Jacob Porrett
Established Member
When does this start please?
-
Our new ticketing site is now live! Using either this or the original site (both powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!
CAF class 197 Civity for TfW: News and updates on introduction.
- Thread starter hexagon789
- Start date
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R
RailUK Forums
nigelsporne
Member
I think it started on Monday last. Not sure though.
Its already started. Not too sure when the first day was though.
An extra 158 is being used on two Pwllheli services for peak summer holidays to make them 4 car, so it's probably moving fleets around to accommodate capacity everywhere. Most TFW main routes (North, South and Mid Wales) are busy during the summer months.
Jacob Porrett
Established Member
Fantastic.
== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==
Broken light on 197120...
Attachments
nigelsporne
Member
Oddly I saw a 158 instead of a 197 in Cardiff this week. I think, but don't really know, it was on a Shrewsbury to Cardiff turn.
BillStampy
Established Member
Will probably be fixed at Chester at some point then sent off to Derby for TGG, supposing it's available.
BenBracken
Member
Had a spin on the Cambrian last week, the TfW 158 I was on was definitely starting to feel unloved and at the end of its days, the seat I was on was broken and the toilet vandalised. I’m not sure if the maintenance schedules have been paired back in readiness for 197 introduction but it’s starting to feel like the end for them! The clickety clack over the joints was a pleasant experience though, quite noticeable the contrast to the 197s.
Whats the latest with them being introduced to the Cambrian line? It seems like a never ending wait! Considering most other routes got them over a year ago. Is Summer 2026 a realistic date for a full switch over to 197s and the 158s then leaving TFW?
simonmpoulton
Member
- Joined
- 25 Jun 2011
- Messages
- 217
It'll be a sad day when the 158's leave TFW! Aside from the poor air con on the 158's they are way more comfortable units compared to 197's!
tfw756rider
On Moderation
Exactly! Yet over in the "158s - who does them best" thread, quite a few people have said that the Transport for Wales (TfW) 158s are "the best" and "nice"
Maybe in 2021, but not in 2025. Me pointing out East Midlands Railway's 158847 didn't seem to make any difference.This isn't Speculative Discussion, so I won't name the next (last) operator of the TfW 158s, but it will be "interesting" to see how their condition will be improved for that.
Anyway, back to 197s in the 197 thread, I'm very much looking forward to the 197s entering service on the Cambrian, and this is despite me being nostalgic for 158s.
The 197s may have some downgrades compared to the 158s (suspension / ride quality, and number of seats and toilets per unit),
but they are necessary (replacing almost life-expired trains),
and do have some upgrades as well (such as a modern look, more powerful engines, "172-like" gearboxes, quicker acceleration and braking, better fuel economy, lower emissions, 1/3-2/3 doors for quicker passenger loading / unloading, better working air conditioning and power sockets, and a better Public Address / Passenger Information system (besides other things, higher speech intelligability on both automated and manual announcements, doesn't have the "blow your ears off chime followed by inaudible manual announcement" problem, and on double 197/0s, can actually make one unit say Aberystwyth and the other Pwllheli). I've also heard that for drivers, the cab isn't quite as cramped.
== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==
I'd be surprised if they weren't in service by then. They were doing several test runs in May and June 2025 following the ones in previous years, and I've been told in here that driver training won't actually take that long.
Last edited:
Cambrian359
Member
- Joined
- 17 Jun 2018
- Messages
- 305
Sorry slightly off 197 topic but You’ve mentioned in 2 different topics about not naming the next operator in that topic. Is there a topic where you have mentioned it?
One of the most annoying phrases to read on social media.
'I know this, but I'm not going to tell you, but I'm going to tell you that I know'
Class15
Established Member
Agreed!
TT-ONR-NRN
Veteran Member
Absolutely hate it. Called people out multiple times for this.
tfw756rider
On Moderation
Apologies all, but it would've been in the wrong sub-forum (and this is already the wrong topic for it as it is). @Cambrian359 @Caaardiff and @TT-ONR-NRN, I've messaged you three on conversations. @Class15, you've disabled the ability for people to do that, so unless you re-enable it, I'll be unable to do so.
Last edited:
Given the continuing appalling unreliability of Class 769, if the TfW 158s do not come to Northern, or move to another TOC that can then release other DMUs to Northern, there will be uproar. The 769s have to go as soon as possible and the TfW sets represent the only realistic replacements until new trains are expected in about 5 years time.
The 158s are regional express units. Do Northern have routes that they can be used on (which don't already have 158s on them) in order to trigger such a cascade?
There's still no confirmed plan or timescale for when 197s will work Cambrian services. 2026 has been mentioned but in what process still isn't officially confirmed.
The entire 769 program has been a disaster, TFW also suffered with them. Its a shame TFW cant loan Northern some 150s temporarily in the way Northern did for TFW a few years back. But that's for a different topic!
pokemonsuper9
Established Member
Northern run 156s, which have the same door layout as 158s on many urban routes.
Or you could send the new ones off to Cumbria/Newcastle and bring 156s over to Manchester, 156s already operate the Southport services.
Jacob Porrett
Established Member
Realtime Trains | 6G97 1006 Donnington Rft to Crewe C.S. (L&Nwr Site) | 29/07/2025
Real-time train running information for 6G97 1006 departure from Donnington Rft to Crewe C.S. (L&Nwr Site) on 29/07/2025. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.
www.realtimetrains.co.uk
66594 dragging 197025.
childwallblues
Established Member
158825 was on the Shrewsbury to Crewe shuttle this morning.
Lewisham2221
Established Member
Looks like they've started to remove the Standard Plus branding - certainly 197126 doesn't have any
tfw756rider
On Moderation
Good. They should also put "Declassified seating area - Standard Class ticket holders are welcome to use this area" notices up on the partition on the 2+2 side (even though many people have now figured it out, it could still be useful for some others). I saw similar notices when I tried out East Midlands Railway's 360s.
Does anyone know if there's going to be a "policy" with the partition doors? I've travelled in the, respectively, 9-seat and 16-seat declassified areas of an unrefurbished CrossCountry 170 and a Transport for Wales 197/1 (174-seat), with the partition doors closed on both, which I actually liked and no-one seemed to have a problem with, but might there be any likeliness of "no, it's declassified now so the doors must stay open" type stuff happening?
Last edited:
Did that unit ever get it?
Lewisham2221
Established Member
Hmm, perhaps not, now you mention it.
Bobcp
Member
197025 reported as being present at Crewe
Jacob Porrett
Established Member
Correct.
== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==
Why on the 197s do some have female announcements and some have male announcements when announcing next stations for example?
I noticed this on Friday when travelling on the 197s to/from Birmingham New Street .
Last edited:
tfw756rider
On Moderation
Huh? That's the first I've heard of that!
I was also on a 197 from Shrewsbury to Birmingham New Street on Friday 1/8/25, and although I'm pretty sure the announcements were still female-voiced (Elin), the person I was travelling with pointed out that the announcements between Wellington and Birmingham New Street were English-only/female Elin-only, with no Welsh/male Eryl part preceding them.