Class 458/5

[swt_passenger]

It's more traditional for marking reservations, but the sort of SDO related announcements they make on Southern wouldn't really work with letters.

"This is coach 7 of 12", or "this is coach G of L"? I know which I'd understand quickest...

 

[user15681]

Let's hope no sod nicks the cards or swaps them all round as a joke.

 

[Class377/5]

It's more traditional for marking reservations, but the sort of SDO related announcements they make on Southern wouldn't really work with letters.

"This is coach 7 of 12", or "this is coach G of L"? I know which I'd understand quickest...

Not to mention the carriages get turned around and go from first unit to second unit mean its not actually workable on Southern.

 

[Goldfish62]

Let's just hope the PA system has been upgraded as the one currently in the 458s is as useful as a chocolate teapot.

 

[WarrenTManager]

Is there a way to tell a cab is one of the ex-luggage vans? Are the cabs in today's set(s) both/all 'standard' (non luggage coach) vehicles?

Vehicle number will be 6790x

Both driving vehicles in units 532 and 536 are ex-luggage vans hence the last two units to appear from the 460 conversions....

 

[bb21]

Why do they even need coach letters? Are the trains intended to be reservable?

I agree that it would be much better to do it the Southern way with 377s and number them when needed through the PIS so that they are much easier to understand.

 

[transmanche]

Let's just hope the PA system has been upgraded as the one currently in the 458s is as useful as a chocolate teapot.

"The door buttons are now activated." I've never seen the need for that bit of audio graffiti - seeing as it follows the beeep, beeep, beeeeeeeeeep sound of the door buttons activating...

 

[Monty]

Let's just hope the PA system has been upgraded as the one currently in the 458s is as useful as a chocolate teapot.

The PIS/PA system is largely unchanged, the only real difference is the voice which is now the SWT standard 'Digital Doris' found on the rest of the Company's fleet.

Why do they even need coach letters? Are the trains intended to be reservable?

I agree that it would be much better to do it the Southern way with 377s and number them when needed through the PIS so that they are much easier to understand.

The letters are for passengers to be aware of what coach they need to be in for SDO stops, as mentioned above the PIS is still more or less the same basic system found in the 458/0s and is currently not able to warn passengers of about SDO stops or even display what coach passengers are travelling in. It will be all down to the guard to make regular manual announcements to keep passengers informed so I urge anyone travelling on them to listen out for the guard make a note of what coach you are in.

I have been told in the long term the PIS may be completely replaced as the current system is not capable of being upgraded to extent of the ones found in Desiros and Electrostars. But it's far from being a dead cert.

 

[David Goddard]

"The door buttons are now activated." I've never seen the need for that bit of audio graffiti - seeing as it follows the beeep, beeep, beeeeeeeeeep sound of the door buttons activating...

Normally once everyone has already alighted, so once the intended user of this announcement has heard it the hustler alarm has started and the doros close again.........

 

[Goldfish62]

The PIS/PA system is largely unchanged, the only real difference is the voice which is now the SWT standard 'Digital Doris' found on the rest of the Company's fleet

I was meaning the manual PA, where the guard has to wait ages after activating it before being able speak, and often it doesn't work at all. Not ideal when the guard needs to make manual announcements about short platforms.

 

[Monty]

I was meaning the manual PA, where the guard has to wait ages after activating it before being able speak, and often it doesn't work at all. Not ideal when the guard needs to make manual announcements about short platforms.

Ah, in that case the answer is also no.

 

[samuelmorris]

Would these units be likely to suffer the same bug as the Desiro displays whereby there's a huge gap after Staines in the destination list?
There's one other destination that has that problem on the main line, but I can't remember which one it was.

 

[randompixel]

I'm on the 458/5. It smells all new chemically!

Things to note. The door buzzer is quieter than a 458/0, the PA is louder.

The guard announced the doors at this end wouldn't open in coaches a and b at Feltham and no bings were heard.

The train overhangs onto the level crossing at Feltham somewhat.

The PIS screens on the platforms still showed (and were announced as) 8 coaches.

There have been no automated announcements. 100% guard intercom.

 

[Monty]

The hustle alarms on them are unchanged from the old Gatwick units, I also imagine it's the same for the PA.

 

[randompixel]

Still the odd seat left after Twickenham!!!!

Only 2 people standing by the doors at Putney!!!!

 

[randompixel]

One final picture. The guard had a cap on which for some reason makes me happy!

 

[Monty]

Ah so you were the chap taking the photo at Clapham.

 

[randompixel]

Ah so you were the chap taking the photo at Clapham.

Haha. Indeed. I'm excited for a less crowded commute!

Was it you being guard Monty? Or just a traveller on it?

 

[user15681]

Just been on the pair and they've turned out pretty good I must say. The traction motors are virtually silent inside the trains. All you can hear is (I presume) the air con whirling. The braking sounds very much like 375/377 braking, with the high pitched squeal when the brakes are applied.. The ride quality is pretty good too, very smooth and comfortable. Everything is clean and well layed out, as you'd expect from a refurb. My only issue was that the litter bins weren't immediately evident and the holes to put rubbish in are very small (this may just be becausr I'm used to different). Guard made pretty much all announcements on board and I could see the SDO announcements getting confusing for some.

On the whole though, they've turned out very nicely.

 

[Monty]

Haha. Indeed. I'm excited for a less crowded commute!

Was it you being guard Monty? Or just a traveller on it?

No I was just passing on that one, took it back out though.

 

[TEW]

Just had a trip to Windsor on the units. Surprised not to see any other enthusiasts out but appeared to be plenty of SWT staff out for the ride. For the return trip the station CIS was correctly set up showing the service as formed of 10 coaches and giving correct short platform information. A question for the guards/drivers on here; are passengers allowed to use the inter-unit gangway. My first impression was that you couldn't but upon investigation I found that the doors into the gangway area weren't locked but they were rather heavy to push.

 

[Goldfish62]

Just had a trip to Windsor on the units. Surprised not to see any other enthusiasts out but appeared to be plenty of SWT staff out for the ride. For the return trip the station CIS was correctly set up showing the service as formed of 10 coaches and giving correct short platform information. A question for the guards/drivers on here; are passengers allowed to use the inter-unit gangway. My first impression was that you couldn't but upon investigation I found that the doors into the gangway area weren't locked but they were rather heavy to push.

They can be used, hence why proper gangways have been fitted. However, with most people being used to the locked ones on the 458/0s and these ones looking no different my guess is that they'll see little use and will eventually be locked...

PS - I'm not staff - just answering based on what's been published.

 

[TEW]

I've uploaded a few photos of the units today on flickr.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/connernolan/

 

[swt_passenger]

Latest BBC article:

South West Trains said two extra coaches on each of its 14 daily services would add 460 extra spaces for standing and seated commuters.

The number of passengers using stations on the branch has doubled in the last 15 years, Office for Rail Regulation (ORR) estimates show.

A further 98 carriages on the line will be added over the next 12 months.
etc, etc...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-26515235

What are they on about?

 

[455driver]

Well one way of looking at is if 9 trains have an extra coach inserted in them and those trains do 10 trips a day that is 90 extra coaches a day.

 

[SansPareil]

Latest BBC article:

Quote:
South West Trains said two extra coaches on each of its 14 daily services would add 460 extra spaces for standing and seated commuters.

The number of passengers using stations on the branch has doubled in the last 15 years, Office for Rail Regulation (ORR) estimates show.

A further 98 carriages on the line will be added over the next 12 months.
etc, etc...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-26515235
What are they on about?

I imagine they are taking into account the forthcoming extra coaches for the 458/5s and the 456s that will be coming into service as well.

 

[David Goddard]

98 coaches makes sense, the bit about "on the line" doesn't:

New stock coming in to SWT comprises 60 ex Cl460 vehicles, plus 48 Cl456 vehicles (108)

These ten are now in service, so leaving 98 more to come.

 

[swt_passenger]

Perhaps what they mean is that particular 10 car train is doing 14 single trips (7 return) on the Windsor route. So are they saying each trip provides only 460/14 or 36 'extra spaces' - presumably compared to an 8 car 450? So do they really mean a capacity increase of only 36 per single trip? Conversely, if the number of seats in a 458/5 is about the same as a 458/0 or a 450 (HC) - do we really only get 36 extra standing spaces per trip?

Something doesn't add up...

--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

98 coaches makes sense, the bit about "on the line" doesn't:

New stock coming in to SWT comprises 60 ex Cl460 vehicles, plus 48 Cl456 vehicles (108)

These ten are now in service, so leaving 98 more to come.

That's the same conclusion I came to. The 98 more coaches is certainly over the entire SWT network...

 

[3141]

My guess is that somewhere in the information provided to journalists the figure 460 referred to the class of train from which the extra coaches have been obtained, and that someone turned that figure into the additional spaces being provided.

 

[Techniquest]

Surprised not to see any other enthusiasts out but appeared to be plenty of SWT staff out for the ride.

I was on a Southern-only ticket and had wayyyyy more stuff to do than take a ride on a 458/5. Not in a massive rush anyway, I'll be scooping them like nobody's business on a future Travelcard bash!