A career as a train driver

[driver9000]

What pecentage of drivers generally just stick to the allocated shifts (ie mix of lates and earlies) and what percentage tend to enter swap agreements? Just curious really.

Are there more people out ther for example who would prefer all earlies but there's not enough people wishing to swap the other way (or perhaps the other way around)?

Personally I simply follow the link and do the turns as they come round. Earlies and lates both have their advantages and disadvantages. There is little in the way of regular swapping lines of work with each other at my depot, unless someone needs earlies/lates for a particular week then as long as there are no traction/route issues and we don't break Hidden then there is no problem with a mutual swap.

 

[Latecomer]

Thanks all for your replies on the shift-swapping issue.

 

[Buffer68]

I was at work in a shop yesterday and a guy wanted some help - turned out he was a driver for South West Trains. As I am very interested in working on the railways (latecomer at 43!) I asked him how easy it was to become a driver. He said it wasn't easy due to the lack of vacancies and it had taken him 5 years to become a driver.

Is this normal or did he perhaps apply when jobs were scarce - I don't know how long he has been a driver.

Also if it is going to take a while to achieve driver, I guess I would be best applying for a station based job or as a guard and then apply for driver as well.

Also does anyone here know whether freight driving jobs are easier to a) find in the first place and b)get into especially later in life.

Thanks.

 

[choo~choo]

The thing you find these days is that the general public are aware of how well paid drivers jobs are these days and there is an abundance of applications for every post, this means toc's pretty much have the pick of the bunch. I'd say if you can get on the railway in any position it will be of help, plus you'd become eligible for internal driving jobs also. You'll find most railway jobs are well paid, a carriage cleaner for example is on par earnings with retail managers ime.. HTH

I was at work in a shop yesterday and a guy wanted some help - turned out he was a driver for South West Trains. As I am very interested in working on the railways (latecomer at 43!) I asked him how easy it was to become a driver. He said it wasn't easy due to the lack of vacancies and it had taken him 5 years to become a driver.

Is this normal or did he perhaps apply when jobs were scarce - I don't know how long he has been a driver.

Also if it is going to take a while to achieve driver, I guess I would be best applying for a station based job or as a guard and then apply for driver as well.

Also does anyone here know whether freight driving jobs are easier to a) find in the first place and b)get into especially later in life.

Thanks.

 

[Beveridges]

You'll find most railway jobs are well paid, a carriage cleaner for example is on par earnings with retail managers ime.. HTH

Yes most are well paid compared to other Industries

For example, a Platform Despatcher can easily be on equal or higher pay to a pro Computer Programmer with a Masters Degree and 2 years or (much) more commercial experience.

Which job requires most skill and hard work??? No comparison!!

 

[choo~choo]

Yes most are well paid compared to other Industries

For example, a Platform Despatcher can easily be on equal or higher pay to a pro Computer Programmer with a Masters Degree and 2 years or (much) more commercial experience.

Which job requires most skill and hard work??? No comparison!!

So who's the clever one?? haha

 

[Minilad]

Yes most are well paid compared to other Industries

For example, a Platform Despatcher can easily be on equal or higher pay to a pro Computer Programmer with a Masters Degree and 2 years or (much) more commercial experience.

Which job requires most skill and hard work??? No comparison!!

Don't see many Computer Programmers wishing to swop 9-5 M-F in a nice air conditioned office for a dispatchers job though.
Skill, maybe, Hard work, debatable, But lots of safety aspects to a despatchers job that a computer programmer might not be aware of.

 

[Nym]

Think I'm the only 'computer programmer' (I use inverted commas since I'm not actually a programmer, I just need to do a lot of programming for my engineering work) that appreciates safety critical aspects of working on railways, transport etc. Still, that's thanks to working in things other than programming.

 

[rriley27]

Yes it is no problem...I swap for lates myself with another driver who likes earlies.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


No.Not at all.You would be trained for such duties.

I think it depends on the TOC
But I think a lot of them want experience in a safety critical post - if you want to drive the trains, that is.
It should be stated on the job description.
That is what train driving is all about - safety.

 

[Beveridges]

Yes, I think its impossible to get a Drivers role without previous experience of a something that involves safety

 

[notadriver]

Yes, I think its impossible to get a Drivers role without previous experience of a something that involves safety

One guy on my course used to work on a bank, the other was a postman!

 

[Beveridges]

One guy on my course used to work on a bank, the other was a postman!

The safety experience could come from driving the van? One thing or sure, the Structured Interview at the Assessment Centre would be exceptionally difficult, impossible even, without any safety experience.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Yes it is no problem...I swap for lates myself with another driver who likes earlies

How does swapping work when all the shifts are different lengths? Don't the shifts vary between 5 and 12 hours on the mainline?
How for example how can you swap a 7 hour early to work an 8 hour late? Does the person who swaps for the longer shift get paid for the original 7 hours instead of the 8?

 

[TDK]

One guy on my course used to work on a bank, the other was a postman!

On the course I took many years ago, one was an actor, another a bus driver, another a pathologist, another an ex copper, another was actually unemployed, and the most unusual was a manager from a supermarket!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

How does swapping work when all the shifts are different lengths? Don't the shifts vary between 5 and 12 hours on the mainline?
How for example how can you swap a 7 hour early to work an 8 hour late? Does the person who swaps for the longer shift get paid for the original 7 hours instead of the 8?

Simple answer - swap the whole shift or the week

 

[Minilad]

How does swapping work when all the shifts are different lengths? Don't the shifts vary between 5 and 12 hours on the mainline?
How for example how can you swap a 7 hour early to work an 8 hour late? Does the person who swaps for the longer shift get paid for the original 7 hours instead of the 8?

I can only talk about XC Birmingham Depot but in our case we are paid 35 hours however many hours we do. So it doesn't matter what you swop you will get 35 hours pay for the week.
The amount we actually work per week varies from 39 hrs 37 mins to 46 hrs 14 mins. Then every 5th week we get a week of free days. Over the 30 week link I am in this means the average is 34 hrs 44 mins

 

[martin2345uk]

Yes, I think its impossible to get a Drivers role without previous experience of a something that involves safety

Eek! Do you think being a Fire Marshall in the office would be any good?? :-/

 

[387star]

I think it depends on how you talk through your experiences don't forget non job related experiences too

 

[stevemancs]

hi mike

are you still offering the advice and guidance ?

steve in manchester

 

[TDK]

Yes, I think its impossible to get a Drivers role without previous experience of a something that involves safety

Only if you are not deemed as a good candidate - how many times have you tried Beveridges? I cannot see how you can give advice to be honest and some people on here may be put off by comments like that, I tend to belive this is a sour grapes statement - I am a train driver and never had any previous experience or anything that involved safety and I was employed externally so there is a chance if you have the correct and wanted qualities.

 

[tbeagle]

Hi

I would like to know where I can find the barden tests to practice?

Any help?

Thank you
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Hi Guys,

I've just recently qualified as a driver for National Express East Coast at Leeds.

I was an internal applicant but I will pass on my experience.

First there was the interview. 300 applicants down to 30 to be interviewed. It is important on the application form as well as the interview to talk about professionalism, your reliability but even more importantly they want to hear about how importantly you take communication and safety. You must be able to show you have done some research. Tell them where their driver's depots are, their train depots, which routes they travel over.

There were 2 positions and they only sent us 2 for the pyschometric testing, whereas usually they send half a dozen because the pass rate is about 25%.

At the testing you will do a short term memory test. You get a passage of text to read for about 5 minutes and then have to answer as many multiple choice questions as you can in the time given. You can make notes whilst you read the text and I cant stress enough I much this will help you.

You will then have to do the concentration test, which is also known as the barden test. It is pages of groups shapes made up of 3, 4 or 5 dots. The idea is to put a mark through each of the 4 dot shapes and do as many as possible. This is difficult but photocopy loads and loads of pages before you go and just do them over and over again.

There is then the co-ordination test on a computer. There is a monitor with a special keyboard which has 4 coloured buttons on. You also have 2 foot pedals and ear phones on. Basically the idea is which ever colour flashes on to the screen you press the corresponding button. When ever you get a buzz in your left ear your press down the left foot pedal etc. This should be fine if you are used to using a playstation etc.

Then there is the mechanics test. This is basically a physics test. You'll get diagrams and questions like if pulley A is turned clockwise which way will pulley C turn. Buy Physics for dummies. This was a great help to me.

Anyway, pass all that and you are in! Then the hard work starts.

Hope this helps. I was thinking of operating some sort of seminar for people that are looking to get in to train driving and want to know what is involved. I'd provide examples used in the psychometric testing and interview techniques etc. Do you think anybody would be interested in attending such a thing?

Anyway, bye for now.

Mike

Hi

I would like to know how I can find the barden tests.

Any help?

Thanks

 

[LCC106]

Search Group Bourdon on the Jobs and Careers forums and you'll find the link in that thread to download - as well as hopefully some further useful information.

 

[tbeagle]

Scott: Things will have changed a bit since I retired just over 2 years ago but there is still the age limit, which I believe is 21. I was 22 when I started on the railway I had to wait 11 years for my driving job, starting off as an engine cleaner then upgrade to Fireman and eventually to driver. Infact, if I hadn't moved depot once again it would have been 17 years before I would have got my driving job automatically via seniority.

Much depends on what type of train driver you wish to be. We didn't have that problem as we covered all types of train under B.R. but today you will either join a passenger or a freight company. Again, age comes into it therefore you are going to have to wait a while before you even get to the first stage.

In the meantime you could start work outside the railways until you come of age or you could possibly start on the freight side with the inital grade that allows you to move up to a trainman. Trainman, is a good place to strat as you not only learn about the running and shunting side of train work but wiil also work on trains and get to know drivers and how to work together and at the same time learn about what is required for driving.

No matter what your qualifications are you will have to pass the 'computer' test. I can't remember what you call it, but you will have to be tested for speed of thought and angility etc. If you can't get through that test qualifications do not mean much. However, being smarty pants on a computer doesn't mean you have the right stuff to make a driver as there is much more to it than that. Thank goodness computers as we know them weren't around in our days as we would probably never have passed and they would lost a lot of really great drivers, guards etc. The only thing resembling a computer that we knew about was an Abacus, which we were taught maths on at school. That's arithmatic to you. However, when I was 12-13 I was a dab hand at playing with Yo-Yo's winning at marbles and completing jig-saw puzzles so that probably was as close to shoot-em-ups on the computer as you could get back then. Unless you can count playing at Cowboys & Indians in the same way! Been a keen reader was also a great help.

I hope that this gives you some idea what to expect and how difficult it is to reach the goal of becoming a driver. But don't give up. It just takes a bit of patience and determination. I worked with a Bakery company, in the cinema, theatre and a sawmill factory long before I joined the railways, proving that there is another life outside the railways to learn and gain experience from. My generation left school at 15 and without any qualifications therefore you had to push yourself and find a suitable job and gain experience to rise above the everyday type of employment and earn reasonably wages. You don't get it all from a text book or a computer. My first wage was £1.0.6d (£1.2p). If you didn't push yourself you would be stuck on that type of low wage forever. My final wage was around £34k, so didn't do so bad in the long run.

Sorry I can't help you with passenger companies as I know little about how that department start train crew these days. But a trainman would certainly be a worthwhile job to start with.

---------------------------------------------------------------

Hi

What type of questions asked at the test centre and the interview?

Thanks

----------------------------------------------------------------
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Hi

I have been shortlisted for an assessment to become a Trainee Train Driver.

What should I do to be successful?

what type of questions asked?

Please can anyone help...??


Thank you
tb

 

[Beveridges]

Only if you are not deemed as a good candidate

Yes, without my safety experience I would never have been deemed a good candidate

how many times have you tried Beveridges?

28

I cannot see how you can give advice to be honest

Had tonnes of experience of the "process" due to the amount of attempts, and although I was never successful at getting a job, I have passed all stages 3 times but got put "on hold".
In the end I gave up as the "process" was a lot of time and stress and my latest psychometric pass has expired with most TOC's. I do not want to take it yet again. I would not be giving advice out on here if I had not given up.
Besides I was successful at getting a shunter drivers job which does have a very similar process to getting a mainline driver, in fact it is exactly the same, from the psycho tests to the medical.

I am a train driver and never had any previous experience or anything that involved safety and I was employed externally so there is a chance if you have the correct and wanted qualities.

How did you manage to possibly get past the Structured Interview part of the Psychometric Assessment then? Many of the questions were related to safety experience

 

[rriley27]

Only if you are not deemed as a good candidate - how many times have you tried Beveridges? I cannot see how you can give advice to be honest and some people on here may be put off by comments like that, I tend to belive this is a sour grapes statement - I am a train driver and never had any previous experience or anything that involved safety and I was employed externally so there is a chance if you have the correct and wanted qualities.

I agree.
I contacted FirstGroup Resourcing. They said that you don't previous experience in safety role - so I take back my earlier comment.
We really shouldn't make comments about things we know nothing about. We should have the facts first.

 

[TDK]

How did you manage to possibly get past the Structured Interview part of the Psychometric Assessment then? Many of the questions were related to safety experience

The questions are related to safety - not necessarily experience, I answered the questions as I would have acted in the scenarios given, the only safety I had was from building sutes hardly an example to compare to the railway. I used common sence and answered the questions and flew through all the stages, got 100% on rules, 100% on traction and passed out fully qualifies after my 350 hours with a DI - so therefore the interviewer got it right with the descision to employ me - as I said it the qualities and attitude of the person that will get you through not necessarily what you read on here as advice I suppose either you have it or you don't
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Yes, without my safety experience I would never have been deemed a good candidate

Incorrect, don't forget beveridges I have interviewed many candidtaes for a drivers job and that comment is totally incorrect

 

[notadriver]

You needed 350 hours? The usual minimum is 225 although most have more than that by the time they do their finals.

 

[martin2345uk]

The questions are related to safety - not necessarily experience, I answered the questions as I would have acted in the scenarios given, the only safety I had was from building sutes hardly an example to compare to the railway. I used common sence and answered the questions and flew through all the stages, got 100% on rules, 100% on traction and passed out fully qualifies after my 350 hours with a DI - so therefore the interviewer got it right with the descision to employ me - as I said it the qualities and attitude of the person that will get you through not necessarily what you read on here as advice I suppose either you have it or you don't
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


Incorrect, don't forget beveridges I have interviewed many candidtaes for a drivers job and that comment is totally incorrect

This kind of post is really encouraging... It can be very dispiriting to come on here and read various posts about how people with no safety experience don't have a chance etc... makes you feel there's no point trying, so very nice to know that there is

 

[choo~choo]

The questions are related to safety - not necessarily experience, I answered the questions as I would have acted in the scenarios given,

Incorrect TDK, the structured interview questions are about experiences you HAVE had not how you would act in fictional scenario's.

If you have, as you say, interviewed many candidates for driving positions you'd surely know this???

 

[ralphchadkirk]

The vast majority of scenario based questions will be what do you think you would have done. There's no point asking what you did as they haven't got the job yet and thus won't know what they did!


Sent from my iPhone 4 using Tapatalk

 

[LCC106]

Theoretical answers are worth very little. If someone can demonstrate what they HAVE done in a situation, rather than what they WOULD do, then as long as there is SOME relevance there that is much more appealing to a recruiter than hypothesis. Additionally, if they can explain what went well / what they might do differently next time, this demonstrates reflection and learning. I would be EXTREMELY concerned if a TOC preferred scenario based answers to real life examples!

ON EDIT: ... Me again, unless I have misinterpreted - in which case, apologies... I suppose that in cases directly related to the railway you could ask, for example, "Tell us about a time when a vehicle you were on derailed. What was the situation? What action did you take? What was the result?" In such circumstances then yes, an addition of "If this hasn't happened to you, tell us what action you THINK you would take" would be relevant.

Thank crunchie it's Friday feeling Sorry

 

[TDK]

You needed 350 hours? The usual minimum is 225 although most have more than that by the time they do their finals.

225 on sliding door stock and 125 on slam door stock on southern, totally different trains so that's why it was done this way
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Incorrect TDK, the structured interview questions are about experiences you HAVE had not how you would act in fictional scenario's.

If you have, as you say, interviewed many candidates for driving positions you'd surely know this???

The interviews I took, not the structured interviews these are done by HR, than managers interviews I am referring to are totally different from structured interviews that are normally done after the managers interviews, sorry to mislead you! And Choo Choo what I say is fact, it has happened, so the word if is in my opinion being accused of bending the truth! You enthusisats carry on with your banter and chatting amoungst yourselves and if you so wish just ignore the people on here who have passed the tests, become drivers, become driver managers and interviewd candidates, makes not difference to me!