Class 142 Nodding Donkey

[sheff'd victoria]

I had the misfortune of having to travel from Dore station to Man Picc on the Hope Valley Line, 1hr 15mins on a nodding donkey

Bounce . Bounce . Bounce .:roll:

Going to the toliet is an art in itself on these units

My question is how long do passengers mainly in the north have to put with this awful class of train

 

[Thewanderer]

I managed to fall asleep on 142010 on a trip from Lydney to Cardiff Central back in 2006 so they can't be that bad
http://thewanderersirishrailphotos.fotopic.net/p33769839.html

 

[Donny Dave]

I had the misfortune of having to travel from Dore station to Man Picc on the Hope Valley Line, 1hr 15mins on a nodding donkey

Bounce . Bounce . Bounce .:roll:

Going to the toliet is an art in itself on these units

My question is how long do passengers mainly in the north have to put with this awful class of train

I'm surprised you didn't decide to go Dore - Sheffield, then get the TPE to Manchester from there. A lot more comfortable.

As for putting up with them, erm, I avoid them like the plague ....

 

[A60K]

My question is how long do passengers mainly in the north have to put with this awful class of train

25 years so far, probably another 15 years to go


Or if you're after the longest journey, I think that was discussed quite recently - possibly something like 3 hours!

 

[TrainBrain185]

My question is how long do passengers mainly in the north have to put with this awful class of train

For some time yet........

 

[GNERman]

they should be replaced in the north when we get class 150, 165 and 166 from the great western electrification as they will be replaced by ex thameslink 319

 

[HSTfan!!!]

brilliant trains, nowt wrong with them! haha, I really do prefer pacers over 150's personally!

 

[TrainBrain185]

they should be replaced in the north when we get class 150, 165 and 166 from the great western electrification as they will be replaced by ex thameslink 319

Pacer units are not neccesarily hot favourites to be retired in the future cascades when the rail electfication is nearing completion. Do not be too surprised if a "thinning out" of a cross section of early second gen DMU vehicles, cherry picking the worst examples of each Class based on vehicle condition and best for particular routes.
Despite everyones moaning of the Pacer, it is more cost effective on certain routes rather than replace with 150 or larger.
I quite like them as they run now, but will be first to admit I hated them with a vengeance when they first arrived on the scene, as I was one of the unfortunates to be involved in the thick of keeping them running.

 

[Bighat]

they should be replaced in the north when we get class 150, 165 and 166 from the great western electrification as they will be replaced by ex thameslink 319

In that case I wouldn't hold your breath!

That could be a seroius long wait, and god knows what state they will be in by then!

 

[driver9000]

with a bit of TLC they will run forever!

I like them, perfect for short hop local stopping services and on welded rail they ride better than you would expect them to.

 

[GNERman]

yes they are good for short journeys,but not journeys such as leeds to morecambe! fortunatly some have been replaced by 150 or 153 which aren't so bad...

 

[sheff'd victoria]

I'm surprised you didn't decide to go Dore - Sheffield, then get the TPE to Manchester from there. A lot more comfortable.

As for putting up with them, erm, I avoid them like the plague ....

I checked before I left the flat and the 1011am TPE was running late so I had no choice

brilliant trains, nowt wrong with them! haha, I really do prefer pacers over 150's personally!

I love the Class 156's damm fine design and they should have built a lot more

 

[starrymarkb]

they should be replaced in the north when we get class 150, 165 and 166 from the great western electrification as they will be replaced by ex thameslink 319

I don't think the 16xs will stray far, I think the plan is for them to work Cardiff to Portsmouth pushing 158s out to the branches... Remember that a lot of infrastructure work might be needed to clear the wide bodied 16x's

 

[yorksrob]

There are few things to make me as incandescent with rage as the thought of Pacer units going on for another 15 years. Particularly when my lovely mark 1 slammers were withdrawn early. Incedentally, has anyone ever done a scientific test of how crashworthy these abominations actually are? I can't imagine a bus welded on to a coal wagon chassis is the most sturdy vehicle ever built. I don't believe that ANY other item of servicable rolling stock should be replaced until these items are gone.

 

[daccer]

I think the great worry for me with regards to the current situation ref Pacers and actually all diesel units is that there seems to be an almost tacit agreement that few if any new diesel units will be built going forward. It could be that the 172's being built for LM and LOROL are the last diesel builds for some time. The question I have is this. What happens if Electrification doesnt carry on in a rolling programme and actually is stalled by economic pressures. Even if a rolling programme is undertaken the timeline for it to have any real effect is still 8-10 years.

The announcement of GWML electrification and the subsequent cacade of diesel stock (Turbos etc) is great but the whole programme will take up to 8 years to complete before moving onto MML etc. Also as we come out of recession growth will continue at a greater pace(you would assume). Any stock that does end up getting cascaded up North will probably just end up covering this growth and wont make any material difference to the situation. I certainly can't see a situation in the near or middle future where Northern in particular can afford to do away with their Pacers. This will see Pacers running for at least another decade - I am not sure if they will be in much of a state at 35 years old. It musn't be forgotten that the early Sprinter classes aren't a lot younger than the Pacers and cant go on for ever. So the question really comes down to can we electrify quikcly enough to beat the ticking clock that is the diesel units winding down to their inevitable trip to the scrap yard. I doubt it and I think we will see massive problems in the years ahead as units start to give up the ghost and Govt/ROSCOS and finance houses refuse to countenance diesel replacements as they are a risk of being obsolete almost before they start running.

 

[yorksrob]

I fear you may be correct. I don't think the Sprinters should go on for ever. Just longer than the Pacers! I'm also supremely unconvinced about them being so wonderfully cost effective. If they are cheaper to run I suspect this has more to do with their size which usually makes them cramped anyway and as I have said in other posts, flexibility could be better achieved by having joinable single car conventional trains.

 

[paul1609]

I think the great worry for me with regards to the current situation ref Pacers and actually all diesel units is that there seems to be an almost tacit agreement that few if any new diesel units will be built going forward. It could be that the 172's being built for LM and LOROL are the last diesel builds for some time. The question I have is this. What happens if Electrification doesnt carry on in a rolling programme and actually is stalled by economic pressures. Even if a rolling programme is undertaken the timeline for it to have any real effect is still 8-10 years.

The announcement of GWML electrification and the subsequent cacade of diesel stock (Turbos etc) is great but the whole programme will take up to 8 years to complete before moving onto MML etc. Also as we come out of recession growth will continue at a greater pace(you would assume). Any stock that does end up getting cascaded up North will probably just end up covering this growth and wont make any material difference to the situation. I certainly can't see a situation in the near or middle future where Northern in particular can afford to do away with their Pacers. This will see Pacers running for at least another decade - I am not sure if they will be in much of a state at 35 years old. It musn't be forgotten that the early Sprinter classes aren't a lot younger than the Pacers and cant go on for ever. So the question really comes down to can we electrify quikcly enough to beat the ticking clock that is the diesel units winding down to their inevitable trip to the scrap yard. I doubt it and I think we will see massive problems in the years ahead as units start to give up the ghost and Govt/ROSCOS and finance houses refuse to countenance diesel replacements as they are a risk of being obsolete almost before they start running.

Personally i think that the these will be the last DMUs ever is a scare story put forward by certain factions within the industry to push the case for electrification.
The problem is that the ROSCOs have been scared off funding them by hamfisted tactics at the DFT. I reckon DMUs will still be being built in 25 years time.

 

[johnb]

There'll be new DMUs, for sure: Wick electrification is about as likely as a tunnel to Shetland. The point is:
1) there won't be any new 125mph DMUs, because any line where 125mph running is feasible will be electrified within their lifetime.
2) widespread electrification on major routes will also free up a load of sub-100mph DMUs for minor routes, which will allow TPTB to delay 14x and 15x replacement, which is a good thing given that public spending's going to be under a <i>leetle</i> bit of pressure over the next 10 years.
3) however, once the 1980s trains are finally, unequivocally life-expired, new diesel and/or hybrid stock will be needed to serve the Wick/Holyhead/Newquay/Settle bits of the network that are unlikely ever to see wires.

 

[starrymarkb]

and presumably by that point Bombarder will have got the AGC drivetrain into a UK sized package (rather then roof mounted in the Gallic versions)

 

[MCR247]

Tell me why Holyhead & Newquay are unlikely to ever recieve wires

 

[krus_aragon]

Tell me why Holyhead & Newquay are unlikely to ever recieve wires

Yeah. I'd like to hope that Holyhead (or Llandudno) will be relatively soon with regards to wires in Wales, after the SW Main Line and the Valley Lines.

 

[GNERman]

I don't think the 16xs will stray far, I think the plan is for them to work Cardiff to Portsmouth pushing 158s out to the branches... Remember that a lot of infrastructure work might be needed to clear the wide bodied 16x's

ah good, that means more 158's, much better than a pacer or 150...

 

[Fincra5]

i came back from barnstaple to brighton today. The Barnstaple to Exeter St Davids train was a pacer. They are so uncormfortable with the bus seats and spring suspension. I hate them.

 

[TEW]

Tell me why Holyhead & Newquay are unlikely to ever recieve wires

Seems unlikely in the near future on the Newquay branch, certainly very impractical.

 

[andylloyd]

Have had the pleasure of a 142 from Newcastle - Carlisle! Scrap the whole god damn lot!

 

[GNERman]

today?

normally that's a booked class 156...

 

[andylloyd]

today?

normally that's a booked class 156...

Nope about four weeks ago....
It depends on what leaves Heaton at the time.... Normally first thing you've got two 142's and a 156 depart Newcastle about 0550 m-f then god knows at the weekends... To be honest it seems hit and miss

 

[GNERman]

yesterday when at northallerton with wensley, the last train I filmed was a northern 156 light heading north on a neville hill to heaton move, probably why more 142's are rostered,

aren't 156's now all at newton heath apart from a few at heaton cos we rarely get them in leeds, i saw one in york a few weeks ago but that was the first time in ages...

 

[driver9000]

Yes, the majority of the 156 are now allocated to Newton Heath with a small number at Heaton mainly for Tyne Valley work although Heaton diagrams go as far as the cumbrian coast and Blackpool. Neville Hill lost its allocation of 156s when the 158 and 153 fleets were concentrated onto that depot

 

[andylloyd]

Yes, the majority of the 156 are now allocated to Newton Heath with a small number at Heaton mainly for Tyne Valley work although Heaton diagrams go as far as the cumbrian coast and Blackpool. Neville Hill lost its allocation of 156s when the 158 and 153 fleets were concentrated onto that depot

Heaton diagrams to blackpool? First thing ive heard of that one....
Cumbrian coast yes I know about but not blackpool.....