Azuma seating

[tfw756rider]

But the "intended squishyness" of this seat design is very poor, so I don't really see what that would solve.

Not much, but I suppose that's what the longer term plan is for.

 

[Yorkshire09876]

Don't the Mk5a sets have the same seats too? They got so little use with TPE that the cushion collapse problem didn't occur, but it's possibly something for people who use Chiltern to look forward to!

 

[Bletchleyite]

I was thinking the same thing, the 'intended' design is still abysmal - the seats aren't fit for the job. The standard should be an equal to the 90/mk4, and nothing sort of completely replacing the seats can offer a good result.

Have those who say this tried a TfW 197 or first class in a 730/2?

 

[takno]

I would have said a better use of public money would be to immediately reseat these once a better option has been identified. Logical better option would be the seating fitted to the new Avanti units, not perfect by any means, but enough to certainly make me travel standard rather than first when writing for anything more than an hour with lner

I would guess that the extreme underperformance of the seats might mean that they can get the seat manufacturer or leasing company to cough up for new cushions in the short term.

I'd definitely agree that the frames need to go completely before I'll be able to travel in standard class on LNER. The Avanti/Lumo ones would certainly do, even if Lumo currently have their own issues with going for cheap cloth coverings. Changing the frames is an expensive change though, which is tough to justify when the trains aren't exactly running empty.

It would also be nice if there was more than one kind of seat in the market, so it would be good to test out some other options on a smaller fleet. There's also the fancy new micro-spring technology they are trying out on some trains, which could make for rather better seats in the longer term.

Rubbish Interview, 90% managementspeak PR waffle, helped along by a chuumy interviewer. That's what you get these days, Youtube influencers such as this chap and that Geoff lad who are given access because they are happy to toe the company line in exchange.

It's a bit harsh to describe the former chair of the Strategic Rail Authority as a YouTube influencer trading access for softball questions. He's no Paxman, and nobody would call his former organisation a huge success, but interviews in the specialist railway press have never exactly been Frost/Nixon.

 

[trainbow]

Don't the Mk5a sets have the same seats too? They got so little use with TPE that the cushion collapse problem didn't occur, but it's possibly something for people who use Chiltern to look forward to!

Correct - they are both Fainsa Sophia.

A product that Fainsa advertise as a seat for regional rail (I.e. short journeys) - not intercity.

 

[Blindtraveler]

And given the quality, I bet many regional operations don't even buy them, and wouldn't surprise me if they had a warehouse of 50thousand of them going cheap. Just waiting for a rash of new train orders like we had being placed a decade or so back

 

[Mikey C]

Correct - they are both Fainsa Sophia.

A product that Fainsa advertise as a seat for regional rail (I.e. short journeys) - not intercity.

Just because they're a regional seat, that doesn't mean the cushions can't be as durable. Indeed you'd expect them to be more durable, as they have more people getting up and sitting down on them.

The Thameslink 700 seats for example are fairly unpleasant, but have lasted really well. They look much the same as when they entered service.

 

[trainbow]

Just because they're a regional seat, that doesn't mean the cushions can't be as durable. Indeed you'd expect them to be more durable, as they have more people getting up and sitting down on them.

The Thameslink 700 seats for example are fairly unpleasant, but have lasted really well. They look much the same as when they entered service.

Absolutely true. My comment was thinking about the poor design for long journeys, as opposed to the build quality, which was obviously what was in question.

Let’s see how LNER’s are after refresh.

You’re right about the 700s, I use them almost daily and they’re almost the same as they always were. (Off topic, but I’ve see a lot of internal PIS failures suddenly this year).

 

[BRX]

The cl 700 seats are significantly more comfortable than the collapsed IET seats. I'd rather sit on an ironing board than a metal bar.

 

[RacsoMoquette]

I was recently travelling with Chiltern Railways on a 20+ year old Class 168. It was smooth, comfortable and felt modern even though it is an aging fleet. With the fleet undergoing a referbishment as of presant, they should feel even more comfortable. The lovely padded seating and pleasant Turbostar lighting was fantastic.

It seems downright bonkers that the 5+year old UK Hitatchi 800 series of trains are showing such early signs of build quality issues. There are many older trains in England that have had the same seat since new. Albeit referbished. How can the seating on the Hitatchi 800s be so appallingly built?

I prefer travelling on the WCML as the Avanti Class 390s offer are far superior travel environment to their compettitors the LNER Azuma.

 

[thomalex]

I was recently travelling with Chiltern Railways on a 20+ year old Class 168. It was smooth, comfortable and felt modern even though it is an aging fleet. With the fleet undergoing a referbishment as of presant, they should feel even more comfortable. The lovely padded seating and pleasant Turbostar lighting was fantastic.

It seems downright bonkers that the 5+year old UK Hitatchi 800 series of trains are showing such early signs of build quality issues. There are many older trains in England that have had the same seat since new. Albeit referbished. How can the seating on the Hitatchi 800s be so appallingly built?

I prefer travelling on the WCML as the Avanti Class 390s offer are far superior travel environment to their compettitors the LNER Azuma.

I don't think it's just early signs, the seats have completely collapsed on the GWR fleet and are rapidly heading there with the Azumas.

To me I'm surprised there isn't grounds for a legal challenge to the manufacturer. I doubt failing within a few years will have been to the spec.

 

[DelW]

I was recently travelling with Chiltern Railways on a 20+ year old Class 168. It was smooth, comfortable and felt modern even though it is an aging fleet. With the fleet undergoing a referbishment as of presant, they should feel even more comfortable. The lovely padded seating and pleasant Turbostar lighting was fantastic.

It seems downright bonkers that the 5+year old UK Hitatchi 800 series of trains are showing such early signs of build quality issues. There are many older trains in England that have had the same seat since new. Albeit referbished. How can the seating on the Hitatchi 800s be so appallingly built?

To be fair to Hitachi, the seats were neither made nor chosen by them, but were specified and chosen by the DfT. I think I've seen it suggested previously that Hitachi themselves weren't keen on the choice made. However, if the maintenance of the trains is their responsibility, they ought by now to be replacing seat bases on GWR trains much sooner than they have been.

Two trips on GWR 800s last week showed this. One seat was fine - hard as they've always been, but quite adequate. The other was most uncomfortable - even on a relatively short trip, I was constantly shifting around trying to ease the discomfort of sitting on basically a metal bar. Unfortunately that train was too busy to make moving an option. It is poor when the same company's 30 year old suburban Turbos are markedly more comfortable than their flagship long distance fleet.

 

[Mikey C]

Are the seats on the Hull Trains 802s the same, or just younger, so the seat base hasn't collapsed yet?

 

[Yorkshire09876]

Are the seats on the Hull Trains 802s the same, or just younger, so the seat base hasn't collapsed yet?

Same seats.

 

[Solent_Desiro]

The seats on the Lumo units are way more comfortable

 

[FrontSideBus]

I was recently travelling with Chiltern Railways on a 20+ year old Class 168. It was smooth, comfortable and felt modern even though it is an aging fleet. With the fleet undergoing a referbishment as of presant, they should feel even more comfortable. The lovely padded seating and pleasant Turbostar lighting was fantastic.

It seems downright bonkers that the 5+year old UK Hitatchi 800 series of trains are showing such early signs of build quality issues. There are many older trains in England that have had the same seat since new. Albeit referbished. How can the seating on the Hitatchi 800s be so appallingly built?

I prefer travelling on the WCML as the Avanti Class 390s offer are far superior travel environment to their compettitors the LNER Azuma.

I recently travelled on an 50 year old Chiltern Mk3 and I was surprised at how far standards have fallen in terms of ride and seating since the Mk3!

 

[GWRrrr]

I wonder whether somebody could give us a summary of the various IETs and their seat type. I think that might be 'interesting'.

 

[Yorkshire09876]

I wonder whether somebody could give us a summary of the various IETs and their seat type. I think that might be 'interesting'.

Most of them have the awful Fainsa Sophia seats (GWR, LNER, TPE, Hull Trains). The Lumo and Avanti ones have different ones (a new Transcal design I think - standard class version also used in Pendolinos). 810s also different (Fisa?).

 

[Mzzzs]

Most of them have the awful Fainsa Sophia seats (GWR, LNER, TPE, Hull Trains). The Lumo and Avanti ones have different ones (a new Transcal design I think - standard class version also used in Pendolinos). 810s also different (Fisa?).

810s use FISA LEAN but has been adapted by EMR.

 

[Bletchleyite]

810s use FISA LEAN but has been adapted by EMR.

First class on Avanti is also FISA LEAN. I forget what it is in the others but it's something from Fainsa.

 

[williamn]

I swear that readers of this forum have more sensitive posteriors than the rest of the population. I travel frequently on LNER and find the seats totally fine.

 

[tfw756rider]

I swear that readers of this forum have more sensitive posteriors than the rest of the population. I travel frequently on LNER and find the seats totally fine.

Totally fine? On the Azumas? You somehow don't feel the metal bar? Unless some sort of fix has actually been applied...

 

[physics34]

I swear that readers of this forum have more sensitive posteriors than the rest of the population. I travel frequently on LNER and find the seats totally fine.

Totally unsuitable for long journeys.

 

[tfw756rider]

Totally unsuitable for long journeys.

Arguably, even shorter journeys.

 

[FrontSideBus]

Like sitting bolt upright on a rock hard seat?

 

[tfw756rider]

Like sitting bolt upright on a rock hard seat?

Some people do, apparently (for some reason).
"I don't know what you're on about, there's nothing wrong with them".

 

[class26]

I swear that readers of this forum have more sensitive posteriors than the rest of the population. I travel frequently on LNER and find the seats totally fine.

I challenge you travel from London to Abnerdeen or Inverness on a 800

 

[D6130]

I challenge you travel from London to Abnerdeen or Inverness on a 800

I've done both....and it wasn't a pleasant experience, even in first class. Took my - admittedly delicate - back several days to recover in both cases.

 

[800001]

I challenge you travel from London to Abnerdeen or Inverness on a 800

I haves standard, full journey, no issues.

Seating is subjective (if that's the word)

 

[Tester]

I haves standard, full journey, no issues.

Seating is subjective (if that's the word)

Yes, but you are an 800