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Companies That You Expect to Disappear Soon

Peter Sarf

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I has there ever been a situation like this before where a retailer has split into two parts, one part having to be renamed, but both parts basically selling the same stuff, just in different locations, rather than two different sectors. I’m sure it’s pretty rare.

Out of interest, who got the head office, and we may never know, will WHSmith stationery ever be rebranded as TG Jones, and will it start being sourced separately, with different products compared to what they will sell in the remaining WHSmith locations
I am 99% sure that anything to do with the long term future of TGJones is irrelevent.
So there are multiple head offices, the main one that was used by WHSmith High Street (now TGJones) was Greenbridge Road in Swindon with WHSmith Travel (the bit that still remains WHSmith) using Swindon but mainly London. Over the years the Greenbridge Road site has been reduced to it mainly just being one office block and the warehouse. The warehouse in Swindon tended to supply just the High Street stores with Travel being supplied from multiple other locations including previously Birmingham, Holford and Dunstable - although I believe both of these are now gone also.

The sale to Modella included the Greenbridge Road site and I believe they are currently in the process of closing it down with proposals to replace it all with housing.

And TSB is now being absorbed in to Santander.
Now I understand what was immediately in it for Modella to acquire the High Street arm of WHSmith - property development.
It's only recently dawned on me how useless Royal Mail has become. I'll have no post for days on end, then suddenly five or six letters appear at once. Birthday cards are arriving late, even if posted a week ahead. Recently I've had dealings with the Office of the public guardian. They allegedly sent me a letter in early August which never arrived. So they assumed I wasn't interested and returned my application form. That took 11 days to arrive, assuming they posted it on the date stated on the letter. I phoned them the same day and they said they would resend the lost letter. A week later, I'm still waiting. Assuming I can fix whatever is the problem on the form (they wouldn't tell me over the phone), I'll then have the expense of a second recorded delivery to send it back to them. Given that they have my phone number and email address, it seems amazing that they would rely on Royal Mail.
I think this is the problem for Royal Mail going forward. They must be heading for losing a lot of business that still wanted to rely on postal services. Lasting damage being done.

For me it has been predominantly letters arriving very late (irregular deliveries so not even predictable). But, seems because of staff turnover, I have my post delivered to the wrong front door. It then depends on if the people at that address can be bothered to complete the Royal Mails's job for them. Unlikely if they have accidentally opened it.
 
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adc82140

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We have given up sending out appointment letters in our department (NHS). Patients were missing appointments left right and centre. They all get a phone call now, which is a lot more time consuming than churning letters out, and we are discovering a lot of people don't answer calls from numbers they don't know. GDPR restricts what we can say in a voicemail.
 

35B

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We have given up sending out appointment letters in our department (NHS). Patients were missing appointments left right and centre. They all get a phone call now, which is a lot more time consuming than churning letters out, and we are discovering a lot of people don't answer calls from numbers they don't know. GDPR restricts what we can say in a voicemail.
At which point, the NHS need to get a LOT better at identifying how to communicate with patients. The parallel isn't perfect, but I went to the dentist yesterday and made my next appointment while there. As well as the verbal confirmation, I also received a text message and an email; I will also receive an email asking for any updates a few days before the appointment.

The use of letters does not compare well...
 

styles

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We have given up sending out appointment letters in our department (NHS). Patients were missing appointments left right and centre. They all get a phone call now, which is a lot more time consuming than churning letters out, and we are discovering a lot of people don't answer calls from numbers they don't know. GDPR restricts what we can say in a voicemail.
Some NHS Trusts communicate almost exclusively by post, which can be good sometimes, but incredibly inconvenient at other times.

I needed a wisdom tooth out as it was developing at a funny angle which may impact other teeth. The dentist said it really needs to be done under general anesthetic in a hospital, fine. I wait probably 6 months then, while I'm away for Christmas, I get a letter in the post of an appointment with just 3 days notice. Naturally I don't see this letter, and miss the appointment, and then before I even return home (I was only away for 9 days), I get a snide letter about how important it is to attend appointments or reschedule them. Well, NHS, maybe if you'd used the email address or phone number I provided, I'd have been able to inform you that I can't make the appointment.

I respect patients' right to communicate by letter, but to not even offer email as an option in 2025 is pretty ridiculous. It also surely costs that NHS Trust a lot more sending letters out than emails so I'm not even sure it can be argued for as a cost-saving measure.
 

Harpo

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At which point, the NHS need to get a LOT better at identifying how to communicate with patients.
All of my quality training placed huge emphasis on right first time, and the avoidance of re-work. I dread to think how much time and effort gets used re-arranging unilaterally imposed NHS appointments.
 

Peter Sarf

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At which point, the NHS need to get a LOT better at identifying how to communicate with patients. The parallel isn't perfect, but I went to the dentist yesterday and made my next appointment while there. As well as the verbal confirmation, I also received a text message and an email; I will also receive an email asking for any updates a few days before the appointment.

The use of letters does not compare well...
It is older folk I fear for the most. The ones who are not computer literate are going to get sidelined by how useless Royal Mail are.
Some NHS Trusts communicate almost exclusively by post, which can be good sometimes, but incredibly inconvenient at other times.

I needed a wisdom tooth out as it was developing at a funny angle which may impact other teeth. The dentist said it really needs to be done under general anesthetic in a hospital, fine. I wait probably 6 months then, while I'm away for Christmas, I get a letter in the post of an appointment with just 3 days notice. Naturally I don't see this letter, and miss the appointment, and then before I even return home (I was only away for 9 days), I get a snide letter about how important it is to attend appointments or reschedule them. Well, NHS, maybe if you'd used the email address or phone number I provided, I'd have been able to inform you that I can't make the appointment.

I respect patients' right to communicate by letter, but to not even offer email as an option in 2025 is pretty ridiculous. It also surely costs that NHS Trust a lot more sending letters out than emails so I'm not even sure it can be argued for as a cost-saving measure.
I have also seen this with other appointments. Such a short time from letter date to appointment that even when the Royal Mail was any good it was a close call. Impossible if you deign to not attend your home address for long enough !.

Mind you BT and RAC could get a bit better. I get a text reminder of my bill from BT but it states no amount !. With the RAC, when I broke down, they kept sending me messages over about five yours telling me there was an update to my call. The updates were just letting me know they had revised the attendance time to later - why they could not just send a meaningful text instead of making me "log in" and waste my battery I do not know. Anyway the last update was to ask me "how did we do" - to which the answer was YOU HAVN'T the idiots with all their communication had closed the call as completed. First thing I did next day was cancel my RAC membership that I have had for decades. I go with the cheapest I can find now. So maybe the RAC will drop dead soon.

The point for me is. These companies have all these fancy ways of communicating but cannot get the basics right. Great they have a website for me to use (box ticked) but how about keeping the basics by text even if they do not want to use post, oh and then provide the service they allege.to provide.
 
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gswindale

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It is older folk I fear for the most. The ones who are not computer literate are going to get sidelined by how useless Royal Mail are.
Can somebody confirm what age we start referring to people as elderly these days please?

My parents have been retired for approx 20 years now and my father, in particular, was disappointed at the airport when they decided to print him out a boarding pass rather than using the one on his Google Wallet this summer.

At some point, the only people who aren't "computer literate" will be those who've chosen to make their own lives difficult.

Computers have been common in the workplace for 25+ years now, so assuming retirement at 65, the most likely illiterate people will be 90+, so less than 1% of the population i believe.
 

adc82140

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At which point, the NHS need to get a LOT better at identifying how to communicate with patients. The parallel isn't perfect, but I went to the dentist yesterday and made my next appointment while there. As well as the verbal confirmation, I also received a text message and an email; I will also receive an email asking for any updates a few days before the appointment.

The use of letters does not compare well...
It's a big debate within healthcare at the moment. The demographics of many of the patients will preclude email, but a fair amount may be able to handle texts. The trouble is that an appointment letter can sit on a coffee table as a reminder, a text message can be read and forgotten about. You'd be amazed also at how many patients just have a landline number recorded on hospital systems.
 

43096

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At which point, the NHS need to get a LOT better at identifying how to communicate with patients. The parallel isn't perfect, but I went to the dentist yesterday and made my next appointment while there. As well as the verbal confirmation, I also received a text message and an email; I will also receive an email asking for any updates a few days before the appointment.

The use of letters does not compare well...
I was "called in" for a routine test back in May, which happened to coincide with when I was away. So I phoned them up and agreed an earlier date - which the NHS then cancelled the day before. Despite having told them I wasn't available on the original date, they re-booked me for the original date. Well, I'm not going to call you from my holiday because you are incompetent, so I just didn't turn up...
 

WesternLancer

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It's a big debate within healthcare at the moment. The demographics of many of the patients will preclude email, but a fair amount may be able to handle texts. The trouble is that an appointment letter can sit on a coffee table as a reminder, a text message can be read and forgotten about. You'd be amazed also at how many patients just have a landline number recorded on hospital systems.
Very good points. And presumably a landline is on the records because that was the method the patient chose to give for contact.
 

Peter Mugridge

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All this talk about the NHS and inefficient communication... well... the attached picture shows a letter I received from them recently which sums it all up.

As you can see, the letter is dated three days after the appointment it informs me has been cancelled.

Which is pretty bad in itself, but what is worse is that it was the first I even knew about the appointment existing in the first place...

If the NHS was a business, it would without a shadow of doubt be a prime contender for this thread.
 

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Can somebody confirm what age we start referring to people as elderly these days please?

My parents have been retired for approx 20 years now and my father, in particular, was disappointed at the airport when they decided to print him out a boarding pass rather than using the one on his Google Wallet this summer.

At some point, the only people who aren't "computer literate" will be those who've chosen to make their own lives difficult.

Computers have been common in the workplace for 25+ years now, so assuming retirement at 65, the most likely illiterate people will be 90+, so less than 1% of the population i believe.
It’s not just illiteracy. My father worked with computers, was an early buyer of home computers (both spectrum and PC), but completely lost his ability to use them effectively by his mid-70s, and never “got” mobile phones or tablets.
 

Peter Sarf

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Can somebody confirm what age we start referring to people as elderly these days please?
It is a tricky one to define. It is why I stuck to "older".
My parents have been retired for approx 20 years now and my father, in particular, was disappointed at the airport when they decided to print him out a boarding pass rather than using the one on his Google Wallet this summer.
Good on them. But not everyone is computer literate. Mind you I am not sure what computer literate means - some people are very able to get themselves into an awful mess.
At some point, the only people who aren't "computer literate" will be those who've chosen to make their own lives difficult.
That is very wrong I am afraid to say. Maybe in one or two generations time but not now.

On and off I have helped quite a few people older than me (66) with things requiring a computer.

In some cases a relative/friend has set something up for them and it really is getting them in a mess. It would be easier if the company they dealt with did not have an email address set up for them, or a log-in.

There are other people where there are no keyboard skills at all. Where to begin with teaching them.
It is easier to do it all for them except I am not going to be an omnipresent social worker.

When I think about all the scams people are exposed to I really think a good level of ability is required. Perhaps more ability than many people who can use the internet even have.
Computers have been common in the workplace for 25+ years now, so assuming retirement at 65, the most likely illiterate people will be 90+, so less than 1% of the population i believe.
I can think of a few workplaces I have seen where a computer is not used. Think of all the people who are not sat at a desk job.
A lot of people in the building trade - brick layers, plasterers etc.
In factories most work at the more manual level.
Does a hospital porter use a computer ?.
Does a council refuse worker use a computer ?.
I know of people who prepares food in a kitchen and they and their colleagues do not use a computer (I have been trying to teach one of them).
It's a big debate within healthcare at the moment. The demographics of many of the patients will preclude email, but a fair amount may be able to handle texts. The trouble is that an appointment letter can sit on a coffee table as a reminder, a text message can be read and forgotten about. You'd be amazed also at how many patients just have a landline number recorded on hospital systems.
I would add an email is even less likely to be remembered in someones inbox as it is more obscure than a text or a letter left on the table !.

Personally I put things as reminders on my phone and in my diary as backup !.
All this talk about the NHS and inefficient communication... well... the attached picture shows a letter I received from them recently which sums it all up.

As you can see, the letter is dated three days after the appointment it informs me has been cancelled.

Which is pretty bad in itself, but what is worse is that it was the first I even knew about the appointment existing in the first place...

If the NHS was a business, it would without a shadow of doubt be a prime contender for this thread.
Crickey. That is exactly the one I have been confronted with for someone with reading difficulties.

A letter dated after the date for an appointment saying it is cancelled but that we never knew about.

First person who read it for them ended up believing they had forgotten and missed an appointment.

I just queued up in the phone queue and patiently got to discover when the new appointment was. Which we had to cancel as no one could go with her.

Guess what. a few days after the cancelled appointment she got a letter telling her it was cancelled. I managed to head off the panic that time although some assumed I had mucked up !.

I have seen housing association imposed appointments where the letter arrives just before or just after the appointment. The letter date was only one week before the appointment. One was an annual gas safety check so the landlord could have arranged it months before.

It is a good point you make.
For these near monopolies there is no choice - you cannot walk away and choose a different health service.

Actually, with rumours of how old some NHS computers are and the consequent risk of hacking - I am very concerned about them having more of any ones personal details that is absolutely necessary. One thing I learnt in IT is we are guardians of data and more and more so that data is very valuable to others.
 

johntea

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I work for the NHS and postage is a huge cost which they could certainly do with reducing!

Although there isn’t much choice when more patients than you think don’t provide a mobile number or email address to begin with

The NHS app sort of links with PKB (Patient Knows Best) but again the uptake for that service is poor, I believe there are plans for the NHS to bring it more in house

One area where the pandemic actually had a positive impact as it got huge numbers signing up to the NHS app just so they could prove their vaccination status to businesses at the time, after that usage dropped off a cliff
 

Broucek

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With the NHS, it's not just about communications. It's also about timing. I get sent a "come in at this time" letter. Now, I'm a "laptop" class person so I have more control over my schedule than many working people but I have certain types of meeting that are completely inflexible. So, I have to request a new time which may also not be convenient. The "customer" experience is hopeless but it's also inefficient for the NHS....
 

Bikeman78

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Some NHS Trusts communicate almost exclusively by post, which can be good sometimes, but incredibly inconvenient at other times.

I needed a wisdom tooth out as it was developing at a funny angle which may impact other teeth. The dentist said it really needs to be done under general anesthetic in a hospital, fine. I wait probably 6 months then, while I'm away for Christmas, I get a letter in the post of an appointment with just 3 days notice. Naturally I don't see this letter, and miss the appointment, and then before I even return home (I was only away for 9 days), I get a snide letter about how important it is to attend appointments or reschedule them. Well, NHS, maybe if you'd used the email address or phone number I provided, I'd have been able to inform you that I can't make the appointment.

I respect patients' right to communicate by letter, but to not even offer email as an option in 2025 is pretty ridiculous. It also surely costs that NHS Trust a lot more sending letters out than emails so I'm not even sure it can be argued for as a cost-saving measure.
This is the problem I am having. They received my form late June. Three months later and I'm back to square one. Had they sent an email, I'd have read it two months ago. If they insist on using post, a backup text or email stating "we have sent you a letter" would be useful, as people could then chase after a week or two.

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It is older folk I fear for the most. The ones who are not computer literate are going to get sidelined by how useless Royal Mail are.
Dad is in his 80s. He was fine with technology, until he got dementia. Now he's forgotten passwords for everything. Trying to help him is very hard work. Previously simple every day tasks become almost impossible.

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I was "called in" for a routine test back in May, which happened to coincide with when I was away. So I phoned them up and agreed an earlier date - which the NHS then cancelled the day before. Despite having told them I wasn't available on the original date, they re-booked me for the original date. Well, I'm not going to call you from my holiday because you are incompetent, so I just didn't turn up...
This isn't unique to NHS. I've had a seven month battle with Sky/Openreach regarding a broadband upgrade. They keep arranging appointments for dates when I'm not going to be at home. I click on the link in the text message and change to a suitable date. Then they turn up on the original date and wonder why I'm not there.
 
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Peter Sarf

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This is the problem I am having. They received my form late June. Three months later and I'm back to square one. Had they sent an email, I'd have read it two months ago. If they insist on using post, a backup text or email stating "we have sent you a letter" would be useful, as people could then chase after a week or two.
I try to make sure companies have my mobile number for text that way I know if there is something I do not know.

Trouble is some companies start using the mobile number for marketing. Ever tried stopping EE from sending messages including MMS messages that I have learnt cost me money to open. I feel the same way with email - it is not for them to keep you informed but a marketing opportunity for them.

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Dad is in his 80s. He was fine with technology, until he got dementia. Now he's forgotten passwords for everything. Trying to help him is very hard work. Previously simple every day tasks become almost impossible.
Yes we must remember as people get older they can get less able.
Not to mention all those with disabilities.

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This isn't unique to NHS. I've had a seven month battle with Sky/Openreach regarding a broadband upgrade. They keep arranging appointments for dates when I'm not going to be at home. I click on the link in the text message and change to a suitable date. Then they turn up on the original date and wonder why I'm not there.
This is another example of technology not being fit for purpose. How hard would it be to record you choosing another date and using it to update the booking !. As a retired programmer I despair, been there seen it done it. Seems that as long as it works for the usual cases they are happy to ignore the exceptions - despite it being a valid option in this case.
 

m0ffy

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Cunard. Their newest ship is off to P&O, reducing capacity by about 30% ave drastically increasing fleet age. A sign of their declining position within Carnival UK?
 

Brightonboy

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Cunard. Their newest ship is off to P&O, reducing capacity by about 30% ave drastically increasing fleet age. A sign of their declining position within Carnival UK?
Far from it, I have 2 family members 'inside' Cunard and it is the most profitable element of Carnival UK with future bookings very buoyant. The P&O fleet needs to be updated to keep pace with their market (which isn't the same as the Cunard market).
 

DelW

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BBC reporting that Boots is being sold on by a US private equity outfit (who'd owned it for all of 18 months) to a Canadian private equity outfit. All the usual guff about "investing in the business" and "serving customers with excellence", but will anyone be surprised if they turn out to be another self-interested bunch of asset-strippers?
Boots, the High Street pharmacy and retail chain, has been sold in an $8.9bn (£6.7bn) deal to Canada's billionaire Weston family.

Wittington Investments, the holding company, confirmed it had agreed to buy the 177-year-old retailer on Wednesday from US private equity firm Sycamore Partners and the Pessina family.
 

Tetchytyke

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BBC reporting that Boots is being sold on by a US private equity outfit (who'd owned it for all of 18 months) to a Canadian private equity outfit.
The US private equity fund just wanted Walgreens, so it’s not a surprise they’ve sold Boots on as soon as they canas.

Let’s just hope it finally gets rid of one of Boots’ other owners, who allegedly has some very interesting links to the Neapolitan mafia.
 

BuhSnarf

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The US private equity fund just wanted Walgreens, so it’s not a surprise they’ve sold Boots on as soon as they canas.

Let’s just hope it finally gets rid of one of Boots’ other owners, who allegedly has some very interesting links to the Neapolitan mafia.
Wittington Investments (Weston Family) also own 54% of Associated British Foods (Primark) and Fortnum & Mason (owned since 1951) and Heal's (owned since 2001) as well as in Canada so I'm not sure they're your Modella type of asset strippers.

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Let’s just hope it finally gets rid of one of Boots’ other owners, who allegedly has some very interesting links to the Neapolitan mafia.
I can only picture a Mafia member giving out chocolate, strawberry and vanilla flavoured ice cream :D
 

m0ffy

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Far from it, I have 2 family members 'inside' Cunard and it is the most profitable element of Carnival UK with future bookings very buoyant. The P&O fleet needs to be updated to keep pace with their market (which isn't the same as the Cunard market).
I certainly hope so, but will this trend continue past 2029? QA has only been part of the fleet for two years and seems to enjoy decent load factors. Moving the newest Cunarder to its sister line (which has only recently received new tonnage in Iona and Arvia) somewhat confirms suspicions of P&O being the favourite child, especially now the two lines share a president.
 

Harpo

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Let’s just hope it finally gets rid of one of Boots’ other owners, who allegedly has some very interesting links to the Neapolitan mafia.
Let’s hope Boots doesn’t get burnt to the ground. I’m not fussed about its retail side more its pharmacies, an underfunded part of the UK’s health care operations.

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The P&O fleet needs to be updated to keep pace with their market (which isn't the same as the Cunard market).
Arcadia will leave P&O, moving on to Holland America Line.

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Meanwhile, our local TG Jones was the busiest I’ve ever seen it today. Probably because everything was 70% off.

It was noticeably the elderly forming the huge queue, all loathe to use self service but, in the true Smith/Jones tradition, only one grumbly member of staff was on hand to serve them.
 
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Brightonboy

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QA is not especially popular with the Cunard clientele and its physical style is closer to P&O than Cunard (one of the reasons it's not popular with Cunard customers). Arcadia is one of the older ships so moving her on out of P&O leaves a gap in the P&O fleet which QA can fill. Arcadia is a Vista class vessel; Holland America already have four of them so there is a synergy in that move as well. This is not principally about reducing Cunard, more about homogenising the other fleets.
 

Harpo

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QA is not especially popular with the Cunard clientele and its physical style is closer to P&O than Cunard (one of the reasons it's not popular with Cunard customers). Arcadia is one of the older ships so moving her on out of P&O leaves a gap in the P&O fleet which QA can fill. Arcadia is a Vista class vessel; Holland America already have four of them so there is a synergy in that move as well. This is not principally about reducing Cunard, more about homogenising the other fleets.
Arcadia is also adults only. Another good match for Cunard?
 

GusB

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QA is not especially popular with the Cunard clientele and its physical style is closer to P&O than Cunard (one of the reasons it's not popular with Cunard customers). Arcadia is one of the older ships so moving her on out of P&O leaves a gap in the P&O fleet which QA can fill. Arcadia is a Vista class vessel; Holland America already have four of them so there is a synergy in that move as well. This is not principally about reducing Cunard, more about homogenising the other fleets.
What is QA?
 

m0ffy

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Cunard don’t offer adults only ships afaik.
Maybe they will in future?

Not that the ship is meaningfully different for adult only passengers I don’t think.
I hope not, but nothing would surprise me. Cunard, despite its image as a strictly class-segregated line, is one of the few lines not to follow the trend of “ship within a ship” for premium passengers, and even offers a good number of pet-friendly voyages.

I don’t entirely agree with the assertion that P&O’s clientele are vastly different to Cunard’s. I have sailed with both, and many of the passengers I’ve met on the Queens also happily sail with P&O (albeit preferring the smaller vessels, not Iona and Arvia). P&O seems well setup to cannibalise Cunard, offering a very similar experience to Britannia class, but without the hassle of gratuities or USD as the onboard currency. Cunard differentiate with the soft product - slightly better service and much better entertainment, but we have lost such benefits as included room service.
 

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