RTT doesn't show reports for locations not on the booked route. As it didn't report via Northampton, that only leaves the direct route via Weedon
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Caledonian Sleeper
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59CosG95
Established Member
Is the Lowlander normally pathed via Northampton? My guess is that it isn't, but was VAR'd in, likely due to works via Weedon which were either cancelled or finished early, thereby allowing the Lowlander to take that route.
It has been the last few days, but often gets diverted via Weedon either to make up time or because there's an issue at Northampton.
Going back a few weeks it seems to have mostly gone via Weedon.
Elecman
Established Member
Didn’t run via Northampton but straight down the main line from Hillmorton via Weedon to Roade?
BenBracken
Member
Is the Birmingham stop live now? According to RTT it went there last night!
alistairlees
Established Member
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You can buy tickets for travel on or after 15 January
prasa
Member
I was on the Lowlander last night, we stopped at Birmingham International - and doors opened, but dispatchers advised no one to board the train. Believe but not certain it is for staff training/familiarisation ahead of the public launch in January. Interesting setup as crew swapped over in Lockerbie last night due to the storm, as normal CS seems to be more proactive in running a service - even if that means altering crew diagrams than just throwing in the towel as other operators did.
Highlander1
Member
Throwing in the towel seems harsh. It's a lot easier to alter diagrams for 4 services than 400.
The southbound Highland sleeper has so far been late at Stafford every morning this week, so has gone via the Trent Valley rather than through the West Midlands, and arrived broadly on time at Euston.
It is a small wonder as to whether there will be enough contingency in the schedule once it has to go via Birmingham International. Given it has to hit a narrow slot at Stetchford to fit in the fast line timetable further south I worry somewhat about its future timekeeping.
It is a small wonder as to whether there will be enough contingency in the schedule once it has to go via Birmingham International. Given it has to hit a narrow slot at Stetchford to fit in the fast line timetable further south I worry somewhat about its future timekeeping.
Kite159
Veteran Member
I wouldn't be surprised if Birmingham International is quietly dropped by the end of next year with citing 'low uptake' as the reason rather than poor timekeeping on the 2 track section between Stetchford & Rugby
1M16, the southbound Highland sleeper, successfully made it through the West Midlands this morning, but it is very tight to hit its path at Birmingham International.
After leaving Edinburgh 22 minutes late, some slack in the schedule around Weaver Junction allowed it to be broadly on time at Winsford but it lost some of that at Crewe.
4M49 0001 Coatbridge (Drs) to Daventry Int Rft Recep Fl was across 1M16's path at Stafford so 1M16 was about 7 minutes late onto the line through Bescot.
Fortunately 2W02 0602 Walsall to Wolverhampton was held at Bescot Junction, 2P03 0607 Birmingham New Street to Lichfield Trent Valley was held at Aston and 1W12 0613 Birmingham New Street to London Euston was held at Stetchford then again at Birmingham International.
It does seem that seven or eight minutes is all that it has in leeway through the West Midlands. Failing to run ahead of 2W02 or 1W12 could both result in a 20 minute delay at Rugby, and presumably then some slow line running being necessary south of Milton Keynes.
After leaving Edinburgh 22 minutes late, some slack in the schedule around Weaver Junction allowed it to be broadly on time at Winsford but it lost some of that at Crewe.
4M49 0001 Coatbridge (Drs) to Daventry Int Rft Recep Fl was across 1M16's path at Stafford so 1M16 was about 7 minutes late onto the line through Bescot.
Fortunately 2W02 0602 Walsall to Wolverhampton was held at Bescot Junction, 2P03 0607 Birmingham New Street to Lichfield Trent Valley was held at Aston and 1W12 0613 Birmingham New Street to London Euston was held at Stetchford then again at Birmingham International.
It does seem that seven or eight minutes is all that it has in leeway through the West Midlands. Failing to run ahead of 2W02 or 1W12 could both result in a 20 minute delay at Rugby, and presumably then some slow line running being necessary south of Milton Keynes.
Devil's advocate, with some of my ignorance here - even if zero passengers used this halt, would it actually cost CS more?
The stops at the likes of Carlisle at 5am drop off only or Preston at 00:30 pickup only I can't imagine are hugely popular yet they are retained?
If there started to be a big downturn in timekeeping, then it might cause some damage to the London market (which could cost CS more). Northbound is much less of a problem.
ruaival
Member
Ignore my previous comment, breakfast always takes priorityPreston picks up the breakfast trollies
In that example I do think it makes sense to double it up as a pickup point, though I would argue it wouldn't increase the dwelling time to make it set-down also?
Can't say I'm a regular user so maybe it's luck but there has always been at least a dozen or so other people waiting at Preston when I've got on their. And the one time I've got off at Carlisle there were still a few others.
Only time I've been the only one outside of the Highlands was when I used it to travel from Carstairs to Watford Junction - I was the only one at both!
Only time I've been the only one outside of the Highlands was when I used it to travel from Carstairs to Watford Junction - I was the only one at both!
DaventryRabbit
Member
I've also been the sole alightee at Carstairs in the past
godfreycomplex
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If the lowlander didn’t have to stop at Carstairs and Carlisle for operational reasons it probably wouldn’t
There was a breakdown of how many passengers use each station on the sleeper somewhere upthread but I can’t seem to find it.
Highland sleeper southbound again slightly late off Edinburgh this morning then back in time at Tebay, but lost time again further south.
12 late through the critical Bescot to Stetchford corridor. 2W02 was held for six minutes before Bescot, but 1W12 wasn't held at Stetchford.
End result a 22 minute delay to the sleeper by Rugby, and seven Avanti / LNR trains late into Euston behind it.
Whilst it is only the first week, it does look like the quest to serve Birmingham International is going to cause not only the sleeper, but also other trains to have disrupted journeys in a way that the previous Trent Valley routeing tended to resolve by the time the sleeper reached Rugby. It basically needs to be within five minutes of right time arrival at Stechford with very little recovery opportunity from Crewe onwards.
12 late through the critical Bescot to Stetchford corridor. 2W02 was held for six minutes before Bescot, but 1W12 wasn't held at Stetchford.
End result a 22 minute delay to the sleeper by Rugby, and seven Avanti / LNR trains late into Euston behind it.
Whilst it is only the first week, it does look like the quest to serve Birmingham International is going to cause not only the sleeper, but also other trains to have disrupted journeys in a way that the previous Trent Valley routeing tended to resolve by the time the sleeper reached Rugby. It basically needs to be within five minutes of right time arrival at Stechford with very little recovery opportunity from Crewe onwards.
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anothertyke
Member
What would have been the consequences of holding 1W12 at Stechford? Should that window be extended to 10 mins?
greatkingrat
Established Member
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Delay 1W12 at Stechford, that delays 2I22 (stopper to Intl), that delays 1R07 (Avanti Wolves-Euston), that causes 1R08 (Avanti from Lancaster) to be held at Rugby, and so on.
anothertyke
Member
So, for a train having travelled 300 miles with no margin in the last 60, that is just very tight.
Technically 1 minute of pathing allowance at Penkridge and 4 minutes between Aston and Stechford, but it seems very tight. It seems to always lose time at the Preston and Crewe stops too.
hornbyfan99
Member
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- 5 May 2015
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- 52
Apologies this may seem off topic to previous posts...
I've used the Caledonian Sleeper many times before, especially from Edinburgh/Glasgow to Watford Junction as I can connect on to the Southern service to Clapham Junction then onwards South - a much nicer route than having to navigate Euston and the Underground etc.
I'm planning to do the same journey again in early February from Edinburgh to Watford Junction. However the Edinburgh portion doesn't seem to be bookable on the night I want to travel, not even the ticket offices or other TOCs website aren't able to show berth availability. On the Sleepers website, it's still showing plenty of availability but the service is not showing on any fare system.
Now I'm staff so yes I do get a Priv rate fare and the Rail Staff Travel website isn't showing the service at all. Yet, the service (1C11) is showing as running on Real Time Trains on the day I want to travel and I can book the Glasgow portion of that service as well as the Highland Sleeper just not the Edinburgh portion. Any reason for this? I'm aware of the booking window periods and Priv quotas etc but really doesn't make sense, I've done this journey many time before.
I've used the Caledonian Sleeper many times before, especially from Edinburgh/Glasgow to Watford Junction as I can connect on to the Southern service to Clapham Junction then onwards South - a much nicer route than having to navigate Euston and the Underground etc.
I'm planning to do the same journey again in early February from Edinburgh to Watford Junction. However the Edinburgh portion doesn't seem to be bookable on the night I want to travel, not even the ticket offices or other TOCs website aren't able to show berth availability. On the Sleepers website, it's still showing plenty of availability but the service is not showing on any fare system.
Now I'm staff so yes I do get a Priv rate fare and the Rail Staff Travel website isn't showing the service at all. Yet, the service (1C11) is showing as running on Real Time Trains on the day I want to travel and I can book the Glasgow portion of that service as well as the Highland Sleeper just not the Edinburgh portion. Any reason for this? I'm aware of the booking window periods and Priv quotas etc but really doesn't make sense, I've done this journey many time before.
godfreycomplex
Established Member
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are you using desktop or mobile? It doesn’t show on mobile for some reason
I just tried to book for January for same reason, and it won't let me book to Watford Junction.
Oh, just realised the day I am going it is using ECML. Depending on your date could that be the reason?
alistairlees
Established Member
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Are you trying to book seats to Watford Junction? They may be off the platform so not bookable.
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
Is it physically possible for it to serve Rugby? I know the platforms aren't long enough but would it obstruct junctions if it went down the Trent and stopped there with the back end hanging off if it was approaching Stafford with a delay that would cause issues? This might be a reasonable option for cases where it is delayed southbound if that would be viable as it's only a short connection back to Birmingham and ticket acceptance could be arranged.
Presumably it's not an issue at all northbound as at that time of night things are pretty quiet.
There has long been some slack approaching Crewe northbound, and the sleeper used to have a dwell at Brinklow to allow a Manchester train to go first, so northbound works fine.
If that were a likely option I think it would need to be advertised at the time of booking, because even though it is a short connection back, it is still an inconvenience and delay for the Birmingham passengers.
Ultimately the London arrival time can be readvertised as 0830, 0900 or whenever else Caledonian Sleeper see fit, but the 'special' path on the fast line which doesn't cause everything else to be delayed passes Rugby at 0641 and arrives in Euston at 0747, with then a full flight of other arrivals, including Ledburn crossings and Milton Keynes stops, behind it.
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