I could use your advice, technically valid ticket but ran off

[srg]

As I understand it, the OP didn't give their correct address. They might want to think about correcting this to prevent the train company potentially progressing things without their knowledge

 

[Bletchleyite]

Yeah sorry inward = return. (was assuming it was just the opposite of outward)

He took both of my tickets, the outward and the return. He just pocketed them and walked off, I personally think he was hoping I would buy a ticket or something dodgy on the train and then Id be caught with those invalid tickets, an easy writing up.

So did you have any tickets in your possession when you were met with inspectors after leaving the train? If not, what they will be writing you up for isn't the misuse of the original ticket, but rather not having a ticket.

This is getting quite complex!

 

[Haywain]

My understanding is they have to catch you in person to prove that is was me?

You have come here to ask for help but you apper to be playing games with us. You cannot seriously be asking us to believe that you have only ever done this once.

 

[waterpoo]

So did you have any tickets in your possession when you were met with inspectors after leaving the train? If not, what they will be writing you up for isn't the misuse of the original ticket, but rather not having a ticket.

This is getting quite complex!

This is what I was worried about! I was so confused he just took my tickets and walked off down the train, he didnt ask for my details or anything. I had to follow him down the train to stop him literally just leaving me with no ticket, when we got to waterloo I got off with him and we met the SWR fare people and I explained he had my tickets. They wouldnt let me touch my tickets at all. it was really stressful and I did nearly have a complete meltdown so i was not thinking straight when I ran away

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 28 Aug 2026 ==

You have come here to ask for help but you apper to be playing games with us. You cannot seriously be asking us to believe that you have only ever done this once.

I'm simply making a point I have seen you make on other threads that it depends on whether you have been stopped in person?

 

[AlterEgo]

My understanding is they have to catch you in person to prove that is was me? Wont be long until AI is used to do CCTV facial recognition though I'm sure

For a criminal case yes. Civil, no, just balance of probabilities.

Have you got all your other coach tickets from all the other times you bought your tickets on Trainline (which doesn't charge £9 in fees)?

If they checked the trainline, they would see Id bought the same return before, but I have in front of me right now the unused outward portions (london to farnborough) of those tickets, showing I did not use them to get home.

That doesn't show they're unused.

To the train company, I would say it was a mistake and i accidentally bought the tickets the wrong way round, and since they cant be refunded anymore, I thought it was legal to use them to travel on the inward journey, then making my way back through other means. It was a silly mistake to make yes, but not a criminal one. and not one to defraud the railway. If they ruled guilty, i guess i would just pay them, it would be under 100£ ive calculated.

Please do not tell even more lies. This is going to go very badly for you if you do, because they have your details from Trainline and you already told them lies about where you live when you were stopped. This is in and of itself a criminal offence. Stop telling lies and stop thinking of strategies of how you can tell more.

 

[SuspectUsual]

when we got to waterloo I got off with him and we met the SWR fare people and I explained he had my tickets. They wouldnt let me touch my tickets at all. it was really stressful and I did nearly have a complete meltdown so i was not thinking straight when I ran away

How did you get through the barriers if they had your tickets?

 

[BazingaTribe]

yeah I'd really have to research into civil cases. Bare in mind they have no proof of me doing that several times.

Guess it really just depends, civil is highly preferable to criminal so that's something. It would set a precedent too with the return ticket order debate, so thats fun.

Not necessarily. Precedents aren't always set by decisions in lower courts, only in higher ones.

There's a hierarchy here:

https://www.lawteacher.net/law-help/essay/precedent-in-the-english-legal-system.php (article on precedent on a law study website)

but if you're subject to a small claim like this one you're unlikely to get it to the point where it sets case law. And it might do the opposite if the judge decides in favour of the railway company.

 

[dosxuk]

If they checked the trainline, they would see Id bought the same return before, but I have in front of me right now the unused outward portions (london to farnborough) of those tickets, showing I did not use them to get home.

Simply holding a ticket is not proof that it hasn't been used. Have any of these tickets ever been scanned by staff or gates?

If they can identify your purchasing account from the details they did capture during this incident, you should assume they know exactly when and how all tickets you have ever purchased have been used, and can bring those records to court.

 

[gembercannelle]

Please do not tell even more lies. This is going to go very badly for you if you do, because they have your details from Trainline and you already told them lies about where you live when you were stopped. This is in and of itself a criminal offence. Stop telling lies and stop thinking of strategies of how you can tell more.

The tickets bought from the ticket machine at Farnborough will not lead to any trainline account. If the OP gave wrong name and address the company has no way to identify them.

 

[AlterEgo]

The tickets bought from the ticket machine at Farnborough will not lead to any trainline account. If the OP gave wrong name and address the company has no way to identify them.

Where have you seen that the tickets were bought there? They've been using Trainline. The tickets simply have to be printed, and they were done so in Farnborough.

 

[gembercannelle]

Where have you seen that the tickets were bought there? They've been using Trainline. The tickets simply have to be printed, and they were done so in Farnborough.

In the post #48. I read it as so the confiscated tickets were actually bought from the machine, with no online ticketing involved. The OP should be able to confirm, but if this is the case, they are not traceable.

 

[Haywain]

I'm simply making a point I have seen you make on other threads that it depends on whether you have been stopped in person?

You have been. And being stopped in person can lead to investigation of other matters.

 

[BazingaTribe]

Where have you seen that the tickets were bought there? They've been using Trainline. The tickets simply have to be printed, and they were done so in Farnborough.

OP said they hadn't had their phone on them so they couldn't buy online and had to buy from Farnborough, but again, with all the tangled up details it's really hard to keep track of what's actually going on.

 

[waterpoo]

In the post #48. I read it as so the confiscated tickets were actually bought from the machine, with no online ticketing involved. The OP should be able to confirm, but if this is the case, they are not traceable.

No they were just collected at a machine, it wasnt my train line account though funnily enough, so they dont even have my details from that. They just have my railcard which I guess they could use to find me

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 28 Aug 2026 ==

OP said they hadn't had their phone on them so they couldn't buy online and had to buy from Farnborough, but again, with all the tangled up details it's really hard to keep track of what's actually going on.

nah that was the coach, I did the train ticket before I left the house and then took a picture of the collection reciept to pick up at the station

 

[gembercannelle]

No they were just collected at a machine, it wasnt my train line account though funnily enough, so they dont even have my details from that. They just have my railcard which I guess they could use to find me

Have they confiscated the railcard too?

 

[AlterEgo]

OP said they hadn't had their phone on them so they couldn't buy online and had to buy from Farnborough, but again, with all the tangled up details it's really hard to keep track of what's actually going on.

Yes, elsewhere they say the company has the details of a "friend's Trainline" but they did also scan the railcard which they can get the OP's details from.

 

[waterpoo]

Have they confiscated the railcard too?

no, that was digital on an old iphone (too old to be able to use for much else but I know to always travel with a railcard so I used it just for that)

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 28 Aug 2026 ==

Yes, elsewhere they say the company has the details of a "friend's Trainline" but they did also scan the railcard which they can get the OP's details from.

yeah, they have my email. But no address attached, do you know if people can be traced from it?

Edit: as in email address from my railcard account.

 

[MarlowDonkey]

I did the train ticket before I left the house and then took a picture of the collection reciept to pick up at the station

You presumably bought through a retailer then. They have your ticket, so they can work back to find out which retailer sold it and then ask for the purchase history at that retailer. If the retailer knows your email or physical address that can be revealed to investigators.

 

[waterpoo]

You have been. And being stopped in person can lead to investigation of other matters.

My understanding was they can threaten you to settle for other matters, but they can only threaten you with criminal prosecution with the actual time you were stopped.

Does it also depend on whether they correctly took details? I assume it must, else they wouldnt try and coerce you into giving them.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 28 Aug 2026 ==

You presumably bought through a retailer then. They have your ticket, so they can work back to find out which retailer sold it and then ask for the purchase history at that retailer. If the retailer knows your email or physical address that can be revealed to investigators.

yes, but it wasnt my train line account, so they would have incorrect details. And the person who's account it actually is will be able to prove they were not the person who used the ticket.

 

[AlterEgo]

no, that was digital on an old iphone (too old to be able to use for much else but I know to always travel with a railcard so I used it just for that)

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 28 Aug 2026 ==


yeah, they have my email. But no address attached, do you know if people can be traced from it?

Edit: as in email address from my railcard account.

They can trace you from the billing address on the card used to purchase.

 

[SuspectUsual]

yes, but it wasnt my train line account, so they would have incorrect details. And the person who's account it actually is will be able to prove they were not the person who used the ticket.

Is this part of your plan? Or another happy coincidence?

 

[waterpoo]

They can trace you from the billing address on the card used to purchase.

I read that this has not been proven to have happened yet. But yeah that is a possibility.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 28 Aug 2026 ==

Is this part of your plan? Or another happy coincidence?

pure coincidence!

 

[SuspectUsual]

They can trace you from the billing address on the card used to purchase.

What price the card isn’t the OPs?

 

[JBuchananGB]

It seems that the OP has a habitual round trip journey for which he travels into London from Farnborough by train, and returns to a nearby town by coach. He therefore wanted the most cost effective way of achieving the rail part of this, and his searches found the "reverse direction" return ticket at £20, but not the "right direction" anytime single at £16.65. This is an unusual travel pattern and it is not surprising that a ticket inspector decided that the use of the "return" part of the reverse direction return ticket was suspicious. The inspector confiscated both parts of the ticket, and the OP has explained what then happened at Waterloo.
As the ticket has gone, I think the OP should make sure he hangs on to the booking confirmation and the Ticket on Departure (ToD) collection reference for the ticket involved. If the TOC contacts him he has evidence of the ticket purchase. In an added twist the OP says the tickets were bought for him on a friend's Trainline account, but there's nothing wrong with that.
The return portion was valid for the trip he was taking when stopped. The outward portion would not have been valid to get home, but he didn't use it, and has not used the outward portions on previous occasions when he travelled into London on the return portion of tickets.
In the future he can save money buy buying the cheaper Anytime Single which I pointed out to him earlier.

 

[Bletchleyite]

My understanding was they can threaten you to settle for other matters, but they can only threaten you with criminal prosecution with the actual time you were stopped.

That's not right. A Penalty Fare can only be issued for the actual case taking place when you are stopped (but wasn't in this case), but a prosecution can be progressed for any criminal matter for which there is adequate evidence regardless of how or when it is discovered, subject in some cases (but not all) to some timescale limits which won't be relevant here.

 

[waterpoo]

That's not right. A Penalty Fare can only be issued for the actual case taking place when you are stopped (but wasn't in this case), but a prosecution can be progressed for any criminal matter for which there is adequate evidence regardless of how or when it is discovered, subject in some cases (but not all) to some timescale limits which won't be relevant here.

Fair enough, at least with criminal convictions the burden of proof is very much on the prosecutors. I was never abusive or rude, so Im sure those kind of cases take priority. If they want to try and convict me over technicalities, I dont have much to live for so I'm happy to have my Mike Ross moment in court for the fun of it.

 

[FenMan]

Speaking as a local, the only regular coach service from anywhere near London to anywhere near Farnborough is Flightline 730 which runs hourly-ish between Heathrow and Camberley/Frimley. The latter being a short walk to Farnborough.

 

[waterpoo]

It seems that the OP has a habitual round trip journey for which he travels into London from Farnborough by train, and returns to a nearby town by coach. He therefore wanted the most cost effective way of achieving the rail part of this, and his searches found the "reverse direction" return ticket at £20, but not the "right direction" anytime single at £16.65. This is an unusual travel pattern and it is not surprising that a ticket inspector decided that the use of the "return" part of the reverse direction return ticket was suspicious. The inspector confiscated both parts of the ticket, and the OP has explained what then happened at Waterloo.
As the ticket has gone, I think the OP should make sure he hangs on to the booking confirmation and the Ticket on Departure (ToD) collection reference for the ticket involved. If the TOC contacts him he has evidence of the ticket purchase. In an added twist the OP says the tickets were bought for him on a friend's Trainline account, but there's nothing wrong with that.
The return portion was valid for the trip he was taking when stopped. The outward portion would not have been valid to get home, but he didn't use it, and has not used the outward portions on previous occasions when he travelled into London on the return portion of tickets.
In the future he can save money buy buying the cheaper Anytime Single which I pointed out to him earlier.

Thanks.

Yeah that ticket site is really useful. I dont think I will use the trains anymore, even when I do pay for the full over-priced ticket (it has doubled and then tripled in price since I was 18) my ticket never works at the barrier and they talk to me like im a criminal as i find my railcard, while letting other more official people throguh without even asking for their railcards. its just not worth it, doing the right thing, doing the legal loophole grey area thing.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Fair enough, at least with criminal convictions the burden of proof is very much on the prosecutors. I was never abusive or rude, so Im sure those kind of cases take priority. If they want to try and convict me over technicalities, I dont have much to live for so I'm happy to have my Mike Ross moment in court for the fun of it.

If you really feel like that please do seek help about your mental health. It's sad to read that someone "doesnt' have much to live for" and things can be better. If you don't know who to turn to give the Samaritans a call.

It is in your interest to resolve this as smoothly as possible.

 

[waterpoo]

Speaking as a local, the only regular coach service from anywhere near London to anywhere near Farnborough is Flightline 730 which runs hourly-ish between Heathrow and Camberley/Frimley. The latter being a short walk to Farnborough.

its exhausting at this point.

Say for instance I have a sister who works in basingstoke and drives home. imagine I get the coach to basingstoke and then drive home with her. is that ok? is that allowed? Does railuk forum say thats ok to do? oh thanks so much