but obviously much smaller

 

[Trainman40083]

Worswick Street and Marlborough Crescent may have been more enclosed but as I say, they didn't provide much shelter from the elements.

Marlborough Crescent had this until 1977 - then it was completely open air. Worswick Street was a bit more enclosed until the 1970s when the glazing at the far end was removed. It was a regular waiting spot for me and the 722/3 back south.

A VR on the X40 would've been a rarity as Peterlee depot never had that many, or at least until the 1990s.

Worswick Street BS might have been fine on a wet day, if you had a rear entrance bus

 

[Zamracene749]

It was 92 to 94 I was a regular on the X40. It was more often than not a National, but VRs and - after TMS were taken over - Dennis Dominants were occasional visitors.

Dennis Dominants working the X40? Not Duple?
Back on topic, Newcastle Worswick Street wasn't actually all that bad when it was raining, the tall buildings and prevailing winds usually led to the rain pretty much missing the stands, unless you were unlucky enough to have to use the one on the street outside the old travel office.

 

[Teapot42]

Dennis Dominants working the X40? Not Duple?

I've got to admit I'm now wondering! Considering it's 30+ years ago, but I'm sure they were Dennis buses, and this photo shows TMS did have Dominants. However, the same album also shows a lot of Leyland vehicles with the same / similar body. I have no idea what United kept when they bought TMS, but I do have a strong memory of one driver commenting how much better they were than the National. Something along the lines of he could hold it in first and get up to a decent speed in the same time a National would have changed up several times. They certainly seemed more rapid.

Newcastle Worswick Street wasn't actually all that bad when it was raining, the tall buildings and prevailing winds usually led to the rain pretty much missing the stands, unless you were unlucky enough to have to use the one on the street outside the old travel office.

The North East didn't seem to have that many decent bus stations. From memory, Sunderland Park Lane was pleasant enough in nice weather, but offered not a lot of protection in the rain. Seaham wasn't great either, and the location of both wasn't great. Sunderland Central, while covered, was pretty grim from memory - again, not one we used much as most buses from our direction terminated at Park Lane and if we were going beyond Sunderland it was usually by train. Hartlepool wasn't that handy for the town, and was also very exposed.

I guess people were a lot hardier back then.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I've got to admit I'm now wondering! Considering it's 30+ years ago, but I'm sure they were Dennis buses, and this photo shows TMS did have Dominants. However, the same album also shows a lot of Leyland vehicles with the same / similar body. I have no idea what United kept when they bought TMS, but I do have a strong memory of one driver commenting how much better they were than the National. Something along the lines of he could hold it in first and get up to a decent speed in the same time a National would have changed up several times. They certainly seemed more rapid.

TMS had a fleet of Duple Dominant bodied Leyland Leopards and Tigers that were used on their traditional cross Durham services. After Caldaire (United) bought the business in 1990, most of those were reallocated to Bishop Auckland, Durham and Peterlee depots after Trimdon closed. A few subsequently headed to North Yorkshire where their large capacity was handy for schools work.

They had semi-automatic gearboxes so no issue in holding gears. Unlike the Leyland Nationals that were virtually all fully automatic.

The North East didn't seem to have that many decent bus stations. From memory, Sunderland Park Lane was pleasant enough in nice weather, but offered not a lot of protection in the rain. Seaham wasn't great either, and the location of both wasn't great. Sunderland Central, while covered, was pretty grim from memory - again, not one we used much as most buses from our direction terminated at Park Lane and if we were going beyond Sunderland it was usually by train. Hartlepool wasn't that handy for the town, and was also very exposed.

I guess people were a lot hardier back then.

Back on topic, Sunderland Central was an absolute hellhole of a place. It was also dangerous as the floor "sweated" so drivers had to be careful as vehicles could skid as water/moisture sat on the surface. Its demise wasn't missed.

Another classic undercover bus station was Darlington. It was built in 1961, and was a combined depot/station. Get an early departure and you'd have a wait with all manner of vehicles being started up. It was closed c.1993/4 and just became a bus depot - late shot of it here

 

[Teapot42]

TMS had a fleet of Duple Dominant bodied Leyland Leopards and Tigers that were used on their traditional cross Durham services. After Caldaire (United) bought the business in 1990, most of those were reallocated to Bishop Auckland, Durham and Peterlee depots after Trimdon closed. A few subsequently headed to North Yorkshire where their large capacity was handy for schools work.

Thanks for the clarification - I have no idea why I associated Dennis with these buses!

My main exposure to them was seeing them on the pit services - again where large capacity was useful. I can't recall if TMS didn't serve Easington at all, or just the odd service. (Maybe one of the 21x services?)

Another classic undercover bus station was Darlington. It was built in 1961, and was a combined depot/station. Get an early departure and you'd have a wait with all manner of vehicles being started up. It was closed c.1993/4 and just became a bus depot - late shot of it here

Was this also the location of their printing works? I guess at the time it made sense for a bus company to be able to print their own literature, but I wonder how common it actually was?

 

[Zamracene749]

My main exposure to them was seeing them on the pit services - again where large capacity was useful. I can't recall if TMS didn't serve Easington at all, or just the odd service. (Maybe one of the 21x services?)

Not in my memory, not even after deregulation. Closest they came to Easington Village was probably the Argus Butterfly area in Peterlee on the 234, or Horden Victory Club as the terminus of the 235 would be the closest to Easington Colliery. They did serve Easington Lane of course again, on the 234. But all of this is probably one for a different thread, routes that yourself, TheGrandWazoo and I recall in our heyday lol

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Was this also the location of their printing works? I guess at the time it made sense for a bus company to be able to print their own literature, but I wonder how common it actually was?

United’s head office was at Grange Road which was home of the print shop, central works and Darlington depot before 1961 (and was again c.1990)

Not in my memory, not even after deregulation. Closest they came to Easington Village was probably the Argus Butterfly area in Peterlee on the 234, or Horden Victory Club as the terminus of the 235 would be the closest to Easington Colliery. They did serve Easington Lane of course again, on the 234. But all of this is probably one for a different thread, routes that yourself, TheGrandWazoo and I recall in our heyday lol

Yeah - that’s my recollection. 235 was my first thought. Recall OK and even Hartlepool Tspt in Easington after deregulation but not TMS

 

[JKP]

Thanks for the clarification - I have no idea why I associated Dennis with these buses!

My main exposure to them was seeing them on the pit services - again where large capacity was useful. I can't recall if TMS didn't serve Easington at all, or just the odd service. (Maybe one of the 21x services?)


Was this also the location of their printing works? I guess at the time it made sense for a bus company to be able to print their own literature, but I wonder how common it actually was?

Yes, United had their own printing works at Darlington.

The period bus station at Beamish as far as I know is the Durham bus station referred to in the above stream.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Yes, United had their own printing works at Darlington.

The period bus station at Beamish as far as I know is the Durham bus station referred to in the above stream.

United Print was not at the bus station though. It was at the head office on Grange Road (aka United House). Darlington bus station was the home of the Area Superintendent (when firms had that sort of thing) and the driving school. The back office was at Grange Road.

Darlington bus station was always a dark place and didn't have much money spent on it even in NBC days. I remember it all too well! Whilst combined depots and bus stations weren't uncommon, in most the bus station was open to the elements. I never went to the fully enclosed one at Lincoln but it seemed lighter (in photos) and more airy than those in Bristol and Darlington.

 

[Trainman40083]

United Print was not at the bus station though. It was at the head office on Grange Road (aka United House). Darlington bus station was the home of the Area Superintendent (when firms had that sort of thing) and the driving school. The back office was at Grange Road.

Darlington bus station was always a dark place and didn't have much money spent on it even in NBC days. I remember it all too well! Whilst combined depots and bus stations weren't uncommon, in most the bus station was open to the elements. I never went to the fully enclosed one at Lincoln but it seemed lighter (in photos) and more airy than those in Bristol and Darlington.

Lincoln St Marks Lincolnshire RC bus station cum depot was certainly well lit. Took some great pictures in there.

 

[DunsBus]

Edinburgh was partly under cover in the 70's, 80's and 90's because of an office block being constructed over it. Coach stands were in the open.

The current one is much more undercover but obviously much smaller

That office block did the old Edinburgh bus station no favours, as it robbed stances C and D completely of daylight.

 

[ian1944]

A link upthread about Newcastle's Marlborough Crescent BS mentioned that it was bought by the "Tyne Wear Development Corporation". Was this T. Dan Smith's crooked enterprise?

One I don't recall being mentioned was the previous Digbeth coach station in Brum, completely undercover as it was part of the Midland Red garage. One one overnight trip, when it was usual to have a prolonged break there to provide connection with other services doing the same, I stretched my legs round the parked buses and nearly fell into an unguarded inspection pit just behind one of them.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

That office block did the old Edinburgh bus station no favours, as it robbed stances C and D completely of daylight.

I both loved and hated the place. It was a bleak place and cold yet I loved the subways between stances. As a young enthusiast (I never took down numbers), it was great to see the Eastern Scottish vehicles with slightly battered Dalkeith and Edinburgh vehicles seen against the well presented ones from small depots like Hawick and Peebles, as well as the differing vehicle types with Olympians, Ailsas and Fleetlines alongside Seddons and Tigers. Oh, and the visiting SBG fleets like Fife and Midland with the occasional Western from Dumfries.

A link upthread about Newcastle's Marlborough Crescent BS mentioned that it was bought by the "Tyne Wear Development Corporation". Was this T. Dan Smith's crooked enterprise?

One I don't recall being mentioned was the previous Digbeth coach station in Brum, completely undercover as it was part of the Midland Red garage. One one overnight trip, when it was usual to have a prolonged break there to provide connection with other services doing the same, I stretched my legs round the parked buses and nearly fell into an unguarded inspection pit just behind one of them.

TWDC wasn't to do with T.Dan Smith - that was Newcastle City Council! TWDC was a 1980s creation and was centrally controlled from Westminster.

Good call on Digbeth. Remember waiting for coaches many times in the mid 1990s. Grim old place, shared with Midland Red West by that time.

 

[DunsBus]

I both loved and hated the place. It was a bleak place and cold yet I loved the subways between stances. As a young enthusiast (I never took down numbers), it was great to see the Eastern Scottish vehicles with slightly battered Dalkeith and Edinburgh vehicles seen against the well presented ones from small depots like Hawick and Peebles, as well as the differing vehicle types with Olympians, Ailsas and Fleetlines alongside Seddons and Tigers. Oh, and the visiting SBG fleets like Fife and Midland with the occasional Western from Dumfries.

I agree. Yes, it had its faults, and you only used the loos there if you were really desperate, but it was an enthusiasts' paradise. Plus, you didn't risk getting gassed as was the case with Sunderland Central bus station.

 

[Ken H]

United Print was not at the bus station though. It was at the head office on Grange Road (aka United House). Darlington bus station was the home of the Area Superintendent (when firms had that sort of thing) and the driving school. The back office was at Grange Road.

Darlington bus station was always a dark place and didn't have much money spent on it even in NBC days. I remember it all too well! Whilst combined depots and bus stations weren't uncommon, in most the bus station was open to the elements. I never went to the fully enclosed one at Lincoln but it seemed lighter (in photos) and more airy than those in Bristol and Darlington.

United was huge. There were United stage carriage buses in Leeds, albeit on joint services, and in Carlisle and Berwick. Even Edinburgh. But was it bigger than Ribble?

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

United was huge. There were United stage carriage buses in Leeds, albeit on joint services, and in Carlisle and Berwick. Even Edinburgh. But was it bigger than Ribble?

The period that you reference (from the 1930s to 1986), they were about the same size. They had depots in Berwick, Carlisle (later transferred to Ribble), Ripon, Scarborough and, for a time, even an outstation in Bridlington. However, before 1931, United had that operating area AND the Norfolk and Suffolk (and rural Cambridgeshire) operations that then became Eastern Counties. We digress...

I agree. Yes, it had its faults, and you only used the loos there if you were really desperate, but it was an enthusiasts' paradise. Plus, you didn't risk getting gassed as was the case with Sunderland Central bus station.

Sunderland Central was BAD. However, for fumes, I think the old Eldon Square was the worst. Great acoustics though with an Atlantean being driven through.

 

[ian1944]

However, for fumes, I think the old Eldon Square was the worst. Great acoustics though with an Atlantean being driven through.

I suspect that for the passenger experience there was little to choose between it and the Bull Ring. The phrases poisonous hellhole and dystopian concrete nightmare were attached to a 1982 pic of that which I came across - looked horrible, smelt horrible and sounded horrible. The old Manchester Arndale BS was equally brutal, but better lit and with a higher ceiling to aid exhaust diffusion.

 

[John HG1]

Perhaps with increasing numbers of electric vehicles there's a case for developing more covered ones. Not ideal, ambience-wise, but could avoid the trend to banish buses to the outer reaches of town centres.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Perhaps with increasing numbers of electric vehicles there's a case for developing more covered ones. Not ideal, ambience-wise, but could avoid the trend to banish buses to the outer reaches of town centres.

I’m not sure I follow your logic?

 

[John HG1]

I’m not sure I follow your logic?

Without fumes an undercover central location (with appropriate facilities) would seem more attractive and more convenient. Finding a site is the problem.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Without fumes an undercover central location (with appropriate facilities) would seem more attractive and more convenient. Finding a site is the problem.

But why do the buses need to be undercover anyway?

 

[ian1944]

But why do the buses need to be undercover anyway?

With ubiquitous front entrances and, usually, forward in and reverse out, some weather protection over the front half is desirable but the rest doesn't matter. The logic of full covering is that a central location is more likely to be economical if combined with something above, retail or parking, and the corresponding full covering is more acceptable without exhaust fumes. So the full covering is a consequence of something, not innately desirable.

That said, my favourite bus station was Bolton's previous one with enough room for sawtooth stands, forward in and forward out, adequate weather protection for passengers and a glorious old school caff.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

With ubiquitous front entrances and, usually, forward in and reverse out, some weather protection over the front half is desirable but the rest doesn't matter. The logic of full covering is that a central location is more likely to be economical if combined with something above, retail or parking, and the corresponding full covering is more acceptable without exhaust fumes. So the full covering is a consequence of something, not innately desirable.

Absolutely - you need a bit of a canopy extending over but not a fully covered bus station. All you need is a decent sawtooth design, and doors that activate when a bus is on the stand. Oh, and great passenger facilities too!!

That said, my favourite bus station was Bolton's previous one with enough room for sawtooth stands, forward in and forward out, adequate weather protection for passengers and a glorious old school caff.

Funnily enough, I didn't like Bolton. Different strokes and all that

 

[DGP]

Sunderland Central was BAD. However, for fumes, I think the old Eldon Square was the worst. Great acoustics though with an Atlantean being driven through.

Yes, Sunderland Central BS was so bad that in the mid 80s the side wall was removed to try to disperse the fumes more quickly. Though I am old enough to remember (just!) the situation before that Bus Station was built and having to wait in the open air, the cold and the damp at the bomb site (literally I think) roughly where the current Market Square is now that served as a "Bus Station" until the Central Bus Station was opened in the late 1960s. At the time it felt like such an improvement.

 

[Statto]

The period that you reference (from the 1930s to 1986), they were about the same size. They had depots in Berwick, Carlisle (later transferred to Ribble), Ripon, Scarborough and, for a time, even an outstation in Bridlington. However, before 1931, United had that operating area AND the Norfolk and Suffolk (and rural Cambridgeshire) operations that then became Eastern Counties. We digress...


Sunderland Central was BAD. However, for fumes, I think the old Eldon Square was the worst. Great acoustics though with an Atlantean being driven through.

Mentioning Eldon Square acoustics with Atlanteans being driven through, kind of reminds me of Manchester Arndale bus station, with the sound of an GM Atlantean revving up or being driven through.

 

[Ridercross]

Another one that I don't think has been mentioned is Matlock (Bakewell Road), most stops are undercover with the exception being Derby bound services that load on the road outside by M&S.

 

[Fletcj10]

Haverfordwest in Wales, Pembrokeshire is proposing to build an undercover bus station with what looks to be single deck bus use only