westcoaster
Established Member
GBRF have just said that 59003 is homeward bound coming back through the tunnel around the 6th of September, anyone got any further info.
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59003 coming home (UK bound)
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Jordy
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It has been purchased by GBRf yes, I believe some modifications need to be made when it arrives back and then presumably it will enter service with them!
Monty
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Strange they have just purchased the one locomotive, I wonder if more will follow if GBRf are happy with it's performance?
Boothby97
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sprinterguy
Veteran Member
There was only the one class 59 that was sent over to Germany anyway, although it does now operate alongside a few more recent "Euro 66s".
I don't think there are any of the older class 59 design that aren't already spoken for.
I cant see DBS selling any of theirs and I dont think any Euro spec 59s exist (unlike the 66s built for Europe) so it is likely to remain a one off in the GBRF fleet for quite some time.
More like 60s if I am right (can pull heavier loads).
Similar bodyshell (the 66 reuses the 59 design) but the internals of the 59 are designed for heavy heavy haulage whereas the 66 is designed as a bit of an allrounder.
The 59s were built up to a standard and the 66s were built down to a price.
sprinterguy
Veteran Member
Although that is where the similarity ends. The class 59 is the forerunner to the class 66 (with all the points noted by 455driver above), while the class 60 is, of course, a Brush design that had the class 59 as a competitor during the tendering process.
The Planner
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We have been known to time some of the Somerset stone traffic at 4400 tonnes plus with a 59 at the front.
hairyhandedfool
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The other 14 class 59s are still in use with other operators in the UK.
Or Mendip Rail / Aggregate Industries selling any of theirs either (if the 59/0 & 59/1s) are still owned by them unless a replacement is sought?
I'd be surprised if it doesn't receive a heavy overhaul and possible replacement EMD 12-645 Engine before it enters full time service with GBRf, given it's 10 + Years jobs out in Germany hauling heavy freights with Heavy Haul International - the last photos of it had it looking rather tired in Cottbus and on accommodation bogies.
Monty
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Doh, for some reason I thought they had purchased a Class 58! 
That would be a 16-645E, not a V12 the Class 59 is a SD40-2 with a narrow body on top and the dynamic brakes removed.
The Class 66 uses a 12-710G engine package, which is more fuel efficient than a 16-645 while still allowing for a similar amount of power. The only downside with the 12-710 is that the early production runs were not as reliable as either the 16-645 or the 16-710 used on heavy freight locos like the SD60 and SD70 series largely thanks to the engine being underdeveloped due to the lack of domestic demand for new locos in the 3000hp range when the SD40-2 fleet was only just on 20 years old.
cj_1985
Member
Since everything i have read suggests that all the 59s share the same gear ratio, TMs etc. So could 003 be fitted with yaw dampers or whatever the /2s have that their older 'sisters' lack.
That would seem to make more sense than taking on another GM with a lower top speed, that would be harder to replace on a specific flow.
Unless (as i have said on other forums) 003 was purchased with the intention of leasing it to AI or Hanson in its current specification.
And no i don't want to start up another top speed/gear ratio bitch fest like we seem to have about class 60s every few months. Just a genuine curiosity
That would seem to make more sense than taking on another GM with a lower top speed, that would be harder to replace on a specific flow.
Unless (as i have said on other forums) 003 was purchased with the intention of leasing it to AI or Hanson in its current specification.
And no i don't want to start up another top speed/gear ratio bitch fest like we seem to have about class 60s every few months. Just a genuine curiosity
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Because we all know they have done 200mph while on test dont we!
Sorry I couldnt resist!
I have never understood why the /2s can do 75mph but the /0s and /1s are only 60mph. What is the max speed of the stone hoppers when empty?
Why?
The 59 is a much stronger loco and can pull a lot more than a wheezing 66 could ever manage.
Because we all know they have done 200mph while on test dont we!
Sorry I couldnt resist!
I have never understood why the /2s can do 75mph but the /0s and /1s are only 60mph. What is the max speed of the stone hoppers when empty?
Pretty much 60 with empty boxes, brakes are utter ****e on JNA's and KEA's
Suraggu
Member
Because we all know they have done 200mph while on test dont we!
Sorry I couldnt resist!
I have never understood why the /2s can do 75mph but the /0s and /1s are only 60mph. What is the max speed of the stone hoppers when empty?
Its just what National Power who ordered the 59/2's wanted for its business. A lot of empty coal trains run as a class 4.
Some of the Mendip trains are class 7 (45 mph max) depending on wagons and load.
Just had a look at RTT for Reading and even the empties run as class 7, that is not good, I thought they would have been at least class 6.
Hmmm whenever I've driven empty boxes they've been run as class 6, but this is dependent on the brake force available.
WestCountry
Member
DBS already operate some 59s, so they wouldn't have the spares/training/experience problems of operating a one-off loco. Those could easily outweigh the slight advantages of a 59, especially since with a 60mph max speed it would have to be kept off GBRf's core coal circuits.
59003 has been sought by GBRF who dont operate any other 59s.
WestCountry
Member
Exactly. Your post that I responded to asked why GBRf might want to swap it for a DBS 66.
It's non-standard for GBRf, so if they can do it up and swap it for a 66 they keep their standard fleet and DBS have 59s already.
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I don't see that happening somehow, why would DBS do a favour for one of its main competitors. Besides GBRf 66's are maintained by EMD who already have the knowledge of maintaining such a loco.
In addition the 59 is more powerful which could come in handy on some jobs where you only operate as class 6 anyway hence max 60mph is not an issue.
Slap some yaw dampers on it and a few software mods (plus the paperwork of course) and it is good for 75mph.
That sounds plausible *I believe I read on here that GBRf already have form for making unorthodox moves (buying Series 66 locos from European operators) to get hold of new Class 66 locos.
Progress Rail (which took over EMD in 2010) have rebuilt a number of SD40-2 locomotives into the Tier 4 compliant PR30C. These rebuilds use a Caterpillar four-stroke V16 engine that offers roughly the same amount of power as the 16-645E taken out of the SD40-2, and therefore also roughly the same amount as the 12-710 G in the Class 66. I wonder if that Cat engine could be fitted into the existing UK body shell Progress has for the Class 66 builds, or if it's too large then maybe a V12 version could be used with an AC traction package?
If the deal offered by GBRf was the 59 + ££££££ in exchange for a 66, it would be in the interests of DB to accept the deal. This is the business world, everyone has their price.
Only by 300hp, an insignificant amount that's well inside the margin of variability due to environmental factors and maintenance condition. An engine with a nominal rating of 3300hp could very well be producing less power than a more recently maintained 3000hp.
Where a Class 59 would be significantly different is in the higher tractive effort offered by the shorter gearing.
Fair enough, anyway to dispel all the rumours the GBRf facebook page states they intend for it to keep its tops number of 59003 and current nameplates, with full repaint into GBRf livery. Don't think it's going to DBS anytime soon then!
Soon to arrive into the UK on the 6th of September. And it'll be nice to see it as you say retain it's name and numberplates too - Nice one GBRf!
https://www.facebook.com/GBRailfreight/posts/683823668367243
https://www.facebook.com/GBRailfreight/posts/683823668367243
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