Class 68 Progress, what's the latest?

[159220]

Out and about up in Scotland it seems now, looks rather catchy:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/37001/16996739802

Railway Magazine this month reports that the next 68 is due to arrive in October and one of the them shall have the name 'Fearless'!

DRS are still evaluating whether to keep the 68s double headed on Tesco-liners or single, apparently, double headed they are catching up with the Pendolinos!

A very good read to be had, in this months Railway Magazine

 

[XCTurbostar]

Not my video but its the first Scotrail Class 68 Fife Circle service
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1L4mMMA8yAA
Thanks,
Ross

 

[47802]

Is there any actual difference between DRS blue and Scotrail blue? probably a fairly easy job to stick some vinyl's on.

 

[Sunbird24]

Railway Magazine this month reports that the next 68 is due to arrive in October and one of the them shall have the name 'Fearless'!

DRS are still evaluating whether to keep the 68s double headed on Tesco-liners or single, apparently, double headed they are catching up with the Pendolinos!

A very good read to be had, in this months Railway Magazine

Lots of info on 68's, 88's and DRS coaching stock in the April issue, as well as the sell-off of their class 47's. Appears to answer many of the questions and rumours which have been asked here, converting them into hard facts.
68's scheduled for delivery between October 2015 and March 2016 at a rate of 2 per month, followed by the first class 88's which will undergo testing first, so expect to see the remainder in the second half of 2016.
Concurrent with the building of these the factory is also producing Euro 4000's for various customers and Euro Duals for South Africa in addition to trams for several customers.
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Is there any actual difference between DRS blue and Scotrail blue? probably a fairly easy job to stick some vinyl's on.

If you look closely at my avatar you can see 68007 with DRS vynils and 68008 without vynils, to give an idea of the base colour.

 

[Angliarailuser]

Did 68010 Marylebone - Banbury and 68008 Banbury - Marylebone yesterday.

Striking difference between Chiltern Mk3 stock and the AGA stuff we suffer in Anglia on worn out class 90s.

Perhaps Mr Burles and Mr Denby at AGA should have used Chiltern as a template rather than Steptoes?

 

[CosherB]

Did 68010 Marylebone - Banbury and 68008 Banbury - Marylebone yesterday.

Striking difference between Chiltern Mk3 stock and the AGA stuff we suffer in Anglia on worn out class 90s.

Perhaps Mr Burles and Mr Denby at AGA should have used Chiltern as a template rather than Steptoes?

Staying off topic for a bit, the AGA external and internal refurbs for the Mk3 stock are to make them adequate in the medium term, before wholesale replacement. Whether that's 91+Mk4 or EMUs is another debate ....

 

[Angliarailuser]

It is indeed!

Why the hard pressed commuter of Anglia has to suffer 30 year old plus stock whilst the rest of the country gets new trains is beyond us here.

A few plug sockets, free Golden Wonder crisps in "first" class and blocked toilets.

Chiltern are a superb example o thoughful reconditioning.

I would prefer 91s for better acceleration. At least they are newer than the 90s (if inly just)

 

[Rick1984]

Looks good in Scotrail livery

 

[CosherB]

A couple of questions about the Fife Circle stock.

1) Have the ex-Riviera (ex Virgin and ex-Arriva I believe) Mk2s from DRS had an interior refurb to match the very smart new exterior look?
2) Has DB taken back their Mk2s and parked them up with nothing for them to do?

 

[Rick1984]

To be fair, the AGA refurbished Mkiii are quite smart. Would like to see them kept with further improvements including plug doors. Ideal job for class 88's

 

[Rhydgaled]

Staying off topic for a bit, the AGA external and internal refurbs for the Mk3 stock are to make them adequate in the medium term, before wholesale replacement. Whether that's 91+Mk4 or EMUs is another debate ....

If mrk4s are the future for Anglia, I wouldn't expect the traction to be class 91s. 90 + mrk4 I would think more likely, or possibly new locos.

I would prefer 91s for better acceleration. At least they are newer than the 90s (if inly just)

Eh? 91s better acceleration than 90s? What I've read on this forum in the past suggests the opposite for example. That makes sense because the class 91 has a higher top speed and higher top speeds tend to reduce acceleration. 90s are probably a more-appropriate for a line like the GEML, with no linespeeds over 110mph (if that), than 91s.

 

[Angliarailuser]

No problens with 90s as such.

We get everyone elses casts off in Anglia due to Prescott's underfunding of the area. Need to change and we need to stop subsidising the rest of the country.

 

[Class 33]

I hadn't recently really been following what new trains are entering service, etc. But I must say these Class 68's look and sound great! I must plan a day out quite soon to get a nice long journey on them! London Marylebone-Birmingham Moor Street and return! Or maybe the other way round.

 

[Angliarailuser]

Unlike 67s, they do make a decent noise

I was bought up on 55s, 45s and 37s though...

 

[GatwickDepress]

Out and about up in Scotland it seems now, looks rather catchy:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/37001/16996739802

Railway Magazine this month reports that the next 68 is due to arrive in October and one of the them shall have the name 'Fearless'!

DRS are still evaluating whether to keep the 68s double headed on Tesco-liners or single, apparently, double headed they are catching up with the Pendolinos!

A very good read to be had, in this months Railway Magazine

That's an incredibly striking shot. I wonder if the interiors are as handsomely presented as the exterior!

 

[Ellss]

A couple of questions about the Fife Circle stock.

1) Have the ex-Riviera (ex Virgin and ex-Arriva I believe) Mk2s from DRS had an interior refurb to match the very smart new exterior look?
2) Has DB taken back their Mk2s and parked them up with nothing for them to do?

In answer to question 1 - no. Still have the arriva interior.

 

[ac6000cw]

I hadn't recently really been following what new trains are entering service, etc. But I must say these Class 68's look and sound great! I must plan a day out quite soon to get a nice long journey on them! London Marylebone-Birmingham Moor Street and return! Or maybe the other way round.

Had my first rides behind them two days ago (on Chiltern) - very nice machines indeed.

In particular the acceleration is impressive for a loco-hauled train - the Chiltern drivers seem to be making full use of (enjoying ?) the 317kN of starting tractive effort

This gives you an idea of how fast the getaway is - https://youtu.be/ispphmxtH7U - and what they sound like. Certainly my impression on the day was that they were faster accelerating than the 168 DMU sets running the equivalent services.

Re. the Anglia 90s etc. - once the class 88 electrics are delivered, I wonder how long it will be before they hook one up to a GEML Mk3 rake and see how much time can be saved compared to a 90 ? (more power/tractive effort, AC drive so much better wheel-slip control etc.)

 

[Angliarailuser]

If Abellio have to pay cash for the 88s, he 90s willcontinue for a good while to come.

 

[ac6000cw]

If Abellio have to pay cash for the 88s, he 90s willcontinue for a good while to come.

The 90s are leased (with a current end date of Oct 2016, according to the Porterbrook website, to align with the franchise end date).

The idea of replacing them with a UK sized Traxx loco has been floated in the past, so an 88 might be a good 'try-out' at least (it's less powerful than a Traxx, but the starting tractive effort is about the same). And of course the 88 should be type-approved and in service by autumn 2016.

(That said, I'd bet on the 90s+LHCS being replaced by an 'Inter-city' EMU design eventually).

Getting a bit off-topic for this thread though....

 

[Angliarailuser]

True, we will stop this chat now.

Interesting viws on EMU alternative though.

 

[CosherB]

If Abellio have to pay cash for the 88s, he 90s willcontinue for a good while to come.

Staying off topic ....

If AGA want 88's, then they'll have to buy them or lease them ..... both of which cost money! It would also presumably commit AGA to using the Mk3s in the long term, so plug doors etc come back into the mix.

Or just lease new EMU's ....... all of which is discussed elsewhere in great detail.

 

[ac6000cw]

Staying off topic ....

If AGA want 88's, then they'll have to buy them or lease them ..... both of which cost money! It would also presumably commit AGA to using the Mk3s in the long term, so plug doors etc come back into the mix.

Or just lease new EMU's ....... all of which is discussed elsewhere in great detail.

The end of the franchise is only 18 months away, so AGA itself isn't going to do anything - after then it's the DfT and the new franchisee's decision.

All I would say (on the basis of my rides at the weekend) is that Chiltern's rebuilt Mk3's plus 68's both look and perform like a thoroughly new train - a very nice blend of modernised best-of-the-old and new state-of-the-art.

 

[Angliarailuser]

Chiltern's design is excellent.Puts the AGA part refurb into proper context.

 

[CosherB]

Chiltern's design is excellent.Puts the AGA part refurb into proper context.

To be fair, what is generally now considered the 'Chilternisation' of the Mk3's was started by the now defunct Wrexham and Shropshire OAO in 2008 .... although to their credit, they've used it as the model for all of their 'silver sets'.

I don't think AGA would claim that their upgraded Mk3s are to the same standard as Chiltern's, presumably because they won't be using them for as long ..... anyway, well off topic now!

 

[al.currie93]

Had my first rides behind them two days ago (on Chiltern) - very nice machines indeed.

In particular the acceleration is impressive for a loco-hauled train - the Chiltern drivers seem to be making full use of (enjoying ?) the 317kN of starting tractive effort

This gives you an idea of how fast the getaway is - https://youtu.be/ispphmxtH7U - and what they sound like. Certainly my impression on the day was that they were faster accelerating than the 168 DMU sets running the equivalent services.

I had my first rides the other day too, I was also very impressed by the acceleration! I too thought it out-accelerated the 168/2 I got back later, and it definitely out-performed in terms of comfort - a vibrating bin-lid from Banbury to Marylebone caused by engine vibration on the 168 was not pleasant!

68010 leaving with the silver Mk3s at the end of that video really does give a proper idea of the acceleration, and I agree again that those silver Mk3s look brilliant! An example of the best intercity trains around in my opinion - well done Chiltern/DRS!

 

[Sunbird24]

And of course the 88 should be type-approved and in service by autumn 2016.

The first 88 is scheduled for around this time next year and will probably go to Velim for about 3 months of testing, after which any necessary modifications will need to be incorporated into the rest of the fleet. This process starts in the factory during testing at Velim so it is unlikely that more than one other will go for testing in the UK before mid-year when the initial testing at Velim is finished and the first loco returns to the factory to be restored to "as new" condition before delivery 3-4 months later with the last members of the batch. I agree with type approval by Autumn but driver training/familiarisation takes time so my feeling is an in-service date for the full fleet might be more towards the end of the year, or even early 2017.

 

[MainlineD]

In the latest Railways Illustrated, DRS states that Velim is an option, but "there is the possibility it could go to old Dalby for tests, however, thus bypassing the need to go to Velim".

 

[Sunbird24]

There may well be less testing as basically it will be a class 68 with a pantograph and associated circuitry, and a different diesel engine.
Any time now the first Euro Dual should appear. It is basically a Euro 3/4000 with a pantograph and maybe a different diesel engine. What happens to that should give some idea of what may happen with the 88.

 

[Cherry_Picker]

To be fair, what is generally now considered the 'Chilternisation' of the Mk3's was started by the now defunct Wrexham and Shropshire OAO in 2008 .... although to their credit, they've used it as the model for all of their 'silver sets'.

I don't think AGA would claim that their upgraded Mk3s are to the same standard as Chiltern's, presumably because they won't be using them for as long ..... anyway, well off topic now!

True with regards to credit for WSMR for the design of the saloon. The things which Chiltern have added since are the power doors (WSMR sets were all slam door) and the controlled emission tank (CET) toilets. WiFi too I think.

For a while it looked like Chiltern were going to rip out the WSMR interior and refurbish again in the style of a class 168. Still nice, but fewer tables and more airline style seats to increase capacity of a five coach rake. Instead the decision was taken to run six coach rakes with the WSMR design. Not sure why this was taken or indeed if the 168 style refurb was ever in any serious danger of happening but I presume it would be cheaper to upgrade a handful of coaches to WSMR standard and run longer rakes than it would have been to completely gut and refurbish an entire fleet for a relatively small gain in overall capacity.

 

[ac6000cw]

Any time now the first Euro Dual should appear. It is basically a Euro 3/4000 with a pantograph and maybe a different diesel engine.

As far as I remember (the technical data sheet seems to have disappeared from the Vossloh website), they are Caterpillar engines instead of the EMD 710's in the Euro 4000, presumably to save space and weight.