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Class 175s to GWR

Cletus

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Something wrong with the 1242. We’ve been switched to platform 4 at short notice. The 150 sitting in the bay is being switched to us.

Needed 175709 but couldn’t have got on it anyway because the doors weren’t opening at Saltash.
 
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fgwrich

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Something that occurred to me last night was this. With the growing traffic in Cornwall (we’re only a handful of weeks away from Easter after all), could some of the 3 cars find temporary use allowing a 2 car to head up to Exeter and Barnstaple / Okehampton for training and clearance purposes?

And will the 175s see clearance along the Mule to continue the Barnstaple - Axminster services as well?
 

DelW

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Something that occurred to me last night was this. With the growing traffic in Cornwall (we’re only a handful of weeks away from Easter after all), could some of the 3 cars find temporary use allowing a 2 car to head up to Exeter and Barnstaple / Okehampton for training and clearance purposes?
School holidays (in my area at least) start in under a week. Families will be starting their holidays in one week's time. With the Castle sets gone, the Sprinters spread thinly, and the tiny number of 175s available (see post 2638), what is the GWR service in Devon and Cornwall going to be like? I'd suggest that anyone without a car will be unwise to take an Easter holiday in the west country this year.
 

northernbelle

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Something that occurred to me last night was this. With the growing traffic in Cornwall (we’re only a handful of weeks away from Easter after all), could some of the 3 cars find temporary use allowing a 2 car to head up to Exeter and Barnstaple / Okehampton for training and clearance purposes?

And will the 175s see clearance along the Mule to continue the Barnstaple - Axminster services as well?
It is planned to clear them from Exeter St Davids to Yeovil Pen Mill, yes. Yeovil PM to Castle Cary is already cleared as a legacy of Class 180 clearance works in the early 2000s, although I'm not sure why.
 

Cheers Drive

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Thanks for the reply. You mention that the train crew had to reach to get to it and in all of the carriage too, I`m trying to think what they might have to reach for in the whole carriage to arm the doors. Was this within the saloon or in each vestibule ?
This was by the doors in the vestibule just seemed to unlock the doors maybe an error not seen this since only those first few days
 

REVUpminster

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Something that occurred to me last night was this. With the growing traffic in Cornwall (we’re only a handful of weeks away from Easter after all), could some of the 3 cars find temporary use allowing a 2 car to head up to Exeter and Barnstaple / Okehampton for training and clearance purposes?

And will the 175s see clearance along the Mule to continue the Barnstaple - Axminster services as well?
They will also be cleared for Paignton and Exmouth as it's inevitable they will be used there as are the 158s. One diagram is Barnstaple-Paignton although that will probably change in the May timetable. Who knows they might even get used during the Torbay airshow to use an 800 elsewhere.
 

XFeed

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This was by the doors in the vestibule just seemed to unlock the doors maybe an error not seen this since only those first few days

Thanks for further reply, I still can`t envisage what they may have been doing with possible door controls in that area. The only door arming/controls in the vestibule area are at the intermediate guards panel assembly in 3901 electrical cupboard. Door problems seem to be the biggest issue at moment with a further report on here that 009 had door issues yesterday.

There is one possibility that the train crew could be mistakenly trying to arm the doors from 2 positions simultaneously by having door control keys energised in multiple positions? If this is the case it then causes a number of problems the most common being, 1, in the cab the contacts of the door enable relays are destroyed when the door enable buttons are pressed and 2, if door enable buttons are pressed at the intermediate position this action then causes CB-GDCN - Circuit Breaker Guards Door Control - to trip in the 3901 electrical cupboard making that particular cars intermediate guards panel inoperative and indicated by the green LED extinguished.

The above occasionally cropped up during ATW and TfW days, more commonly with new guards.
 

craigybagel

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Thanks for further reply, I still can`t envisage what they may have been doing with possible door controls in that area. The only door arming/controls in the vestibule area are at the intermediate guards panel assembly in 3901 electrical cupboard. Door problems seem to be the biggest issue at moment with a further report on here that 009 had door issues yesterday.

There is one possibility that the train crew could be mistakenly trying to arm the doors from 2 positions simultaneously by having door control keys energised in multiple positions? If this is the case it then causes a number of problems the most common being, 1, in the cab the contacts of the door enable relays are destroyed when the door enable buttons are pressed and 2, if door enable buttons are pressed at the intermediate position this action then causes CB-GDCN - Circuit Breaker Guards Door Control - to trip in the 3901 electrical cupboard making that particular cars intermediate guards panel inoperative and indicated by the green LED extinguished.

The above occasionally cropped up during ATW and TfW days, more commonly with new guards.
Door control MCB in at least one cab used to trip if you were keyed in at 2 places at once as well - many a guard was caught out by that one.
 

craigybagel

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Trouble is that on Sprinters was if you put another key in it would buzz. With 175s it doesn’t.
Indeed. The only warning on a 175 you get is every external door on the train, cab doors included, instantly closing without even a hustle alarm - and then not being able to reopen until you find the MCB and reset it.
 

XFeed

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Door control MCB in at least one cab used to trip if you were keyed in at 2 places at once as well - many a guard was caught out by that one.

Unfortunately when the cab door control MCB tripped it wasn`t enough to save the door enable relays in cab on most occasions.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Indeed. The only warning on a 175 you get is every external door on the train, cab doors included, instantly closing without even a hustle alarm - and then not being able to reopen until you find the MCB and reset it.

That same scenario will also occur if low 24v batteries are detected or R-TRM - Relay Transmission - in cab de energises. The doors also close without any obstacle detection when this happens too.
 
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craigybagel

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Unfortunately when the cab door control MCB tripped it wasn`t enough to save the door enable relays in cab on most occasions.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==



That same scenario will also occur if low 24v batteries are detected or R-TRM - Relay Transmission - in cab de energises. The doors also close without any obstacle detection when this happens too.
It's like you and I said at the start - 175s are great units, but they do have some interesting foibles that can catch out the unwary!

Would still happily jump in the drivers seat tomorrow if only they'd let me....
 

Brush 4

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How ridiculously complicated modern trains are. Progress is surely to make things simpler....
 

Goldfish62

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How ridiculously complicated modern trains are. Progress is surely to make things simpler....
True, except 175s are not modern trains! They've got primitive, obselete electronics from 30 years ago and are rudimentary compared with modern stuff.
 

The Prisoner

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School holidays (in my area at least) start in under a week. Families will be starting their holidays in one week's time. With the Castle sets gone, the Sprinters spread thinly, and the tiny number of 175s available (see post 2638), what is the GWR service in Devon and Cornwall going to be like? I'd suggest that anyone without a car will be unwise to take an Easter holiday in the west country this year.
A little OTT. Most people on holiday in Cornwall will be travelling from further a field, so likely to be travelling in on long distance GWR/XC which are not short formed. As reported elsewhere there are now two 175 diagrams daily with another 1-2 per day training runs - would wager the Castle diagrams will be fully covered soon - not least as at least six units have been out regularly (from memory 001/002/003/007/009 and 011?) so all seem to be match-fit.

Once the staff training needs catch up it will free up the 150s to get back to their metro diagrams. Sounds like we are nearly at that point.
 

REVUpminster

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I think May timetable change will be the crunch when diagrams are likely to change with 175s replacing the 158s at Exeter and allowing 150s to take on Newquay hourly. An hourly service to Newquay could require four car trains because GWR may get a surprise in extra customers. The turbos will still be needed for Paignton-Exmouth.
 

Cheers Drive

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Thanks for further reply, I still can`t envisage what they may have been doing with possible door controls in that area. The only door arming/controls in the vestibule area are at the intermediate guards panel assembly in 3901 electrical cupboard. Door problems seem to be the biggest issue at moment with a further report on here that 009 had door issues yesterday.

There is one possibility that the train crew could be mistakenly trying to arm the doors from 2 positions simultaneously by having door control keys energised in multiple positions? If this is the case it then causes a number of problems the most common being, 1, in the cab the contacts of the door enable relays are destroyed when the door enable buttons are pressed and 2, if door enable buttons are pressed at the intermediate position this action then causes CB-GDCN - Circuit Breaker Guards Door Control - to trip in the 3901 electrical cupboard making that particular cars intermediate guards panel inoperative and indicated by the green LED extinguished.

The above occasionally cropped up during ATW and TfW days, more commonly with new guards.
I do remember on one journey that the train manager after doing something to the door closest to me had to then run down the carriage and do something at another door for them all to open.
 

cole_peter5@

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Could tell what 175/0 - 175/1 will be having 175008 and 170110 will they being for scrap and where are then now please
 

43096

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Could tell what 175/0 - 175/1 will be having 175008 and 170110 will they being for scrap and where are then now please
175008 is off lease at Ely.

170110? Do you mean 175110? That will be part of the GWR fleet.
 

XFeed

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It's like you and I said at the start - 175s are great units, but they do have some interesting foibles that can catch out the unwary!

Would still happily jump in the drivers seat tomorrow if only they'd let me....

Yes they do have some interesting and some surprise features for the ill prepared at times.

Like you, but in a different capacity, I would happily investigate technical faults and provide training again on 175s.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

True, except 175s are not modern trains! They've got primitive, obselete electronics from 30 years ago and are rudimentary compared with modern stuff.

Agreed they maybe 30 years old and a little primitive in the electronics department compared to which its replacement the 197 has tucked away in nearly every bit of spare space but I`m not sure that the electronics are obsolete as the majority were repaired by Alstom and same equipment used across other UK Coradia fleets albeit with differing software.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

I do remember on one journey that the train manager after doing something to the door closest to me had to then run down the carriage and do something at another door for them all to open.

Its so bizarre as to what the train crew are doing when it comes to door operation, its like that they haven`t had the correct training, which shouldn`t be the case, or that they haven`t grasped it as yet and are having mental blocks ?
 
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Goldfish62

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Agreed they maybe 30 years old and a little primitive in the electronics department compared to which its replacement the 197 has tucked away in nearly every bit of spare space but I`m not sure that the electronics are obsolete as the majority were repaired by Alstom and same equipment used across other UK Coradia fleets albeit with differing software.
Just because the equipment is clearly still in use doesn't mean it's not obselete. You wouldn't install it or anything resembling it on a new train, or likely be able to readily get plentiful spares. Same is true for all the Coradia fleets plus the Networkers and London Underground 1992 and 1996 stock, for example.
 

RPI

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I think May timetable change will be the crunch when diagrams are likely to change with 175s replacing the 158s at Exeter and allowing 150s to take on Newquay hourly. An hourly service to Newquay could require four car trains because GWR may get a surprise in extra customers. The turbos will still be needed for Paignton-Exmouth.
I doubt it, a lot of Exeter Drivers still don't sign them, any extra workings are likely to be on the mainline for now
 

irish_rail

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I doubt it, a lot of Exeter Drivers still don't sign them, any extra workings are likely to be on the mainline for now
Do ANY Exeter drivers yet sign them? I'm under the impression it's just Plymouth Par and PZ at present, and even then it's still a tiny proportion of drivers trained. I'd have thought Exeter is way way down the pecking order at this stage.
 

REVUpminster

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Do ANY Exeter drivers yet sign them? I'm under the impression it's just Plymouth Par and PZ at present, and even then it's still a tiny proportion of drivers trained. I'd have thought Exeter is way way down the pecking order at this stage.
If GWR want to improve the services round Bristol then they need the 158s. Exeter with it's new depot facilities and staff accommodation was supposed to become the centre of the universe for the South West.
 

Snow1964

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I think May timetable change will be the crunch when diagrams are likely to change with 175s replacing the 158s at Exeter and allowing 150s to take on Newquay hourly. An hourly service to Newquay could require four car trains because GWR may get a surprise in extra customers. The turbos will still be needed for Paignton-Exmouth.
If GWR want to improve the services round Bristol then they need the 158s. Exeter with it's new depot facilities and staff accommodation was supposed to become the centre of the universe for the South West.
GWR sort of get a few extra weeks in Bristol area due to engineering works.
The Severn tunnel route is closed from Saturday 21 May to Monday 8 June, and no trains Fareham-Portsmouth last week of May either.

But the 158 strengthening on Portsmouth route really needs to ramp up on Saturdays from first weekend in May, as the seasonal Saturday 5 big cruise ship changeover at Southampton starts that weekend, where could be 15000 getting off and another 15000 getting on. Although in a crazy piece of planning (as in not do it before busy season starts) chosen to close Bath-Westbury first weekend in May for 3 days.

It is interesting that Saturdays might become the big problem, because as well as traditional holiday changeover in South West (which goes back decades, and was busy in 1950s and 1960s), now need to Strengthen services to Southampton too.

If Exeter crews aren't ready to have lots of 175 workings by May/June, going to very messy with how they cope with both strengthen Devon mainline and Cardiff-Portsmouth services especially on Saturdays
 

HamworthyGoods

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I think May timetable change will be the crunch when diagrams are likely to change with 175s replacing the 158s at Exeter and allowing 150s to take on Newquay hourly. An hourly service to Newquay could require four car trains because GWR may get a surprise in extra customers. The turbos will still be needed for Paignton-Exmouth.

This change isn’t happening for the May timetable change. The 3 car 158s are staying at Exeter for now.

More likely to be a December change.
 

RPI

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Do ANY Exeter drivers yet sign them? I'm under the impression it's just Plymouth Par and PZ at present, and even then it's still a tiny proportion of drivers trained. I'd have thought Exeter is way way down the pecking order at this stage.
I don't think so, but wasn't 100% sure, a lot Exeter Guards sign them though
 

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