Class 508 numbering and formation question

[43096]

And here is a PEP in experimental NSE livery

Sorry, but where is the evidence that this is a “prototype NSE livery”?

There are photos elsewhere of this unit in this livery back in 1979/80 (e.g. https://www.bloodandcustard.com/BR-4PEP.html) with repainting quoted in 1978. As the business sectors didn’t exist until 1981/2 and NSE wasn’t created until 1986, this cannot be a prototype NSE livery. More likely - as quoted in the link - is the scheme was derived from the APT-P livery.

 

[Dr_Paul]

I remember seeing the 4-PEP units in the all-over blue and the 2-PEP unpainted unit, but I don't think I saw any in the multicolour scheme. That might be because in 1985-87 I rarely commuted to work via Clapham Junction. I have a feeling that one had to make the doors start opening by pushing on the door handle, but this was changed to the more normal press-button as it was awkward to work. Can anyone confirm this?

 

[Big Jumby 74]

I remember seeing the 4-PEP units in the all-over blue

That is my memory of 4001/2 when working on the SWD, as said above, my last ride on same was on a dark/wet night in Nov 76. My abiding memory being all the windows being completely steamed up, so one had to know where you were to alight, or stand by a door and open same at every station (unless one was a regular commuter) which I wasn't at the time.
That said, I now wish I'd taken more interest in them in my career days, but one's job came first as far as I was concerned.

As regard door operation, I am struggling to think of anyone else from those days, whom I still know/is still with us, but will ask around, but don't hold your breath!

 

[WesternLancer]

That is my memory of 4001/2 when working on the SWD, as said above, my last ride on same was on a dark/wet night in Nov 76. My abiding memory being all the windows being completely steamed up, so one had to know where you were to alight, or stand by a door and open same at every station (unless one was a regular commuter) which I wasn't at the time.
That said, I now wish I'd taken more interest in them in my career days, but one's job came first as far as I was concerned.

As regard door operation, I am struggling to think of anyone else from those days, whom I still know/is still with us, but will ask around, but don't hold your breath!

I’ve read it on here I think about the door opening mechs. Maybe on the production units or 313s. And them having to be changed.

Not sure when thread was though

 

[nw1]

A bit of info on the PEPs that might be of interest:

I have the 1977 peak hour Waterloo CWN kindly sent to me by another forum member and it reveals that the 1609 Hampton Court-Waterloo due 1649, and subsequently the 1704 Waterloo-Shepperton were formed 8PEP.

As for 508s on the South Western I do recall them running all Hampton Court services in four-car formation (they were self-contained diagrams) on a couple of Saturdays in May 1983 (either side of the timetable change, I think). I have the 1981 and 1982 CWNs and the suburbans are a motley collection of EPBs, SUBs and 508s, with many routes seeing all three.

 

[KevinTurvey]

I distantly recall when they first came up north, some of the 508 middle cars had 2+2 seating of the original low back green type, giving a very cavernous interior. Can anybody confirm please and how many units had these?

 

[Big Jumby 74]

I distantly recall when they first came up north, some of the 508 middle cars had 2+2 seating of the original low back green type, giving a very cavernous interior

According to the 1985 Platform 5 combined volume, the following trailers seated 82 instead of the 86 as originally fitted;

508101, 105, 107-110, 113, 115-119, 121-130, 132, 133, 135,137, 139-143. In the next such platform 5 book I have (1993) it would appear all the remaining 508 trailers on the (Merseyrail*) units were modified as such.

This would have been achieved by removing the four aisle seats from the two blocks of 3 aside seats in the centre of the trailers.

* to differentiate from the 508 trailers that remained on the South Western.

EDIT: I rode on several of the 508's in their first years on Merseyside, but can't remember the seating layout or if they still had their original interior colours?

This I took in a DM facing the trailer cars when brand new and unused at East Wimbledon in Feb 1980.

 

[KevinTurvey]

EDIT: I rode on several of the 508's in their first years on Merseyside, but can't remember the seating layout or if they still had their original interior colours?

This I took in a DM facing the trailer cars when brand new and unused at East Wimbledon in Feb 1980.

Thank you - the seat colours are as I remember them, but the seat base themselves I think were replaced with the same colour as the backs quite early on, as plenty were thrown out of the windows before CCTV. - I presume they eventually found a better fixing method. Later on they were recovered with a more yellow check pattern before full replacement with a high back seat.

 

[Big Jumby 74]

Later on they were recovered with a more yellow check pattern

That sort of rings bells. Were the 507's treated the same?

 

[Pigeon]

I would have thought the roof mounted equipment looked somehow 'futuristic'.

Nope. Just looked like every bus, and made it obvious where they'd nicked the design from.

 

[WesternLancer]

Nope. Just looked like every bus, and made it obvious where they'd nicked the design from.

Looked futuristic to me I mean!

I would not have given any bus a second glance