2014 fares release delay - increase cut to RPI

[CyrusWuff]

Current estimate is that it could be as late as 27th December before the TOCs have repriced all their flows and got them into the fares data feed.

 

[andrewkeith5]

TOCs had budgeted for an increase of RPI+1% on regulated fares, in line with government policy so yesterday’s announcement means a dip in income.

So where is the money to come from?

Unlikely that shareholders or directors will take a haircut, even less likely that Government will make good the difference by increasing subsidy. So let’s look forward to cuts in services and/or front line staff and a whopping great fare increase once the General Election is out of the way in 2015!

Or, if they were sensible businesspeople, some very good marketing campaigns and offers to get more people on board - reduce the price to the point where enough extra people will use the service so as to increase profit back to slightly above where it was. No change (or even a slight uplift) in profit, and you have more people in your customer base to keep you going.

 

[jon0844]

FCC has extended its discount on super off peak tickets until 5th January, which means on four people on a groupsave buying Travelcards from Potters Bar pay just £4.50 each. That's not bad for unlimited travel throughout London! (And the price isn't exactly bad if you're just buying one with a railcard, or indeed one without any railcard at all).

I wonder if FCC has seen a big uplift in travel (it's hard to tell as their trains are usually pretty busy on weekends anyway).

 

[radamfi]

FCC has extended its discount on super off peak tickets until 5th January, which means on four people on a groupsave buying Travelcards from Potters Bar pay just £4.50 each. That's not bad for unlimited travel throughout London! (And the price isn't exactly bad if you're just buying one with a railcard, or indeed one without any railcard at all).

I wonder if FCC has seen a big uplift in travel (it's hard to tell as their trains are usually pretty busy on weekends anyway).

FCC offer the same price from Three Bridges, which is more than twice as far from central London as Potters Bar. Although you are restricted to FCC trains only between Three Bridges and the Travelcard boundary.

They are increasing their Bedford to Three Bridges frequency to every 15 minutes on Sundays, to match their frequency on the other 6 days of the week.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

TOCs had budgeted for an increase of RPI+1% on regulated fares, in line with government policy so yesterday’s announcement means a dip in income.
So where is the money to come from?
Unlikely that shareholders or directors will take a haircut, even less likely that Government will make good the difference by increasing subsidy. So let’s look forward to cuts in services and/or front line staff and a whopping great fare increase once the General Election is out of the way in 2015!

The income from fare rises mainly goes to DfT, so they would take less from the TOCs (which means less money for other things).
There are some different local policies (eg Merseyrail, Southeastern) which haven't been clarified yet.
Scotland and Wales haven't yet declared their policies for Scotrail and ATW either.

 

[OwlMan]

The new fares are going to be released on 23rd December - until that date all fares are at theold price.

Fares to be charged when issuing tickets in advance of the 2 January 2014 Fares Change Date (NFM17)

As a result of the late changes to fares regulation, the normal rules about which prices to be charged in advance of a fare change (as shown on the 'Fares Retailing Information > Issuing tickets in advance' page) have been amended as follows:

• Fares sold before 23 December 2013 - outward travel date before 02 January 2014 - current price

• Fares sold before 23 December 2013 - outward travel date on or after 02 January 2014 - current price

• Fares sold on or after 23 December 2013 - outward travel date before 02 January 2014 – current price

• Fares sold on or after 23 December 2013 - outward travel date on or after 02 January 2014 – new price

Season Tickets may be issued in advance according to the rules shown in The Manual, or in accordance to authorised local instructions where these differ.

Advance fares may continue to be sold at the price quoted for the date and time of travel at time of booking.

If you have any queries please contact your line manager or contact ticketchanges@atoc.org.

 

[pauldavies83]

So, does this make January 1st the last date your able to buy an annual season ticket at the current price?

My current season ticket expires on December 30th

 

[bb21]

So, does this make January 1st the last date your able to buy an annual season ticket at the current price?

My current season ticket expires on December 30th

Yes, if bought to start the same day.

 

[MikeWh]

Looks like the TfL (and Oyster) changes have been postponed to January 19th. See the Mayoral Decision on the Assembly website.

 

[Biggus Tiggus]

Looks like the TfL (and Oyster) changes have been postponed to January 19th. See the Mayoral Decision on the Assembly website.

ATOC have followed suit for their London area changes. Briefing came out this morning.

New fares are currently expected to be available from 10th January.

 

[Goatboy]

New fares are currently expected to be available from 10th January.

Just for London? Is the rest of the UK still scheduled for 23rd December?

 

[CyrusWuff]

Just for London? Is the rest of the UK still scheduled for 23rd December?

Updated info from The Manual:

2014 London Area Fares Changes postponed until 19 January 2014

Please note that fares wholly within the London Zonal Area (Zones 1-9) will continue at 2013 fare levels until 18 January 2014. This includes Travelcards, Pay as you go, cash Singles and Returns and point-to-point Seasons.

From 27 December 2013, TIS and Journey Planners will again be showing the correct 2013 fares for the period 2-18 January. The new fares for travel on or after 19 January will be shown from 10 January 2014.

Item submitted by ATOC
20 December 2013

The previous details relating to the implementation of the new fares elsewhere in the country for journeys from 2nd January remain the same.

 

[Edvid]

2014 fares for journeys not within London have now been uploaded.

 

[northwichcat]

For Northern Rail set fares outside PTE areas it seems to generally be a 10p increase for fares currently under £5, a 20p increase for fares over £5 and under £10, a 30p increase for fares over £10 and under £15 and so on.

 

[craigwilson]

Nice to see that the season ticket anomaly I made great use of when I lived down south is still there!

 

[Goatboy]

Most of the XC journeys I've checked so far have increased by what appears to be around 3.6%. How have they done this, have they found a bunch of flows nobody uses and left them alone so they can pull the average down?

Temple Meads to Manchester up 3.6%
Temple Meads to Birmingham up 3.6%
Birmingham to York up 3.6%

 

[island]

Possibly a stupid question but are you checking the regulated fare? For most of those I expect it would be the off-peak return. They can change anytime returns or other fares by whatever amount they want.

 

[Goatboy]

Those are Offpeak Returns I'm checking.

 

[TUC]

The rail travel booking system at work had the following message on the home screen today: 'for London travelcard bookings made between 23-26 December for travel 2-18 January, incorrect prices ave been loaded onto the national fares database. Correct fares will not be on sale until 27 December. Please delay booking where possible'.

Anyone know what the problem is? Could it be that the RPI change has been incorrectly reflected in Travelcard prices?

 

[CyrusWuff]

Anyone know what the problem is? Could it be that the RPI change has been incorrectly reflected in Travelcard prices?

The problem is that TfL announced the postponement of their increase too late for it to be incorporated in last week's fares database update. Similarly, there will be another period (2nd - 9th January IIRC) where fares for travel from 19th January will be incorrect due to the way the updates are done.

 

[John @ home]

there will be another period (2nd - 9th January IIRC) where fares for travel from 19th January will be incorrect due to the way the updates are done.

Interesting.

Can anyone explain "due to the way the updates are done" in a little more detail?

 

[CyrusWuff]

Interesting.

Can anyone explain "due to the way the updates are done" in a little more detail?

The fares database gets weekly updates, so the update this week will revert London fares to the 2013 rates, with a further update in the New Year (9th/10th January) to put the correct 2014 fares in.