Class 313 replacement

[SpacePhoenix]

Not on Southeastern rural routes. The networkers are now 25 years old with barely any work done (the light refresh a few years ago did very little) and look very scruffy. I doubt a 313 would see much in the way of complaints.

What about the new traction motors (and package) they've all (or most) have received?

If either SWT or Southern gave up some of their 455s the other would possibly want them to strengthen services

 

[Domh245]

What about the new traction motors (and package) they've all (or most) have received?

If either SWT or Southern gave up some of their 455s the other would possibly want them to strengthen services

Regarding the networker retractioning, it was more of a "some" than a most which received the hitachi package.

If Southern gave up their 455s, there may be some interest from SWT, but there'd need to be a fairly significant rebuild, at the front, and throughout the train, but it'd depend on when they are released, as they will probably be coming up for end-of-life, so it'd be debatable as to whether or not to refurbish them. You'd also have to remember that the 707s would start to be coming into play, which should allow them to do their plans with the current number of 455s.

If SWT gave up their 455s, I doubt there'd be much interest from Thameslink (as it would then be), as they are reducing the number of 455s they are using in service as part of their agreement.

I'd think that any released 455s may end up with south-eastern, who seem to be a bit short on stock at the moment.

 

[Class377/5]

Can you clarify? The "consultation" document explicitly states that trains detach and they are certainly shown in the draft timetable as hanging around Haywards Heath for long enough. Have plans changed?

I can't find where the consultation states that. My understanding is they stop spilting.

 

[ScotGG]

What about the new traction motors (and package) they've all (or most) have received?

If either SWT or Southern gave up some of their 455s the other would possibly want them to strengthen services

The person was commenting on the internal ambiance I believe and how any new area they go to would see complants. Not much in it between networkers & 313s so I very much doubt it.

 

[Fincra5]

442 will be chucked of GatEx services and take over Eastbourne services which come December are no longer splitters. Not sure why you think they need to run to London Bridge. December 2015 is pretty much the December 2018 timetable introduced several years early with Thameslink services already for when London Bridge opens. Detailed writing now underway.



The 455 fleet will be kept in the same numbers as now but used less as they will be expected to be less reliable than now. How you think a fleet less used is creating a mirco fleet....?

Ah I didn't realise the splitters were going, as soon as Decemeber. I was just looking at the current Peak LBG services.

 

[Class377/5]

Ah I didn't realise the splitters were going, as soon as Decemeber. I was just looking at the current Peak LBG services.

December is a complete rewrite of the timetable. Will be interesting to see the final thing as the Thameslink Brighton to Bedford services will be made all stations ray rather semi fast now leaving them without a direct London Bridge service.

But this is really going of topic now.

 

[Wolfie]

Regarding the networker retractioning, it was more of a "some" than a most which received the hitachi package.

If Southern gave up their 455s, there may be some interest from SWT, but there'd need to be a fairly significant rebuild, at the front, and throughout the train, but it'd depend on when they are released, as they will probably be coming up for end-of-life, so it'd be debatable as to whether or not to refurbish them. You'd also have to remember that the 707s would start to be coming into play, which should allow them to do their plans with the current number of 455s.

If SWT gave up their 455s, I doubt there'd be much interest from Thameslink (as it would then be), as they are reducing the number of 455s they are using in service as part of their agreement.

I'd think that any released 455s may end up with south-eastern, who seem to be a bit short on stock at the moment.

my bold

While I agree, and that was the intent of my suggestion, there is at least one plausible alternative. Perhaps SWT could get more 455s and thus release some 450s to LM (with panto fitted). That might free some 323s to go north....

 

[Hophead]

December is a complete rewrite of the timetable. Will be interesting to see the final thing as the Thameslink Brighton to Bedford services will be made all stations ray rather semi fast now leaving them without a direct London Bridge service.

But this is really going of topic now.

Quick - before the mods arrive....

"The new faster train (the first train to leave Haywards Heath after detachment) will call at Hove,...." - from page 11.

 

[Class377/5]

Quick - before the mods arrive....

"The new faster train (the first train to leave Haywards Heath after detachment) will call at Hove,...." - from page 11.

That's West Coastway. Different to East Coastway. Especially when same document talks about Spilt for two trains via Hove route.

 

[A0]

my bold

While I agree, and that was the intent of my suggestion, there is at least one plausible alternative. Perhaps SWT could get more 455s and thus release some 450s to LM (with panto fitted). That might free some 323s to go north....

Aren't some of the platforms in the West Mids which the 323s serve only 6 car length? Which is why LM haven't sought to replace the 323s in the West Mids with all 350s or have I misunderstood?

 

[jopsuk]

To fit an 8-car 350 on a 6-car 323 platform you're only need to extend the platform by ~20m

 

[A0]

To fit an 8-car 350 on a 6-car 323 platform you're only need to extend the platform by ~20m

That's as maybe - but you still need to plan the extension of all the platforms which aren't long enough - and then do the work - both involve time & cost.

So unless there's a plan to extend all the platforms in the West Mids electrified area to 8 car - I don't forsee LM agreeing to release 323s in place of 350s.

 

[40129]

Even if all the platforms could take 8-car cl-350s, they would be no good on the Cross City due to the close proximity of stations. Cl-350s are noticeably slower from a standing start than cl-323s and whilst this hasn't been a major problem on WSL-WVH (stations are further apart) it would likely cause problems of the Cross City. Also, I'm pretty sure that Cl-350 doors are slower to open than cl-323

 

[deltic08]

Even if all the platforms could take 8-car cl-350s, they would be no good on the Cross City due to the close proximity of stations. Cl-350s are noticeably slower from a standing start than cl-323s and whilst this hasn't been a major problem on WSL-WVH (stations are further apart) it would likely cause problems of the Cross City. Also, I'm pretty sure that Cl-350 doors are slower to open than cl-323

If the 323s are as good as everybody says they are, dust off the plans and reopen a factory somewhere.

 

[40129]

Not saying the cl-323s are brilliant. Just that they are better suited to short stop routes such as the Cross City than cl-350s. However, wouldn't fancy a cl-323 from CRE-EUS - horses for courses!

 

[Class377/5]

Or just buy new Desiro Cities which are faster at moving off than the Desiro UK design. And come in three car versions and can be built in 23m versions like the 380s.