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Blackpool Trams News

edwin_m

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Why would you run tram trains (75mph at best) all the way to Preston on a 25kv OHLE electrified line with some sections having linespeeds of 100mph?
The existing service is likely to have long enough gaps for a slower one to fit between, and a through service to Preston would be more attractive for passengers to/from St Annes and vicinity. Otherwise, if going somewhere like Manchester, they'd have to change twice in a short time.
 
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The Pelican

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A Blackpool South pier-Preston tram train and a Fleetwood tram-train would enable a few easy direct connections an hour. It would be most useful for places which don't have a direct Blackpool service, like London most of the time. Manchester already has a direct Blackpool service, so moving the interchange from a train to a tram to Preston wouldn't help as much.

The main question is whether it should be run with only a single stop, to keep speeds reasonable, or stopping at all stops- which would be slow and expensive in building work. Possibly different stopping patterns on each of 4tph would be the way to go.

I think the biggest advantage would be to make connections from places with Preston trains to Blackpool easier, and secondly to make travel between Blackpool seafront and Preston itself easier.

I'd hope the 62 mph speed of existing UK tram trains vs the 100mph highest linespeed wouldn't make too much difference in end to end journey times, due to the need for the 100mph trains to get up to speed etc.
 

Acathater

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A Blackpool South pier-Preston tram train and a Fleetwood tram-train would enable a few easy direct connections an hour. It would be most useful for places which don't have a direct Blackpool service, like London most of the time. Manchester already has a direct Blackpool service, so moving the interchange from a train to a tram to Preston wouldn't help as much.

The main question is whether it should be run with only a single stop, to keep speeds reasonable, or stopping at all stops- which would be slow and expensive in building work. Possibly different stopping patterns on each of 4tph would be the way to go.

I think the biggest advantage would be to make connections from places with Preston trains to Blackpool easier, and secondly to make travel between Blackpool seafront and Preston itself easier.

I'd hope the 62 mph speed of existing UK tram trains vs the 100mph highest linespeed wouldn't make too much difference in end to end journey times, due to the need for the 100mph trains to get up to speed etc.
where do you propose to fit these into the timetable? During the day there seems to be Preston-Blackpool departures around every ten minutes - is there space for more? And where at Preston do you propose reversing them without blocking platforms 1/2? Even if you used the parcels platforms you would have problems
 

LancasterRed

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Could the unused bay off Platform 3 not be brought in? I don't know much about it other than 'it's there' - and I heavily doubt there's any scope for the tram trains to come off the line on, say, Tom Benson Way. Realistically even if the trams were extended I don't see them getting beyond Kirkham
 

Acathater

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Could the unused bay off Platform 3 not be brought in? I don't know much about it other than 'it's there' - and I heavily doubt there's any scope for the tram trains to come off the line on, say, Tom Benson Way. Realistically even if the trams were extended I don't see them getting beyond Kirkham
that's about big enough for a steam loco and tender, I don't think you'd fit a train in there. Not convinced the platform is wide enough to be safe. But again you'd be blocking a platform as you crossed- this time departures on 3
 

The Pelican

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I'd assume two low-floor bay platforms would be built on the parcels platforms, or a small tram-train terminus north of Fishergate near Pitt Street. In either case, there doesn't seem to be a need to interfere with the West Coast Mainline tracks. I think a future phase of the project might extend a tram train route into central Preston, but I wouldn't make that part of the first phase!

As for the timetable, it would depend on whether the tram trains were going to provide stopping or faster services- I think 6 tph isn't too intensive, so 10tph might also be possible!
 

EyeKay

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Bring back the four track line Kirkham- Preston. It will only add a couple of hundred million to the bill!!
 

43010

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It has been announced that Tramtown at Rigby Road is now permanently closed, due to the building being 'uninhabitable':

Summary of video (for visually impaired/blind/deaf users):

Cllr Paul Galley (Anchorsholme ward member on Blackpool Council and founder and volunteer coordinator at Tramtown), sitting in the driver's seat of a stationary car, summarises a recent meeting with the new Managing Director and Heritage Manager at Blackpool Transport:
  • The fitting shop building was reported to be uninhabitable, despite several recent events where people have been allowed to enter the building
  • It is planned to bid for funding for the tram shed, but there is no guarantee said funding will be secured
  • Following the permanent closure of Tramtown at Rigby Road, it has been proposed that Tramtown may become a 'pop-up' operation based at various sites in Blackpool and Fleetwood, although it is unclear how this would work in practice
  • There was no appetite for Tramtown becoming part of the Blackpool Heritage Museum Trust
  • There were said to be unanswered questions regarding the use of monies previously donated to Tramtown
Cllr Galley concludes the video by thanking the volunteers and supporters of Tramtown for their contributions. Finally, there is a slideshow (accompanied by music) of various photos taken at Tramtown, showing activities including vehicle maintenance and depot tours.
 
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Howardh

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It has been announced that Tramtown at Rigby Road is now permanently closed, due to the building being 'uninhabitable': Facebook video by Paul Galley announcing permanent closure of Tramtown at Rigby Road
Sad. What will happen to the trams, could they end up at other heritage sites (I believe there's a tram museum in Derbyshire)? Could the single deckers run on the Metrolink lines as a Sunday heritage service, we have a couple of transport museums (at least) in Manchester/Bury?

As for today, if the Fleetwood lime isn't to be heavy rail; I've always liked the idea of tram/tram-trains from Poulton to Fleetwood via Broadwater (ie joining the current tram line near the cricket club) and looking at the plans, seems there's no need to connect to the rail network at Poulton or use the current station.

The southern line could extend from Squires Gate to - wherever; Lytham terminus where the heavy rail would start - or to Kirkham itself, but the line would need doubling/passing loops to enable more services per hour.

Southern Line; Kirkham to Blackpoool North via Squires Gate
Coastal Line; Squires Gate to Fleetwood
Northern Line; Blackpool North to Fleetwood
Fleetwood Line; Poulton to Fleetwood.
 

Bald Rick

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There are four buses per hour Blackpool to Lytham (Service 11) so clearly there is a tram-like level of demand. Running that level of service right through to Kirkham, however, would be overkill in my view. There are previous threads on this, but my plan would be:-

▪︎ Truncate heavy rail at St. Annes.

▪︎ Convert St. Annes to Squres Gate to tramway and connect to existing terminus at Starr Gate.

▪︎ Abandon Squires Gate to Blackpool South.

▪︎ Parallel single lines tramway / heavy rail St. Annes to Lytham making use of the former double track formation.

This has the advantage of still giving St. Annes and Lytham through heavy rail services to Preston and beyond, yet enabling the tramway to reach Lytham.

Local government reorganisation will give Blackpool a much enlarged area - there are various options yet to be decided. This might be the spur to tramway expansion - previously Blackpool was reluctant to consider new routes outside its boundaries, and there were even mutterings about closing Bispham to Fleetwood ( currently in Wyre).

We’ve done trams on the Blackpool South line many times before on these pages, and the above is almost exactly what I proposed in one of those. The difference being the link between the heavy rail and tram line would be just south of the Pleasure Beach, as doing it at Sauires Gate will be expensive. With battery trains and some works to Moss Side Level Crossing that would enable a half hourly service to St Annes.

All figment of the imagination though. No one will be spending that amount of money there, not least because almost all the users of the #11 bus are travelling for free.
 

NiceCuppa

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It has been announced that Tramtown at Rigby Road is now permanently closed, due to the building being 'uninhabitable': Facebook video by Paul Galley announcing permanent closure of Tramtown at Rigby Road
The 'Vintage ' Trams, and the illuminated ones ( ship / train etc) were always run by really enthusiastic volunteers who really knew what they were talking about.
We were led to believe it was the Rapid new service trams that were at odds with the Heritage trams and that's why they'd been off the promenade runs
. I thought then that it was a bit of Corporate BS.
Really hope that the Tram guys get to the bottom of the missing money.
Good luck, and thanks for the post.
 

pokemonsuper9

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Could the single deckers run on the Metrolink lines as a Sunday heritage service,
While that would be cool, the heritage trams are low floor trams but the Metrolink network is all high floor.
I would imagine that could cause some clearance issues in addition to boarding issues.
And depot space issues.
 

NCT

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Blackpool's transport investment case will come when its economic role starts to evolves into one of a Manchester / Liverpool commuter town and its resident demographic starts to resemble that of Brighton's.
 

Bletchleyite

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Blackpool's transport investment case will come when its economic role starts to evolves into one of a Manchester / Liverpool commuter town and its resident demographic starts to resemble that of Brighton's.

Though that's unlikely to involve old trams, to be fair.

With Blackpool Council set to be disbanded and the future of Blackpool Transport Ltd a bit unclear as a result, I wonder if there's an element of tidying up loose ends here with the potential for tendering its operations (bus and tram) if the new larger unitary prefers?
 

AlastairFraser

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The existing service is likely to have long enough gaps for a slower one to fit between, and a through service to Preston would be more attractive for passengers to/from St Annes and vicinity. Otherwise, if going somewhere like Manchester, they'd have to change twice in a short time.
A tram train Blackpool North station - tramway to Squires Gate - converted rail line to Kirkham and Wesham would provide a single change to both Manchester and Leeds/York from multiple stations on the proposed route.
Don't forget that Kirkham and Wesham has 2tph to Manchester Airport and 1tph to York in the current timetable. It's only Liverpool that requires an extra change and that isn't a destination with a lot of patronage from anywhere in the Fylde really.
Not to mention that Kirkham and Wesham is a much easier place to change at than Preston.
I'd hope the 62 mph speed of existing UK tram trains vs the 100mph highest linespeed wouldn't make too much difference in end to end journey times, due to the need for the 100mph trains to get up to speed etc.
It's 17 miles 42 chains from Blackpool North to Preston, which currently takes around 23 mins on the fastest services.
Blackpool South to Preston is 19 miles 73 chains, the fastest rail services take around 36 mins. This is with a 75 mph capable unit.
With the higher line speed for the 7.6 miles Kirkham and Wesham to Preston, you'd be slowing from 75mph to 62 mph.
Even with faster acceleration up to 62mph, you'd still lose a few seconds and take up valuable paths on the mainline.
Realistically even if the trams were extended I don't see them getting beyond Kirkham
Exactly.
As for the timetable, it would depend on whether the tram trains were going to provide stopping or faster services- I think 6 tph isn't too intensive, so 10tph might also be possible!
Where are you going to fit the existing Blackpool North to Manchester Airport and York services? Cancel them and make everyone change at Preston?!
All figment of the imagination though. No one will be spending that amount of money there, not least because almost all the users of the #11 bus are travelling for free.
I wouldn't write if off, there's a lot of big employers in the area who could do with better public transport access and the new Lancashire Combined County Authority (LCCA) will hold some significant transport funding powers (as part of the devolution settlement I believe).
As for today, if the Fleetwood lime isn't to be heavy rail; I've always liked the idea of tram/tram-trains from Poulton to Fleetwood via Broadwater (ie joining the current tram line near the cricket club) and looking at the plans, seems there's no need to connect to the rail network at Poulton or use the current station.
Yes, if you weren't bothered about a Network Rail connection, you could terminate the tram line at the Poulton end a hundred metres or so west of the junction and provide a ramp-based bridge connecting it to the western side of Breck Road overbridge in Poulton (opposite the entrance to Poulton station).
Who will be the body that will finance these aspirational new services?
Potentially the LCCA could fund it - read about their work here. https://lancashire-cca.gov.uk/
Blackpool's transport investment case will come when its economic role starts to evolves into one of a Manchester / Liverpool commuter town and its resident demographic starts to resemble that of Brighton's.
I doubt that it will ever be a Manchester/Liverpool commuter town tbh. It might attract commuters for the increasing number of large businesses looking to relocate to the Preston area, as @Xenophon PCDGS has suggested.
With Blackpool Council set to be disbanded and the future of Blackpool Transport Ltd a bit unclear as a result, I wonder if there's an element of tidying up loose ends here with the potential for tendering its operations (bus and tram) if the new larger unitary prefers?
I think it will continue to be municipally owned, but perhaps ownership will be transferred to the new unitary with the former Wyre and Fylde district parts contributing financially to the transfer.
 

Dstock7080

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Blackpool Transport’s view of the heritage operation:
A bold vision for the future of Blackpool’s famous heritage trams is taking shape ahead of the launch of summer tours featuring several vintage vehicles.

The ambitious plans include a permanent home for the historic fleet, as well as regular trips on the seafront by some of the heritage trams.
Not sure how they expect to fund this, considering the recent £½M bailout from the council to just keep afloat?
 

Towers

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Blackpool Transport’s view of the heritage operation:

Not sure how they expect to fund this, considering the recent £½M bailout from the council to just keep afloat?
Hopefully some sort of proper, coordinated fundraising; maybe some Lottery money etc?
 
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davehsug

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Still no sign of a summer timetable starting. The current 15 minute end to end, with every other tram via North Station, is just not going to cope as the town gets busier. I'm told it's due to the number of trams out of service, which seems like pretty shocking stuff from "the tram operator of the year".
 

G_A_C_C_C

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Just found this on the "British Trams Online" site in my hunt for 017....
005 (last ran July 2022), 010 (last ran August 2025), 012 (last ran December 2025) and 017 (last ran December 2025) are currently unavailable for service.

Might also help to explain the lack of an increased summer timetable with 4 of 18 OOS
 

50002Superb

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Just found this on the "British Trams Online" site in my hunt for 017....
005 (last ran July 2022), 010 (last ran August 2025), 012 (last ran December 2025) and 017 (last ran December 2025) are currently unavailable for service.

Might also help to explain the lack of an increased summer timetable with 4 of 18 OOS
Do you have a link please?
 
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It's even worse than that. A temporary speed limit has been placed on all operational trams, resulting in a longer journey time from this weekend. There are a lot of problems with the fleet, which it seems aren't up to being battered by the Irish Sea's gales for 10 months of the year.
 

Tramfan

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It's even worse than that. A temporary speed limit has been placed on all operational trams, resulting in a longer journey time from this weekend. There are a lot of problems with the fleet, which it seems aren't up to being battered by the Irish Sea's gales for 10 months of the year.
Good grief, they were struggling to maintain the timetable as it is the other weekend, lots of late running and trams turning short to recover time
 

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