Caledonian Sleeper

[D6130]

Due to be moving to a new location as part of the re-design and electrification shortly. More fit for pupose.

....but they will still have to keep and maintain most of the old station as it's a listed building.

 

[92002]

....but they will still have to keep and maintain most of the old station as it's a listed building.

Who knows they could sell it on to the hotel and move away.

Expected to be South of the current location. Which they think is closer to the City. No planning application yet. However the depot at the North end is due to move to the New Yard.

 

[Cheshire Scot]

Expected to be South of the current location. Which they think is closer to the City. No planning application yet. However the depot at the North end is due to move to the New Yard.

Whilst in railways operational terms moving to the south would make sense, to my mind that is further from the City (depending on what is regarded as the City - I would suggest the commercial area) albeit closer to some residential areas but further from others. I had heard a bit ago the New Yard idea had been dropped, but maybe it has been resurrected, and it would be a good spacious location for servicing trains.

 

[John Bishop]

Who knows they could sell it on to the hotel and move away.

Expected to be South of the current location. Which they think is closer to the City. No planning application yet. However the depot at the North end is due to move to the New Yard.

Nope, that’s further away from the city. You would need to move the station further east to be closer to the city, but that won’t happen.

 

[och aye]

I was decanted from CS to Aberdeen at Perth at 6am during the summer due to staff shortages (all advised in advance). We missed the Scotrail connection so had a bit of time in Perth station. I was surprised and impressed by its size, and obvious past grandeur for a relatively small city.

Maybe back in the day was it a major junction for trains going up the Highlands/Grampians (Inverness and Aberdeen) and down towards the Lowlands (Glasgow and Edinburgh), before the Forth and Tay bridges were built. Hence why it was quite a large station in its pomp?

 

[najaB]

Maybe back in the day was it a major junction for trains going up the Highlands/Grampians (Inverness and Aberdeen) and down towards the Lowlands (Glasgow and Edinburgh), before the Forth and Tay bridges were built.

Even after the Forth and Tay Bridges were built. Look up the "Race to the North".

 

[adrock1976]

Even after the Forth and Tay Bridges were built. Look up the "Race to the North".

Was that when both the former LNWR/Caledonian (London Euston) and the LNER (London Kings Cross) had trains to Aberdeen departing at broadly the same time, with whoever was the first to reach Laurencekirk declared the winner?

 

[najaB]

Was that when both the former LNWR/Caledonian (London Euston) and the LNER (London Kings Cross) had trains to Aberdeen departing at broadly the same time, with whoever was the first to reach Laurencekirk declared the winner?

Yup. Kinnaber Junction was the key point. Though this is probably drifting off topic for the Sleeper thread.

 

[Mag_seven]

Just a reminder that this thread is for the discussion of the Caledonian Sleeper.

If anyone wants to discuss anything else they are welcome to start a new thread in the relevant forum section

thanks

 

[6Z09]

Back on thread, no Fort William again this morning! Is Fort William the new Aberdeen? , as in sacrificial lamb in times of trouble .

 

[Mike395]

Back on thread, no Fort William again this morning! Is Fort William the new Aberdeen? , as in sacrificial lamb in times of trouble .

I suspect the service that gets sacrificed, where necessary, depends on the relative loadings. Fort William demand is much more heavily seasonal than any of the other Highlander routes, so at this time of year I wouldn’t be surprised if the Aberdeen isn’t more well patronised.

 

[paul1609]

Haven't been on the sleeper since I retired 3 years ago but then you'd expect loadings of around 6 to 12 on the Fort William other than Friday and Sunday nights in November this is berths plus seats.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Haven't been on the sleeper since I retired 3 years ago but then you'd expect loadings of around 6 to 12 on the Fort William other than Friday and Sunday nights in November this is berths plus seats.

Doesn't overly surprise me - FW is a summer and winter destination (summer hillwalking etc plus general tourism, winter ice climbing). Hardly anyone wants to go there in autumn or early spring.

 

[pitdiver]

I have just walked past Pitlochry Station (0725). There are two coaches waiting outside the station. Has the Inverness portion gone pear shaped this morning?

 

[92002]

I have just walked past Pitlochry Station (0725). There are two coaches waiting outside the station. Has the Inverness portion gone pear shaped this morning?

Sleeper was 2E at Pitlochry. So not it today. Current approaching Aviemore.

 

[Bill57p9]

I have just walked past Pitlochry Station (0725). There are two coaches waiting outside the station. Has the Inverness portion gone pear shaped this morning?

I'm only guessing but could possibly be cover for the Fort William portion, which ran ECS this morning.

 

[norbitonflyer]

Was that when both the former LNWR/Caledonian (London Euston) and the LNER (London Kings Cross) had trains to Aberdeen departing at broadly the same time, with whoever was the first to reach Laurencekirk declared the winner?

Off topic, but just to correct a point - when the Aberdeen races took place in 1895, prompted by the opening of the Forth Bridge which finally made the East Coast route competitive, the LNER was still nearly thirty years in the future. The East Coast partners were the Great Northern, North Eastern, and North British railways.

 

[Re6/6]

I'm only guessing but could possibly be cover for the Fort William portion, which ran ECS this morning.

A local bus and taxi company, Elizabeth Yule Transport, garage is at the north end of the approach road to Pitlochry station. Probably the buses you saw were moved out of their yard in to the satiation approach road to make room in their yard or garage.

 

[6Z09]

Looking like the Fort William disruption has continued this morning, with Empty Coaches running from Edinburgh!
I'm sure that a moonlight bus trip would have added to the memories, and made up for the hassle of being decanted at an unearthly hour.

 

[thaitransit]

Why does the Caledonian sleeper fail so often? Is it rollingstock issues or poorly maintained track? I read these trains are built by CAF if its rollingstock issues it doesn't bode well for the NSW trainlink new CAF long distance trains!

 

[najaB]

Why does the Caledonian sleeper fail so often?

It's a much more complex operation than most other TOCs. The likes of LNER just run fixed formation trains up and down the ECML, no joining, splitting, changing locos, etc*. CS on the other hand have to handle multiple splits and joins daily with several different loco types. Not to mention that that the Highland Sleeper north of Edinburgh runs along some of the most remote single-track railway in the UK. All it takes is one loco that's feeling a little grumpy or one set of points that doesn't feel like moving and the whole night's operation is thrown into chaos.

*Hyperbole for effect!

 

[thaitransit]

Interesting I assume these trains a running with new rollingstock but 50 plus year old diesel locomotives. As for the points failure are there no local track gangs they can be called in for emergency repairs while passengers wait it out. Yes that can result in a few hours delay but on a comfortable air-conditioned sleeper train with a dining car its not so bad if staff tell you whats going on

 

[Bletchleyite]

It's a much more complex operation than most other TOCs. The likes of LNER just run fixed formation trains up and down the ECML, no joining, splitting, changing locos, etc*. CS on the other hand have to handle multiple splits and joins daily with several different loco types. Not to mention that that the Highland Sleeper north of Edinburgh runs along some of the most remote single-track railway in the UK. All it takes is one loco that's feeling a little grumpy or one set of points that doesn't feel like moving and the whole night's operation is thrown into chaos.

*Hyperbole for effect!

It's also an interesting operation for enthusiasts, so every single problem it ever has is reported on this thread, whereas every delay, cancellation or short-form on LNER certainly isn't.

 

[najaB]

Interesting I assume these trains a running with new rollingstock but 50 plus year old diesel locomotives.

The Class 73s were extensively rebuilt about 5 (?) years ago so are basically new.

Edit: Looking at Wikipedia it looks like it was closer to seven years ago.

 

[lachlan]

Is the sleeper more or less reliable than sleeper operations of the past? I was under the impression splitting/joining of trains and lcoo changes used to be commonplace across the network.

 

[najaB]

Is the sleeper more or less reliable than sleeper operations of the past? I was under the impression splitting/joining of trains and lcoo changes used to be commonplace across the network.

As you say, they used to be very common. What was also more common was standby locomotive and spare carriages in sidings. So while failures are likely no more common than they were historically, they are more likely to have major knock-on effects.

 

[6Z09]

As you say, they used to be very common. What was also more common was standby locomotive and spare carriages in sidings. So while failures are likely no more common than they were historically, they are more likely to have major knock-on effects.

Very few sidings now!
A recent delay for Euston caused by driver issues, the nearest suitable driver was 200 miles away!!

 

[driverd]

In fairness, most CS issues are not related to rolling stock - I can't think of the last time the carriages weren't available. It's usually due to loco availability if anything 'train' related.

That's not to say the mk5s aren't without issue, its just that they aren't fundamentally flawed - they still roll and brake, even if the catering, water and showers aren't always working.

 

[route101]

Booked Sleeper for London to Glasgow. First time in berth on new MK5, Coach J berth 6. Price with railcard £82, just before Christmas.

 

[Essexman]

I was going to use the Aberdeen sleeper in early October but chose just to go to Edinburgh as that's more reliable.
I was planning a trip to Fort William in January but don't fancy getting turned out somewhere in the middle of the night so think I'll leave that one too.