Arriva Rail North DOO

[LOL The Irony]

I've said this before & I'll say it again, the rmt is shooting itself in the foot and is proving why there should be DOO on Northern.

 

[PR1Berske]

I’d rather write to my MP and ask why the DfT has embarked on a number of needless, politically motivated industrial disputes which have cost tens if not hundreds of millions, caused untold disruption and are proving ultimately fruitless at some TOCs!

I'd like to ask the RMT that very same question!

 

[LOL The Irony]

I'd like to ask the RMT that very same question!

Join the club.

 

[Overspeed110]

I've said this before & I'll say it again, the rmt is shooting itself in the foot and is proving why there should be DOO on Northern.

You're in the minority in thinking that, but please enlighten us, why should there be DOO on Northern?

 

[Overspeed110]

Well I'm in the third biggest depot in Northern. I speak to guards daily.

Only 1 person has declared they would vote to end the strike.

Also I dont know of 1 driver who is going to accept DOO.

I know this spoils your eastern view but there it is. Only 1 person has turned in on the west during strikes. How many over the dark side?

I used to work on the west in FNW days, but still keep in touch with a few drivers still there. Speaking to them recently about the whole Northern DOO thing, they are all of the opinion of the post above.

As I've said before , I still say that Mr Moonshot is not a guard, just a troll with a little inside information, possibly even a Northern manager intent on pursuing the "divide and conquer" line.

 

[LOL The Irony]

You're in the minority in thinking that, but please enlighten us, why should there be DOO on Northern?

I'm against DOO but the rmt is making it harder and harder to keep my opinion. The rmt fails to understand what they're fully doing, they're proving to the out of loop passengers why there shouldn't be a guard; no guard = less strikes in their eyes.

 

[mandub]

Rumour is 3 more Saturday's. 15th, 22nd & 29th September.
That'd make 6 Saturday's on the bounce

 

[Moonshot]

Rumour is 3 more Saturday's. 15th, 22nd & 29th September.
That'd make 6 Saturday's on the bounce

Which is what I heard sometime ago. You would have to wonder just what the situation would be today if the RMT had simply called for a ban on rest day working and everyone just work a flat week. That would probably equate to around 10% of trains being cancelled every day.

 

[driver_m]

I used to work on the west in FNW days, but still keep in touch with a few drivers still there. Speaking to them recently about the whole Northern DOO thing, they are all of the opinion of the post above.

As I've said before , I still say that Mr Moonshot is not a guard, just a troll with a little inside information, possibly even a Northern manager intent on pursuing the "divide and conquer" line.

Probably not wrong there. In the course of the job, I speak to plenty of their staff and they're all unanimous on one thing. The company being the worst they've ever worked for. The amount that say even FNW weren't as incompetent or as bad as these speaks volumes. And they were not good. Many of my own colleagues who worked with FNW can vouch for how bad they were in the past, as they usually use it as a way of keeping any of our moaners in check, who've never experienced a truly awful company. So make of that what you will. I wouldn't be surprised now if Northern staff now get told not to speak to other rail staff now as they are probably aware of just how low their stock is within the industry. Certainly gone rapidly downhill even from the days of Alex Haynes or whatever his name was.

 

[YorkshireLad]

Strikes every Saturday until October confirmed

https://www.rmt.org.uk/news/strike-...ates-on-northern-rail-announced/?preview=true

That'll endear the unions to the football fans

 

[Kite159]

Strikes every Saturday until October confirmed

https://www.rmt.org.uk/news/strike-...ates-on-northern-rail-announced/?preview=true

That'll endear the unions to the football fans

And in case the press release changes

RMT Press Office

RMT confirms action goes ahead Saturday and announces further strike dates on Northern Rail in fight over guards and rail safety as company refuses serious talks

RAIL UNION RMT confirmed today that further strike action will take place on Arriva Rail North over attacks on the role of the safety-critical guard and the extension of Driver Only Operation in the name of increased profits. The scheduled programme of action from Saturday also goes ahead exactly as planned.


RMT has announced the fresh wave of action after the company refused point blank to engage in serious and meaningful talks. The union accused company bosses of stringing its negotiators along rather than looking seriously for a settlement when there has been an opportunity to strike an agreement on the ‎guard guarantee that matches the best practice in the industry.


‎The new phase of action is as follows;


All Arriva Rail North Conductor, Conductor Instructor and Train Driver members are instructed to take action as follows:
Not to book on for on for duty between:

• 00.01 hours and 23.59 hours on Saturday 15th September 2018
• 00.01 hours and 23.59 hours on Saturday 22nd September 2018
• 00.01 hours and 23.59 hours on Saturday 29th September 2018

It comes in addition to the existing programme of action which goes ahead as planned;


• 00:01 and 23:59 on Saturday 25th August 2018,
• 00:01 and 23:59 on Saturday 1st September 2018
• 00:01 and 23:59 on Saturday 8th September 2018.


RMT General Secretary Mick Cash said:


“RMT has made every effort to get serious and meaningful talks going with Northern but instead of making progress towards a settlement that matches the best practice in the rail industry as negotiated elsewhere the company have opted instead to play and fast and loose making a mockery of the exercise. It is the pig headed and arrogant attitude of the company that has forced us to announce this next phase of action and to confirm that the strikes planned from Saturday go ahead.


“RMT members on Arriva Rail North have been in dispute for well over a year now in a battle to put public safety before private profit and we are angry and frustrated that a genuine opportunity to reach an agreement has been kicked back by the company.


“German-owned Northern Rail want to run nearly half a million trains a year without a safety critical guard on board in a move that would wreck both safety and access ‎to services and they should listen to their front-line staff and pull back from that plan immediately.


"RMT recently secured an agreement on Greater Anglia that enshrine the guard guarantee. Similar agreements have also been reached in Wales and Scotland. Arriva Rail North need to do the right thing and come to an agreement that secures a guard on their trains too.


“We thank the public for their support and understanding throughout this dispute over rail safety and access and the union remains ready for genuine and serious talks.”

Usual style of press release, nothing ever changes

 

[Robertj21a]

Strikes every Saturday until October confirmed

https://www.rmt.org.uk/news/strike-...ates-on-northern-rail-announced/?preview=true

That'll endear the unions to the football fans

Various posters on this forum have stated previously that they're not bothered by public opinion as 'everybody hates unions anyway'.

 

[northwichcat]

I've said this before & I'll say it again, the rmt is shooting itself in the foot and is proving why there should be DOO on Northern.

You're in the minority in thinking that, but please enlighten us, why should there be DOO on Northern?

I've yet to hear one passenger say they'd prefer the service they are planning to catch to be cancelled opposed to having it run without a second member of staff. Yet I've heard passengers say hundreds of times that they consider it a joke that a service can be cancelled because there isn't a guard available.

 

[Carlisle]

they usually use it as a way of keeping any of our moaners in check, who've never experienced a truly awful company. .

Do you seriously think barely any non railway worker would see a resemblance between an average train drivers wage & conditions and the phrase ‘truly awful company’,?

 

[northwichcat]

According to Richard Allan, Northern's Deputy MD, the RMT agreed to partake in ACAS mediated talks last Friday. It sounds like the left hand of the RMT doesn't know it even has a right hand!

 

[scrapy]

According to Richard Allan, Northern's Deputy MD, the RMT agreed to partake in ACAS mediated talks last Friday. It sounds like the left hand of the RMT doesn't know it even has a right hand!

The RMT have agreed to take part in both ACAS talks and direct talks. The company has yet to set a date for these to happen. The RMT remain to be convinced however these are anything other than a delay tactic by the company to a call of strikes. The RMT have said if meaningful progress is made strikes can be called off but remain to be convinced after being messed around last time.

 

[footprints]

"The sooner DOO comes in the better" seems to be the overwhelming theme of messages to the RMT on Twitter after today's announcement. Does Cash really believe the public still back his pointless strikes as seems to be the claim in every press release/embarrassing rant?

 

[PR1Berske]

Passengers making alternative plans for Saturdays rather than risk strikes; passengers making alternative plans for Sundays rather than risk Northern cutting every other train. I wonder what the long term consequences are for this franchise, for the RMT, for the payments to/from the DfT, and for investment across Northern England, as a result of weekend travel becoming such an uncertain gamble.

 

[Eccles1983]

Do you seriously think barely any non railway worker would see a resemblance between an average train drivers wage & conditions and the phrase ‘truly awful company’,? I doubt it

If they understood what was going on, and then compared it to other companies then I'm sure they would.

But that said, what non railway workers think about my terms and conditions are very low in my priorities. Much like their terms and conditions in their jobs are of little interest to me.

You seem the jealous type chap.

 

[Moonshot]

I wonder if ACAS would suggest a second ballot?

You would also have to wonder if the 6 Sundays after the strike days are going to be overbooked with guards volunteering to work. Certainly there will be no rostering issues to prevent everyone offering their services.

 

[wingsoveryorks]

Of course it is bad news for passengers. It's a war out there, and in war innocent people get hurt. But the target of the union members, and lets not forget it is the members, not Mick Cash who is driving this forward. The target is the managers who in the early days thought it was such fun to break away from their desks and play trains. Now 24 strikes down the line the fun has stopped, and every Saturday in September should soften them a bit more.
Just for the record a good many of us are planning a barbecue Sunday as well, for those who are not familiar with the term, when asked to cover a uncovered shift on a Sunday, we can't we are all having a barbecue.

I know it must be very hard for so many to join us in the real world here. But myself I am proud of my colleagues that for the sake of safety, and for disabled access to the trains that you take for granted, they ae prepared to lose thousands of pounds. They are a credit to the trade union movement in a selfish world.

 

[PR1Berske]

Of course it is bad news for passengers. It's a war out there, and in war innocent people get hurt. But the target of the union members, and lets not forget it is the members, not Mick Cash who is driving this forward. The target is the managers who in the early days thought it was such fun to break away from their desks and play trains. Now 24 strikes down the line the fun has stopped, and every Saturday in September should soften them a bit more.
Just for the record a good many of us are planning a barbecue Sunday as well, for those who are not familiar with the term, when asked to cover a uncovered shift on a Sunday, we can't we are all having a barbecue.

I know it must be very hard for so many to join us in the real world here. But myself I am proud of my colleagues that for the sake of safety, and for disabled access to the trains that you take for granted, they ae prepared to lose thousands of pounds. They are a credit to the trade union movement in a selfish world.

Would you welcome a second ballot?

 

[wingsoveryorks]

I wonder if ACAS would suggest a second ballot?

You would also have to wonder if the 6 Sundays after the strike days are going to be overbooked with guards volunteering to work. Certainly there will be no rostering issues to prevent everyone offering their services.

Oh wise one do tell us. Why do you think Northern won't entertain Sundays as being part of the working week. Enlighten us with your wisdom.

 

[wingsoveryorks]

Would you welcome a second ballot?

No. Because as a guard I will tell you in all truth the support is rock solid. In fact, I will go further, it is more solid now than it ever was. What David Brown and the directors can't fathom is why the newbies are rock solid as well. He thought a influx of new conductors would weaken the case, it has proved the opposite. The reason is simple, when you do the job you see the truth.

 

[PR1Berske]

No. Because as a guard I will tell you in all truth the support is rock solid. In fact, I will go further, it is more solid now than it ever was. What David Brown and the directors can't fathom is why the newbies are rock solid as well. He thought a influx of new conductors would weaken the case, it has proved the opposite. The reason is simple, when you do the job you see the truth.

But if the opinion is rock solid, you'd win a second ballot, wouldn't you?

 

[Moonshot]

No. Because as a guard I will tell you in all truth the support is rock solid. In fact, I will go further, it is more solid now than it ever was. What David Brown and the directors can't fathom is why the newbies are rock solid as well. He thought a influx of new conductors would weaken the case, it has proved the opposite. The reason is simple, when you do the job you see the truth.

Absolute garbage, but in any event, you could prove me wrong with a second ballot which according to you would go even more in favour of strike action. So what is there to lose?

 

[wingsoveryorks]

Absolute garbage, but in any event, you could prove me wrong with a second ballot which according to you would go even more in favour of strike action. So what is there to lose?

I think when it comes to garbage old love, you have a monopoly of speaking it. I have to say this, I have no real time for this site and only pop along when I'm truly bored and the moon is blue. But I have read some of your posts. I'd be embarrassed at my ignorance if I was you.
However I will answer your question. There is no need for a second ballot. If people wanted to end the strike they would roll up on Saturday morning, but they won't will they. There is your answer Sherlock

 

[wingsoveryorks]

But if the opinion is rock solid, you'd win a second ballot, wouldn't you?

No need for further ballots. Just turn up for work, swipe on. Now why aren't we?

 

[Moonshot]

I think when it comes to garbage old love, you have a monopoly of speaking it. I have to say this, I have no real time for this site and only pop along when I'm truly bored and the moon is blue. But I have read some of your posts. I'd be embarrassed at my ignorance if I was you.
However I will answer your question. There is no need for a second ballot. If people wanted to end the strike they would roll up on Saturday morning, but they won't will they. There is your answer Sherlock

Are you for real ?

 

[wingsoveryorks]

Are you for real ?

Is that the best you can do to continue the discussion? Write "Are you for real" Sounds like a teenager who has no clue how to debate.