congleton station

[chefchenko]

Is an eyesore, i thank cross country for not stopping there anymore,i cant imagine what people must have thought when there train stopped at this unmanned(from 1pm)scruffy hole !! for a town of 26k its out of sight out of mind i think. Being about a mile out of the town centre its unloved by the town,only real users are the commuters into manchester in the peaks,hardly anybody travels south to stoke even when we had 2 hourly cross country to birmingham and reading a few yrs back !!But Biddulph is only 3 miles away with no train service,i think there is a case for a congleton and Biddulph parkway ???

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

You seem to move around a bit...from Hartford station to Congleton station.
The station at Congleton is served on the Manchester to Stoke on Trent line and has the facilities of both these two areas on hand for rail pasengers, plus of course, Macclesfield that is the next stop on the line.

Congleton does have quite good bus links to many places in Cheshire and Staffordshire. In particular, on the route to Biddulph that you mention, Bakerbus run their service 99/99A/99B covering Biddulph-Mossley-Congleton-Buglawton-Macclesfield. Baker Coaches who operate this service are based in Biddulph.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

The only reason XC do not serve Congleton (although there still is 1tpd that calls) is Northern introducing the extension from Macclesfield-Stoke on an hourly basis. As for the station, well, it was a 1960s LMS station buildings massacre. No more to it. (See Wigan NW, Warrington BQ, Hartford, Nuneaton etc for other examples.)

 

[Stuwhu]

You seem to move around a bit...from Hartford station to Congleton station.
The station at Congleton is served on the Manchester to Stoke on Trent line and has the facilities of both these two areas on hand for rail pasengers, plus of course, Maclesfield that is the next stop on the line.

Where on earth is MACLESFIELD? Do you mean Macclesfield? That is the correct spelling.

 

[chefchenko]

we even had a london train each way until the mid 90s !!!

 

[323235]

I believe from my regular travel through the station that Congleton is becoming a very well used station

During the day many people get on and off there in both directions plus the station usage figures are already very good even without the added increase that is occuring.

Yes the windows on the booking office and doors don't look amazing but apart from that I've always thought its not too bad a station.

Just the Sunday service that needs sorting and things are starting to move as East Cheshire Council have agreed for the first time to fund rail with an additional service to Stoke in conjunction with TFGM and they are being retimed to appeal to more people. East Cheshire Council are usually very poor with funding for transport so the actions speak for themselves really.

Also there are buses to Biddulph from the bridge above the station so no need for a new multi million pound station in the middle of the fields.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Where on earth is MACLESFIELD? Do you mean Macclesfield? That is the correct spelling.

You will find that I have edited my post...this will teach me to type too fast and not to proof-read what I had typed. I live less than 20 miles from Macclesfield and at my age, I must have typed the word countless times before.

M A C C L E S F I E L D

I would not had been allowed to forget this, when the spelling and grammar thread was running.:roll::roll:

Blessed are the verbally challenged, for they shall be corrected.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

There was something bounced around a while ago about hourly Manchester-Stoke locals on Sundays as there are during the week...

As for Congleton having London trains, I could have sworn that that was more recent, maybe around 2003 (the same time that Hartford was scrapped?).

 

[323235]

Northern did look at the cost of an hourly sunday service for TFGM but it was far too expensive and TFGM would have had to foot a lot of the bill as ECC would have been unlikely to be able to contribute a satisfactory amount and TFGM wouldn't have been able to justify funding such a vast amount for a service outside there patch especially at a time when there budget is already squeezed and heavily constrained.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Northern did look at the cost of an hourly sunday service for TFGM but it was far too expensive and TFGM would have had to foot a lot of the bill as ECC would have been unlikely to be able to contribute a satisfactory amount and TFGM wouldn't have been able to justify funding such a vast amount for a service outside there patch especially at a time when there budget is already squeezed and heavily constrained.

Surely there are restrictions on monies spent by TfGM on areas outside their remit. Congleton itself is in the southern part of Cheshire East, not all that far from the border with Staffordshire. When TfGM was set up recently, it was stated that they would be expanding the work of the former GMPTE, but that only referred to extra responsibilies within the borders of the Greater Manchester area.

Surely any rail-related matters in Congleton come under the financial jurisdiction of Cheshire East Council.

 

[merlodlliw]

Is an eyesore, i thank cross country for not stopping there anymore,i cant imagine what people must have thought when there train stopped at this unmanned(from 1pm)scruffy hole !! for a town of 26k its out of sight out of mind i think. Being about a mile out of the town centre its unloved by the town,only real users are the commuters into manchester in the peaks,hardly anybody travels south to stoke even when we had 2 hourly cross country to birmingham and reading a few yrs back !!But Biddulph is only 3 miles away with no train service,i think there is a case for a congleton and Biddulph parkway ???

Biddulph station closed in 1927, my grandparents had a house next to the line & I recall freight(coal) trains in the late 50s, the next station was Black Bull,then Brindley Ford, passenger services were stopped in 1927 by the LMS when the major employer Robert Heaths Black Bull iron Works(Biddulph) laid off over a thousand employees,my grandfather being one of them. The line is now a national cycle track. The largest manufacturer of cast iron in the world in 1897 was Robert Heath of Biddulph
I append the above out of interest.

Bob
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Where on earth is MACLESFIELD? Do you mean Macclesfield? That is the correct spelling.

All due respect Stuwhu, as a new member, we all know the silk town by various names & spellings.

 

[323235]

Surely there are restrictions on monies spent by TfGM on areas outside their remit. Congleton itself is in the southern part of Cheshire East, not all that far from the border with Staffordshire. When TfGM was set up recently, it was stated that they would be expanding the work of the former GMPTE, but that only referred to extra responsibilies within the borders of the Greater Manchester area.

Surely any rail-related matters in Congleton come under the financial jurisdiction of Cheshire East Council.

Yes but the problem lies that East Cheshire Council don't have anything like the budget to spend that TfGM do on transport therefore they simply cannot afford to make a huge contribution to rail services.In Cheshire Bus Fares are high,there are less commercial buses and a lot of subsidised buses,Integrated ticketing is non-existant and patronage outside the centres is very poor primarily for all the reasons stated above, there is just not a big enough incentive for people to leave the car behind because buses in many areas are irregular or infrequent.

For the new Rail services if they go ahead (1 to Macc and 1 to Stoke) TfGM will be funding 61% as East Cheshire offered 39%.

The only way we will get an hourly Sunday Service on the line is if the DFT contribute generously beyond Bramhall.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Yes but the problem lies that East Cheshire Council don't have anything like the budget to spend that TfGM do on transport therefore they simply cannot afford to make a huge contribution to rail services.
For the new Rail services if they go ahead (1 to Macc and 1 to Stoke) TfGM will be funding 61% as East Cheshire offered 39%.

I do not want to sound unkind, but if TfGM are expected to support a route to the Staffordshire area, it should only be to the boundary of Greater Manchester. The fact that Cheshire East do not have enough budgetry financial provision is absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with TfGM.

The monies that come into the coffers of TfGM should ONLY be for projects that fall within the boundaries of Greater Manchester. This is what will be expected of it by all the residents of the 10 areas that make up Greater Manchester. Any monies spent on areas OUTSIDE the county area, will be LESS for TfGM to spend INSIDE its area.

The monies required from OUTSIDE the Greater Manchester border, on this specific project, should by obtained by Cheshire East council from national government finance that is part of their strategic transport planning requirements.

Nothing that you will say will change my mind on this matter.

 

[323235]

The thing is I don't disagree with you , TfGM is there for the benefit of Greater Manchester, There finance comes from Greater Manchester taxpayers and money designated to enhance Greater Manchester which they obtain from National Government and which they fight hard for. East Cheshire Council really need to sort themselves out, but if East Cheshire can't fund something and TfGM want to enhance the service and the level of support from Cheshire is not adequate and there is no provision for turning back services at Bramhall, they're stuck with a clear choice, abandon it and leave Bramhall which is incredibly popular with a poor service or go beyond for the greater good. I believe there is a feeling that Greater Manchester and its economy would benefit from the increased service level on the Stoke line, so that is why they are so keen to encourage an increase. If it were left to East Cheshire Council it would never improve.

 

[Stuwhu]

I knew exactly what he meant, however Mr Sidorczuk seems rather keen to correct other peoples spelling errors so I thought I would do the same to him.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

I knew exactly what he meant, however Mr Sidorczuk seems rather keen to correct other peoples spelling errors so I thought I would do the same to him.

And well, it is, that you do.

But did you then not read my subsequent apology, in a later posting? Please look at posting # 7.

 

[WestCoast]

And well, it is, that you do.

But did you then not read my subsequent apology, in a later posting? Please look at posting # 7.

I think his comments were more directed towards merlodlliw. Anyway enough of spelling and grammar, I'm disappointed frankly that Congleton has a part-time ticket office only with no machine, considering the passenger numbers it generates!

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

I'm disappointed frankly that Congleton has a part-time ticket office only with no machine, considering the passenger numbers it generates!

Since 2004/2005. the annual passenger loading figures for Congleton station have grown every single year. In 2004/2005, the figure was 97,992....In 2009/2010, the figure had grown to 213,650. This equates to an increase of 218% over that period.

 

[merlodlliw]

I think his comments were more directed towards merlodlliw. Anyway enough of spelling and grammar, I'm disappointed frankly that Congleton has a part-time ticket office only with no machine, considering the passenger numbers it generates!

I had presumed that as well, I did try & be helpful,agree too much attention on spelling by all parties on RF.


Bob

 

[chefchenko]

Since 2004/2005. the annual passenger loading figures for Congleton station have grown every single year. In 2004/2005, the figure was 97,992....In 2009/2010, the figure had grown to 213,650. This equates to an increase of 218% over that period.

the vast majority being commuters,hence the overflow car park being rammed and cross country stopping in the peak. During the day ive often been the only person getting on a train southbound. we have no pay machines and no destination displays and is a haven for local youth at night

 

[A0]

Surely there are restrictions on monies spent by TfGM on areas outside their remit. Congleton itself is in the southern part of Cheshire East, not all that far from the border with Staffordshire. When TfGM was set up recently, it was stated that they would be expanding the work of the former GMPTE, but that only referred to extra responsibilies within the borders of the Greater Manchester area.

Surely any rail-related matters in Congleton come under the financial jurisdiction of Cheshire East Council.

I think that TFGM have to be pragmatic. To simply say stop the service where the boundary ends may not be particularly pragmatic and may prevent further growth.

Having said that, in this particular case, Macclesfield is the obvious point outside the TfGM boundary to terminate services, so in theory TfGM only need to increase the number of Sunday services between Macc and Manchester Piccadilly. Passengers for Stoke can travel to Macc and change to XC or VWC services.

The Sunday service at Congleton is pretty useless though given its timings - what I've never understood is why XC don't just make a 2 hourly stop on Sunday. When they used to stop at Congleton the Stoke - Macc timings were exactly the same as the non-stoppers, so it wouldn't impact their timings. On a weekday they usually run ahead of the Northern stopper, since that isn't there on a Sunday, they wouldn't risk holding anything up either.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

I think that TFGM have to be pragmatic. To simply say stop the service where the boundary ends may not be particularly pragmatic and may prevent further growth.

Having said that, in this particular case, Macclesfield is the obvious point outside the TfGM boundary to terminate services

With regard to "pragmatic" areas outside the TfGM remit, the two large "Cheshire" towns that carry commuter traffic to and from Manchester are Macclesfield (stations at Prestbury, Adlington and Poynton) and Warrington (stations at Padgate and Birchwood). I accept that as long as funding to these towns (and no further) is part-shared, pragmatism should be considered.

I do not intend to discuss the niceties of any Derbyshire "similar case" stations on this particular thread, before the "Buxton to Disley" supporters come onto this thread in their droves. Derbyshire County Council have their own agenda in the matter of finance for public transport, as the bus users in the Glossop area have just found out to their cost.

As you have noted, I am very watchful of TfGM expenditure outside the boundaries of its current remit and if Central Government should fund the extra finance to TfGM for projects as this, with TfGM being the financial administrator for these extra funds, then all well and good.

 

[ANorthernGuard]

With regard to "pragmatic" areas outside the TfGM remit, the two large "Cheshire" towns that carry commuter traffic to and from Manchester are Macclesfield (stations at Prestbury, Adlington and Poynton) and Warrington (stations at Padgate and Birchwood). I accept that as long as funding to these towns (and no further) is part-shared, pragmatism should be considered.

I do not intend to discuss the niceties of any Derbyshire "similar case" stations on this particular thread, before the "Buxton to Disley" supporters come onto this thread in their droves. Derbyshire County Council have their own agenda in the matter of finance for public transport, as the bus users in the Glossop area have just found out to their cost.

As you have noted, I am very watchful of TfGM expenditure outside the boundaries of its current remit and if Central Government should fund the extra finance to TfGM for projects as this, with TfGM being the financial administrator for these extra funds, then all well and good.

The derbyshire passengers will have even more top grumble about as from the 1st of August no more gold card discounts on trains

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

The derbyshire passengers will have even more top grumble about as from the 1st of August no more gold card discounts on trains

Thank you for adding even more strength to the point that I made reference to in the second paragraph of my previous posting.

 

[A0]

With regard to "pragmatic" areas outside the TfGM remit, the two large "Cheshire" towns that carry commuter traffic to and from Manchester are Macclesfield (stations at Prestbury, Adlington and Poynton) and Warrington (stations at Padgate and Birchwood). I accept that as long as funding to these towns (and no further) is part-shared, pragmatism should be considered.

I do not intend to discuss the niceties of any Derbyshire "similar case" stations on this particular thread, before the "Buxton to Disley" supporters come onto this thread in their droves. Derbyshire County Council have their own agenda in the matter of finance for public transport, as the bus users in the Glossop area have just found out to their cost.

As you have noted, I am very watchful of TfGM expenditure outside the boundaries of its current remit and if Central Government should fund the extra finance to TfGM for projects as this, with TfGM being the financial administrator for these extra funds, then all well and good.

You can't stipulate that funding to, say, Macclesfield should be part shared. The problem with the rail network is you can't just turn a train round at a random point - unlike a bus service where it can simply terminate at the town / village on the boundary.

The benefit of increasing services between Macc & Manchester or Warrington or Glossop and Manchester for that matter is almost entirely to the economy of Manchester. The prime traffic flows will be to Manchester and once there travellers will spend their money in Manchester, be it shopping, going to concerts, theatre or sports events.

In that context the authorities in which Macc, Warrington or Glossop lie have little or no benefit to reap from increasing the subsidies for further services.

FWIW, in London, TFL have funded outside their bounday in very specific cases, with bus and train services to Watford, and bus services to Borehamwood and Waltham Cross as examples. They recognised that the bulk of the flow will be INTO London and benefit areas of London.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

You can't stipulate that funding to, say, Macclesfield should be part shared. The problem with the rail network is you can't just turn a train round at a random point - unlike a bus service where it can simply terminate at the town / village on the boundary.

The benefit of increasing services between Macc & Manchester or Warrington or Glossop and Manchester for that matter is almost entirely to the economy of Manchester. The prime traffic flows will be to Manchester and once there travellers will spend their money in Manchester, be it shopping, going to concerts, theatre or sports events.

In that context the authorities in which Macc, Warrington or Glossop lie have little or no benefit to reap from increasing the subsidies for further services.

FWIW, in London, TFL have funded outside their bounday in very specific cases, with bus and train services to Watford, and bus services to Borehamwood and Waltham Cross as examples. They recognised that the bulk of the flow will be INTO London and benefit areas of London.

Let us not compare TfL with TfGM. The only comparison is with their respective acronyms. You make mention of the train services provision and not terminating trains at county boundaries. I was of the opinion that Northern Rail as part of their franchaise agreement had control of such matters, I was not aware that TfGM had obtained TOC status.

Where does TfGM receive its funding from and what is this funding supposed to cover? It just cannot go looking outside its remit and have a philanthropic view of other areas when dealing with the monies allocated to it, It has its own budgetry planning and has to be accountable to the 10 areas that make up Greater Manchester. Cheshire East council may well plead poverty on certain matters when it suits them, but again, that is just a cynical financial ploy to say that TfGM should make up any shortfall. Let Cheshire East Council go to Central Government and plead their case for extra funding in these days when Central Government is looking for Ministerial Department financial savings.

As I said in an earlier posting, if Central Government say that TfGM were to be financial administrators for extra funding for areas outside its remit and these monies were granted, then all well and good.

If you want an anomoly to consider, look at the single rail fare from Greenfield (in TfGM area) to the next station of Marsden (in WY Metro area). Two stations, both in Metropolitan areas but with no responsibility for the connecting section, small as it is, admitted to by either party. According to your reasoning, either TfGM or WY Metro should cover the cost of this link from their budgets, but neither of them do so. Please feel free to look at the cost of a single rail journey on the National Rail Enquiries web site...you will be amazed at the price of the ticket.

 

[flymo]

we even had a london train each way until the mid 90s !!!

As for Congleton having London trains, I could have sworn that that was more recent, maybe around 2003 (the same time that Hartford was scrapped?).

There were certainly direct trains to/from London as late as 2001, the Paddington - Manchester trains stopped at Congleton.

 

[chefchenko]

There were certainly direct trains to/from London as late as 2001, the Paddington - Manchester trains stopped at Congleton.

only the southbound 17.10 off piccadilly stopped.....for the commuters and it also stopped at bramhall of all places !!
I meant a regualr euston that used to stop,about 8 in the morning southbound and it used to arrive back about 8 at night with lots of coaches off the platform which is very short northbound

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

only the southbound 17.10 off piccadilly stopped.....for the commuters and it also stopped at bramhall of all places !!
I meant a regualr euston that used to stop,about 8 in the morning southbound and it used to arrive back about 8 at night with lots of coaches off the platform which is very short northbound

I am following the postings on this thread this morning to obtain a picture of how forum members feel about this matter. I note that you have not made many postings to date, but I note from what you have said in those of your last two postings portrays the fact that you do not have a high opinion of commuters. Look at the figues for rail travel nationally and you will find that commuters contribute a vast amount of monies to the rail operators. This is why when the matter of season-ticket annual price rises are mentioned on the media, there is always a great outburst from commuters for the media to make their reporting very sensational in manner.

Commuters who use the rail service find that they arrive far quicker by rail in the peak periods, when such travel is made, than by car. There is less fuel consumption and less mileage on the vehicle. There is the "green" matter of less carbon emissions also to be considered.

You mention Bramhall in your last posting with a degree of astonishment in your tone, as if this station should not receive mention by the train in question. I do not know where you live, but I can assure you that Bramhall has a high percentage of business and professional class residents within in its area, who would stand comparison to the residents of the Wilmslow and Alderley Edge areas where I reside.

 

[chefchenko]

I am following the postings on this thread this morning to obtain a picture of how forum members feel about this matter. I note that you have not made many postings to date, but I note from what you have said in those of your last two postings portrays the fact that you do not have a high opinion of commuters. Look at the figues for rail travel nationally and you will find that commuters contribute a vast amount of monies to the rail operators. This is why when the matter of season-ticket annual price rises are mentioned on the media, there is always a great outburst from commuters for the media to make their reporting very sensational in manner.

Commuters who use the rail service find that they arrive far quicker by rail in the peak periods, when such travel is made, than by car. There is less fuel consumption and less mileage on the vehicle. There is the "green" matter of less carbon emissions also to be considered.

You mention Bramhall in your last posting with a degree of astonishment in your tone, as if this station should not receive mention by the train in question. I do not know where you live, but I can assure you that Bramhall has a high percentage of business and professional class residents within in its area, who would stand comparison to the residents of the Wilmslow and Alderley Edge areas where I reside.

bleedin eck man wind yer neck in !!!
I was merely highlighting that the good people of congleton dont use the train out of peak hours,or very little anyway !
And i mentioned bramhall because never in my time has an express ever called there,i wasnt putting the place down.