Class 387

[387star]

When are the c2c 387s expected to be in service?

they will go down well I think given the tables a first for C2C

 

[RobShipway]

Through trains from the Thames Valley branches were definitely due to cease in May 2017, it was explicitly stated in the GW direct award stakeholder brief.

One puzzling statement is that the stakeholder brief also says that on commencement of Crossrail to Heathrow in May 2018, (i.e. the 4 tph replacing Connect) then the Paddington to Hayes service will cease. But it won't be a Paddington to Hayes service by then, it will be at very least a Paddington to Maidenhead, probably Reading or further. I guess what it might mean is that it will no longer call at most stations between Hayes and Paddington, and will be modified into more of a semi fast service at that time.

When it is stating the Paddington to Hayes services, surely it is stating about the Heathrow Connect service which is scheduled as Paddington - hayes service even though it goes on to Heathrow.

I cannot find any recent route map update other than http://www.avocetline.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/October-2015-GWR-Franchise-Update-MK3.pdf which states the following within it:

• By May 2017 we plan to have fully deployed our fleet
of EMUs in the Thames Valley (Class 387 and 365),
albeit branch line electrification will still be in hand
• Through trains to London from Thames Valley
branches will cease (Greenford, Henley and Marlow/
Bourne End), and there will be a reduction in
Bedwyn/Kintbury/Hungerford through services
• EMUs will replace peak service HSTs on the
Paddington-Oxford route
• Changes to Frome-Paddington, Paddington to Bristol
via Newbury and Paddington to Frome services

It does not state that the stopping services from say Reading to London Paddington will cease when Crossrail starts.

The only possible comments that I can see about Thames Valley services is the following:

• Through services to and from London will cease, with
connections into/out of fast peak trains between
Maidenhead and Paddington.

May 2018
• At this point the Heathrow Connect and additional
Hayes & Harlington services will cease and be
operated by Crossrail. The GWR EMUs will be redployed to add strengthening capacity.

Given the above, there will still be fast services from Reading stopping at say Slough to London Paddington with other stops, it is just that all the GWR trains that stop currently at Maidenhead will change to be Crossrail services as there are 4tph Crossrail services that will start from Maidenhead with 2tph Crossrail services starting from Reading.

 

[MatthewRead]

When it is stating the Paddington to Hayes services, surely it is stating about the Heathrow Connect service which is scheduled as Paddington - hayes service even though it goes on to Heathrow.

I cannot find any recent route map update other than http://www.avocetline.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/October-2015-GWR-Franchise-Update-MK3.pdf which states the following within it:

• By May 2017 we plan to have fully deployed our fleet
of EMUs in the Thames Valley (Class 387 and 365),
albeit branch line electrification will still be in hand
• Through trains to London from Thames Valley
branches will cease (Greenford, Henley and Marlow/
Bourne End), and there will be a reduction in
Bedwyn/Kintbury/Hungerford through services
• EMUs will replace peak service HSTs on the
Paddington-Oxford route
• Changes to Frome-Paddington, Paddington to Bristol
via Newbury and Paddington to Frome services

It does not state that the stopping services from say Reading to London Paddington will cease when Crossrail starts.

The only possible comments that I can see about Thames Valley services is the following:

• Through services to and from London will cease, with
connections into/out of fast peak trains between
Maidenhead and Paddington.

May 2018
• At this point the Heathrow Connect and additional
Hayes & Harlington services will cease and be
operated by Crossrail. The GWR EMUs will be redployed to add strengthening capacity.

Given the above, there will still be fast services from Reading stopping at say Slough to London Paddington with other stops, it is just that all the GWR trains that stop currently at Maidenhead will change to be Crossrail services as there are 4tph Crossrail services that will start from Maidenhead with 2tph Crossrail services starting from Reading.

Wish GWR would use 365's there's still no home for the ones coming off GTR

 

[swt_passenger]

Wish GWR would use 365's there's still no home for the ones coming off GTR

Give up on this. The reasons for using a unified fleet of 387s are obvious and have been given a number of times before.

 

[Clarence Yard]

That stakeholder brief is now so out of date as to be fairly useless. I will be having words tomorrow with the relevant people as its getting embarrassing.

The problem with updating it soon is knowing when the infrastructure is actually going to be ready. Even the Hendy dates are now in doubt.

But when Crossrail does start it's full service (which looks likely to be on time) GWR relief line services will then be only the 2TPH slow Oxfords.

Until Oxford is electrified the fasts will remain diesel (or bi) and the 387's on the slow Oxfords will term at Didcot, with a turbo shuttle forward.

 

[swt_passenger]

When it is stating the Paddington to Hayes services, surely it is stating about the Heathrow Connect service which is scheduled as Paddington - Hayes service even though it goes on to Heathrow.

[....]

May 2018
• At this point the Heathrow Connect AND additional
Hayes & Harlington services will cease and be
operated by Crossrail. The GWR EMUs will be redployed to add strengthening capacity.

You've quoted exactly what I was describing. The use of "and" as I've highlighted means to me the Connect service and the new Hayes service are two separate services.

--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

That stakeholder brief is now so out of date as to be fairly useless. I will be having words tomorrow with the relevant people as its getting embarrassing.

To be fair I don't think it is available in any online GWR resource. The only reason I can quote it is because I downloaded it at the time; and I do appreciate the dates are all wrong, however it is better than nothing in attempting to work out what the intentions were at that time.

 

[RobShipway]

Give up on this. The reasons for using a unified fleet of 387s are obvious and have been given a number of times before.

I have to agree with you on this as the class 387's can be adapted just like the class 379's to be IPEMU trains with batteries fitted to operate off any electrical power.

With regards the stakeholder brief I could not find anything newer online as I stated in my previous post and as Clarence Yard has stated something new needs to be online which is more accurate, even if there is no sight as to when the infrastructure will be ready. For instance, taking out the details of using class 365's as we now know that it will be an all unified fleet of class 387's.

Also, the document does not show the purchasing of the class 802 fleet as far as I can see to replace the remaining HST trains.

 

[Domh245]

I have to agree with you on this as the class 387's can be adapted just like the class 379's to be IPEMU trains with batteries fitted to operate off any electrical power.

You really are obsessed with these IPEMUs aren't you! Any electrostar should be able to be modified for batteries (although every installation will be bespoke). But there is no need for the GW franchise to use IPEMUs beyond their already ordered IEPs and 802s

 

[RobShipway]

You really are obsessed with these IPEMUs aren't you! Any electrostar should be able to be modified for batteries (although every installation will be bespoke). But there is no need for the GW franchise to use IPEMUs beyond their already ordered IEPs and 802s

Just a little obsessed as I think that the use IPEMU's would be better to be used on the Reading - Redhill/Gatwick services than to continue to be using a small fleet of class 166 trains which could either be used on routes in the West Country or Portsmouth - Cardiff trains.

 

[D365]

You really are obsessed with these IPEMUs aren't you!

If you think he's obsessed, have you seen the Anonymous Widower blog?!

 

[MatthewRead]

This is why the Railways should be put back in public ownership then we wouldn't have these problems regarding redundant rolling stock!

 

[Class377/5]

This is why the Railways should be put back in public ownership then we wouldn't have these problems regarding redundant rolling stock!

Ah yes the magic nationalisation wand that fixes every single problem.

 

[TheKnightWho]

This is why the Railways should be put back in public ownership then we wouldn't have these problems regarding redundant rolling stock!

But rolling stock procurements are decided centrally...

 

[GodAtum]

When it is stating the Paddington to Hayes services, surely it is stating about the Heathrow Connect service which is scheduled as Paddington - hayes service even though it goes on to Heathrow.

I cannot find any recent route map update other than http://www.avocetline.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/October-2015-GWR-Franchise-Update-MK3.pdf which states the following within it:

• By May 2017 we plan to have fully deployed our fleet
of EMUs in the Thames Valley (Class 387 and 365),
albeit branch line electrification will still be in hand
• Through trains to London from Thames Valley
branches will cease (Greenford, Henley and Marlow/
Bourne End), and there will be a reduction in
Bedwyn/Kintbury/Hungerford through services
• EMUs will replace peak service HSTs on the
Paddington-Oxford route
• Changes to Frome-Paddington, Paddington to Bristol
via Newbury and Paddington to Frome services

It does not state that the stopping services from say Reading to London Paddington will cease when Crossrail starts.

The only possible comments that I can see about Thames Valley services is the following:

• Through services to and from London will cease, with
connections into/out of fast peak trains between
Maidenhead and Paddington.

May 2018
• At this point the Heathrow Connect and additional
Hayes & Harlington services will cease and be
operated by Crossrail. The GWR EMUs will be redployed to add strengthening capacity.

Given the above, there will still be fast services from Reading stopping at say Slough to London Paddington with other stops, it is just that all the GWR trains that stop currently at Maidenhead will change to be Crossrail services as there are 4tph Crossrail services that will start from Maidenhead with 2tph Crossrail services starting from Reading.

Will this affect any services and connections from Marlow to London?

 

[RobShipway]

Will this affect any services and connections from Marlow to London?

Yes, there will be no direct services from Marlow to London as mentioned in the details that I provided. Theer will also be no direct trains to London from Henley-On-Thames and Greenford from May 2017.

 

[JN114]

Yes, there will be no direct services from Marlow to London as mentioned in the details that I provided. Theer will also be no direct trains to London from Henley-On-Thames and Greenford from May 2017.

There isn't a direct Marlow to London service now... Marlow customers' 1 change to London in the peaks shifts from being one change at Bourne End to one change at Maidenhead. There is a thread regarding this in infrastructure sub-forum.

 

[spark001uk]

There isn't a direct Marlow to London service now... Marlow customers' 1 change to London in the peaks shifts from being one change at Bourne End to one change at Maidenhead. There is a thread regarding this in infrastructure sub-forum.

Funny enough I was just on that earlier, 1642 PAD-BNE. Then there's a shuttle on the other platform to Marlow.

 

[urpert]

Funny enough I was just on that earlier, 1642 PAD-BNE. Then there's a shuttle on the other platform to Marlow.

I used to live in Bourne End and always found the unique operation of the branch at peak times fascinating and delightful. And those are not words often associated with the Thames Trains era.

 

[387star]

Thames link are using a triplet of gx units to London Bridge today how confusing

 

[spark001uk]

Thames link are using a triplet of gx units to London Bridge today how confusing

I haven't been in those as yet, I'm guessing they're just like a normal 387 inside?

 

[387star]

I haven't been in those as yet, I'm guessing they're just like a normal 387 inside?

Identical except red seats which have a pattern on in standard and are plain red in first except priority seats which are grey . The whole first class section is in use unlike tl units

The grab handles and luggage strips are blue instead of green

Flooring is identical through to the southern spec lino around the toilet etc
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Any gen as to why three times gx rakes are on the tl Brighton today ? Is an event on or shortage of stock

 

[Class377/5]

Nothing to do with a shortage of stock. Victoria is blocked so Thameslink is using 2x 12 car 387/2 to run the London Bridge service to help capacity keep up with demand.

This makes Thameslink a mainly 12 car railways with some 8 car workings. Southern cannot use the 387s as most of the drivers don't sign them so it's a clever way to increase capacity with the stock available. Remember TL drivers can use the stock to call all stations DOO, Southern/GatEx drivers cannot.

 

[tsr]

Southern cannot use the 387s as most of the drivers don't sign them so it's a clever way to increase capacity with the stock available. Remember TL drivers can use the stock to call all stations DOO, Southern/GatEx drivers cannot.

The DOO issues are a bit of a red herring as Southern conductors are all permitted to work 387s on the BML anyway (with a couple of marginal partial route knowledge exceptions) and then you'd also have someone on board to provide customer assistance due to diversions too. (Really quite important, as I can tell you from personal experience of working on the last weekend that Selhurst-Balham was closed.)

 

[387star]

Nothing to do with a shortage of stock. Victoria is blocked so Thameslink is using 2x 12 car 387/2 to run the London Bridge service to help capacity keep up with demand.

This makes Thameslink a mainly 12 car railways with some 8 car workings. Southern cannot use the 387s as most of the drivers don't sign them so it's a clever way to increase capacity with the stock available. Remember TL drivers can use the stock to call all stations DOO, Southern/GatEx drivers cannot.

Thanks explains that One

I do like the 387 they have a lot to offer them and though the seats are hard I am getting used to them

Power points great leg room spacious and lots of tables

 

[RobShipway]

I was hoping that the 4 GWR class 387's would be doing services to Hayes and Harlington today, but it seems that they have been stored for the day within North Pole depot. Iam presuming that they only operate Monday to Friday on services?

 

[E_Reeves]

I was hoping that the 4 GWR class 387's would be doing services to Hayes and Harlington today, but it seems that they have been stored for the day within North Pole depot. Iam presuming that they only operate Monday to Friday on services?

If they are at North Pole Depot, are they visible from the outside?

 

[RobShipway]

If they are at North Pole Depot, are they visible from the outside?

Yes, there are visible from the GWML line as you pass North Pole depot on a train.

Sorry that the photo is not very clear, but I think it shows what I mean that the class 387's can be seen:

 

[E_Reeves]

Yes, there are visible from the GWML line as you pass North Pole depot on a train.

Good. Hope they're there next weekend.

 

[JN114]

I was hoping that the 4 GWR class 387's would be doing services to Hayes and Harlington today, but it seems that they have been stored for the day within North Pole depot. Iam presuming that they only operate Monday to Friday on services?

Monday to Friday peak only - they're the only Padd - Hayes services anyway so should stick out like a sore thumb.

 

[spark001uk]

Monday to Friday peak only - they're the only Padd - Hayes services anyway so should stick out like a sore thumb.

Oh I dunno, I'd say a green gwr hst set with blue pc's and two blue sets with a gwr pc at one end does a better job of that!