Chiltern during WCML blockades

[MerlinRail 804]

When GWR had diversions in place, some went to Waterloo and some to Marylebone, couldn't Avanti do the same-obviously having to be dragged? Is it there not enough capacity or the station not long enough

Platform capacity could be a bit of a problem at Marylebone but they could defo fit a 5 or 7 car Evero in any platform except 4 (max 5 car)

 

[Steveswan10]

I assume the Evero's are hybrid? Or they would have to be top and tailed? And would you get a full 11 car Pendolino top and tailed into Marylebone?

Platform capacity could be a bit of a problem at Marylebone but they could defo fit a 5 or 7 car Evero in any platform except 4

 

[MerlinRail 804]

I assume the Evero's are hybrid? Or they would have to be top and tailed? And would you get a full 11 car Pendolino top and tailed into Marylebone?

805s are bimode, 807s aren’t, so the best you can get is a 5 car 805 or a 7 car 807 top n tailed. The longest platforms are 2&3 which can fit 9x 23m carriages

 

[PLY2AYS]

805s are bimode, 807s aren’t, so the best you can get is a 5 car 805 or a 7 car 807 top n tailed. The longest platforms are 2&3 which can fit 9x 23m carriages

Platforms 2&3 can fit 10 cars, no?

 

[tgsh2011]

he is a professional grifter.

he is not allowed to practise law, having chosen not to renew his practising certificate.

while there is nothing untoward about a barrister doing this, and there are plenty of noble professions for unregistered barristers (law lecturer, say), he now spends his time on GB News and podcasts with the likes of Liz Truss, bleating about the concerns of the (far) right.

he also boasts of his rapidly increasing twitter follower count.

he is a commercial barrister, and is presumably well-qualified in that area, however he now posts mostly about criminal law (free the right-wing rioters, lock up the left ones, lock up the asylum seekers), and when he frequently makes basic errors (which a pupil barrister should not make, albeit that by his stage in life he may have forgotten the relevant law), he invariably blocks the legal professionals who correct him.

as a barrister he would be able to file a civil claim against Chiltern easily, or make a criminal complaint. Instead he prefers to post "I am bruised" on twitter.

Chiltern's security guard may or may not have acted wrongly, but Barrett appears unlikely to ever act in a way that would allow us to find out which it is.

I never knew that he had not renewed his practising certificate.

You are spot on about his tendency to block anyone who challenges Barrett. It has become somewhat a bit of a joke now. As ever with these videos, we never get context. He might very well entirely be in the right, but litigate that appropriately instead of seeing likes and clocks on X.

 

[Omnishambles]

Didn't Avanti divert via Banbury in the past? Vague recollection of a 15 carriage Voyager.

Edit: I meant divert to/from Euston via Banbury, not going into Marylebone.

Certainly did, and at quite a regular service if I recall during WCRM blockades

 

[MerlinRail 804]

Platforms 2&3 can fit 10 cars, no?

242m buffer stop to signal, so snugly probably. AFAIK it’s only ever used for nine at most in the train plan, though I may be wrong

 

[Ian Hardy]

When GWR had diversions in place, some went to Waterloo and some to Marylebone, couldn't Avanti do the same-obviously having to be dragged? Is it there not enough capacity or the station not long enough?

Are the 390s cleared for the Chiltern Line, I doubt it.

Another issue is that with the closure of the northern bit of the WCML being closed from 1st - 14th January 2026 and the diversions via the S&C, there wouldn't be enough staff to have run the normal service during December as well those who were learning the S&C.

The alternative of using the 805s (as the 807s are AC only, they wouldn't get very far south of Coventry pt 2) can't occur as most of the 805s are required for the Wigan / Preston - Carlisle shuttles via the S&C from 1st - 14th January 2026.

So AWC could possibly be able to operate a service into Marylebone from 27th - 31st December but then wouldn't be able to do so from 1st - 4th January 2026 as they wouldn't have enough rolling stock.

There could be a service during the quieter period between Christmas & New Year but during the busier New Year period.

 

[soil]

I never knew that he had not renewed his practising certificate.

He also left his Chambers after being quoted by Tommy Robinson about the Southport attacks. (not clear whether he was asked to leave, but his social media output is not respected by those within the profession.)

Prominent legal commentator leaves chambers

Barrister and Spectator columnist was criticised over his tweets following the Southport attacks.

www.lawgazette.co.uk

As an unregistered barrister he has no higher status than any random off the street.

 

[The Planner]

Its very unlikely that you will see an Avanti diversion off the WCML at the southern end. The normal solution of bussing MK to Bedford and on to the MML isn't going to alter any time soon.

 

[sammyg901]

What would have been ideal is the Romic HST running some non stop Birmingham-London and vv expresses at the busiest times ahead of the scheduled service. Fully route cleared , indeed planned to operate some charters next year on this route

 

[The Planner]

What would have been ideal is the Romic HST running some non stop Birmingham-London and vv expresses at the busiest times ahead of the scheduled service. Fully route cleared , indeed planned to operate some charters next year on this route

Who is paying for them? Would have to be a TOC paying for it.

 

[PLY2AYS]

As an unregistered barrister he has no higher status than any random off the street.

As someone who’s worked a few years on pub and nightclub front doors, his snide comment of “I’m a barrister” oozed with the same intensity of “do you know who I am?” or “you can’t do this to me, I’m studying law!” that any bouncer has heard all too many times from drunkards and inebriated students.

As if it has any weighting when being removed from private premises, either after confrontations with members of the public, staff or security or just being generally intoxicated*/undesirable

*this particular instance; intoxicated with their self-ordained grandiose.

 

[sammyg901]

Who is paying for them? Would have to be a TOC paying for it.

True. Not sure how it works during engineering- does Chiltern get more ££ as they're the only direct option to Birmingham. Though it'll eventually all be one pot !

 

[soil]

As someone who’s worked a few years on pub and nightclub front doors, his snide comment of “I’m a barrister” oozed with the same intensity of “do you know who I am?” or “you can’t do this to me, I’m studying law!” that any bouncer has heard all too many times from drunkards and inebriated students.

As if it has any weighting when being removed from private premises, either after confrontations with members of the public, staff or security or just being generally intoxicated*/undesirable

*this particular instance; intoxicated with their self-ordained grandiose.

Quite plausibly intoxicated from booze as well, at that time of night.

 

[NeakPed]

When GWR had diversions in place, some went to Waterloo and some to Marylebone, couldn't Avanti do the same-obviously having to be dragged? Is it there not enough capacity or the station not long enough?

With the assisting/dragging engines from where ?

 

[domcoop7]

As someone who’s worked a few years on pub and nightclub front doors, his snide comment of “I’m a barrister” oozed with the same intensity of “do you know who I am?” or “you can’t do this to me, I’m studying law!” that any bouncer has heard all too many times from drunkards and inebriated students.

As if it has any weighting when being removed from private premises, either after confrontations with members of the public, staff or security or just being generally intoxicated*/undesirable

*this particular instance; intoxicated with their self-ordained grandiose.

It's also a breach of professional conduct for a practising barrister (which I am, incidentally) to use their status for personal gain, and it is a further, separate breach of professional conduct for a non-practising barrister to "hold out" as being a practising barrister or give the impression of being one. Given that very, very few members of the public will know what any of that means the general rule is that a non-practising barrister should not mention barrister status at all unless the context is relevant or possibly use "unregistered barrister" as a description.

I am not a lefty, at all. For me, the Boris Johnson government was far too left wing for my liking. But Steven Barrett is just a total and complete moron, I'm sorry to say. It isn't just lefty barristers like "the Secret Barrister" on Twitter who clash with him - it's pretty much everyone! Which tells you something.

 

[mickey]

True. Not sure how it works during engineering- does Chiltern get more ££ as they're the only direct option to Birmingham. Though it'll eventually all be one pot !

They will if it’s bought as Route Wycombe, or as an Advance on their service. If it’s Any Permitted then it’s unlikely they’ll get much more unless a manual adjustment is made to cover it.

I‘ll eat my hat if it’s ever ‘one pot’. There’ll always be a need to partition revenue by business unit.

 

[Hadders]

If it’s Any Permitted then it’s unlikely they’ll get much more unless a manual adjustment is made to cover it.

Manual adjustments are often made.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 31 Dec 2025 ==

Though it'll eventually all be one pot !

It won't ever be fully one pot, accounting at a more local level will still have to be done.

When you shop at Tesco all the money goes to one pot, but each store still has its own budget, profit & loss acount and targets to hit.

 

[birchesgreen]

Well i travelled down to London yesterday, the train down was unbelievably crowded (though i luckily had a seat!) It was amazingly busy at London Marylebone when i arrived though well organised and i didn't have any real problems on the return journey later on.

 

[rob w]

Anyone know what the loads on the trains are like now people are heading back to work?

I’m heading down to London for the darts on Friday afternoon from Moor St - departures every half hour when I need to go - and just wondering if I’ll be able to board my preferred service / get a seat / need to join a long queue and maybe miss my intended one, etc.

My mate will board at Bicester North, so similar question for him.

Still time to book a National Express if required but I’d prefer the train.

I was on the late running 11:08 from Banbury to Marylebone yesterday and it was awful. Station staff at Banbury warned is that not everyone would get on. My wife and I managed to squeeze into the front carriage and people with large cases were blocking the door areas and refusing to move.
At Bicester North more people with cars tried and failed to board and we were at the station for some time before we moved. A BTP officer appeared to spoke to driver as well for some reason.
The train moved slowly and very very slowly from Haddenham to Princes Risborough due to a track issue. With the front part of the train having high density seating and so many standing the 1:20+ minute journey passed by slowly.
Going back the queueing system was in use and planned to get the 19:06 Birmingham train however it was full (only 4 car) so the staff suggested that we take the 19:36 on the adjacent platform which has 6 cars.
I need to travel back to London today and tempted to travel via Reading if the Chiltern trains are full.

 

[150219]

I was on the late running 11:08 from Banbury to Marylebone yesterday and it was awful. Station staff at Banbury warned is that not everyone would get on. My wife and I managed to squeeze into the front carriage and people with large cases were blocking the door areas and refusing to move.
At Bicester North more people with cars tried and failed to board and we were at the station for some time before we moved. A BTP officer appeared to spoke to driver as well for some reason.
The train moved slowly and very very slowly from Haddenham to Princes Risborough due to a track issue. With the front part of the train having high density seating and so many standing the 1:20+ minute journey passed by slowly.
Going back the queueing system was in use and planned to get the 19:06 Birmingham train however it was full (only 4 car) so the staff suggested that we take the 19:36 on the adjacent platform which has 6 cars.
I need to travel back to London today and tempted to travel via Reading if the Chiltern trains are full.

Beware that there were quite a few F&S services on GWR too yesterday.

However today is quieter than yesterday.

 

[philosopher]

I was on the late running 11:08 from Banbury to Marylebone yesterday and it was awful. Station staff at Banbury warned is that not everyone would get on. My wife and I managed to squeeze into the front carriage and people with large cases were blocking the door areas and refusing to move.
At Bicester North more people with cars tried and failed to board and we were at the station for some time before we moved. A BTP officer appeared to spoke to driver as well for some reason.
The train moved slowly and very very slowly from Haddenham to Princes Risborough due to a track issue. With the front part of the train having high density seating and so many standing the 1:20+ minute journey passed by slowly.
Going back the queueing system was in use and planned to get the 19:06 Birmingham train however it was full (only 4 car) so the staff suggested that we take the 19:36 on the adjacent platform which has 6 cars.
I need to travel back to London today and tempted to travel via Reading if the Chiltern trains are full.

While it has always be busy on Chiltern during WCML blockades, the level of overcrowding on the Chiltern services seemed to be particularly bad this year.

I know EMR seems the main alternative route from large parts of the Northwest to London during WCML blockades, however I do wonder if past bad experiences of overcrowding on EMR services has caused a lot of travellers from the Northwest to switch to the CrossCountry / London Northwestern route to Birmingham then Chiltern to London route instead.

 

[156444]

Travelled to High Wycombe from Marylebone yesterday morning, and confirm that gate staff were being over zealous holding everyone back, and unaware of the Wycombe only trains . The station was empty at the time. I had to explain to the gentleman there was a train on platform 6, leaving in 5 minutes, and he had to check with his supervisor before apologetically allowing me through.
Well done for Chiltern for amazing provision for the extra passenger traffic (Silver sets all out.) Less praise for the extra gate line staff brought in..

It looks from RTT that there was only one loco-hauled set out on 30 December (AL02 with 68008).

 

[MerlinRail 804]

It looks from RTT that there was only one loco-hauled set out on 30 December (AL02 with 68008).

A Monday/Friday would usually have 3 in operation, with one of those just doing 1H12 in the morning. Tuesday - Thursday is 4 thanks to 1H10/1P51. I know staffing is an issue but IMO they should be trying to use their Mk3 sets to increase capacity during things like this, by using them to run a couple extra services, perhaps as a sort of ultra fast thing

 

[sammyg901]

Manual adjustments are often made.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 31 Dec 2025 ==


It won't ever be fully one pot, accounting at a more local level will still have to be done.

When you shop at Tesco all the money goes to one pot, but each store still has its own budget, profit & loss acount and targets to hit.

Indeed, I work for a large corp and spend plenty of time dealing with this!

But big picture there are plenty of folk who travelled over the last few days who are rare train users and will actively seek to avoid Chiltern or trains completely following their experience. So some upfront spend on hire in services may result in revenue for the railway for years to come. Hard to quantity of course .

Does sound like Chiltern do their best with their limited resources available , things will be better once their additional sets come online

 

[The Planner]

Indeed, I work for a large corp and spend plenty of time dealing with this!

But big picture there are plenty of folk who travelled over the last few days who are rare train users and will actively seek to avoid Chiltern or trains completely following their experience. So some upfront spend on hire in services may result in revenue for the railway for years to come. Hard to quantity of course .

Does sound like Chiltern do their best with their limited resources available , things will be better once their additional sets come online

This doesnt work under the current arrangements unless the TOC hires in, and I doubt it would cover its costs either. It would also need DfT sign off. Under GBR this may have legs, but I doubt this is something that has even been considered yet.

 

[RichardAsh1981]

While it has always be busy on Chiltern during WCML blockades, the level of overcrowding on the Chiltern services seemed to be particularly bad this year.

I know EMR seems the main alternative route from large parts of the Northwest to London during WCML blockades, however I do wonder if past bad experiences of overcrowding on EMR services has caused a lot of travellers from the Northwest to switch to the CrossCountry / London Northwestern route to Birmingham then Chiltern to London route instead.

I think Journey Planners may also be partly responsible. On the 29th, my brother travelled Bromborough to Norwood Junction, without paying a lot of attention to routing. He was routed Liverpool Lime Street to Birmingham New Street (WMT) then walk to Moor Street and Chiltern to Marylebone. If other occasional travellers have done likewise, will have filled up Chiltern services.
I wondered if WMT had more Advances on offer because of them running longer class 730 units on Liverpool - Birmingham services at the moment, and this would send split tickets this way?

 

[Bungle]

Thanks to those who replied. Glad I asked, and now researching contingency plans.

XC/GWR Brum-Oxford-Reading-Paddington, National Express/Flixbus or just put up with the WCML replacement bus are all options. Long journey times are annoying but fortunately not too much of an issue on this occasion so there is flexibility.

Not surprised to hear about the overcrowding but thanks for the responses.

 

[Hadders]

Chiltern has run a half hourly service on the Birmingham route this weel which is pretty much double the normal level of service. Many trains have also been strengthened as well. The reality is with the WCML blockade you're never gping to fully replace the capacity lost.

It's ok to say hire in additional stock but:

How many trains would be needed?
Are they cleared for the route?
Do they exist with the required number of staff who hold the required route and traction knowledge?
Is there sufficient space to stable and service the additional trains?
Is there sufficient capacity in the timetable to run the additional trains?
And sufficient platform capacity to deal with additional trains at Marylebone and Moor Street